Indeed.ACman said:
I'm still trying to figure out how a country gets 10 trillion dollars in debt.
It's fucking mind boggling how much money that is.
Poll: A threat to American Hegemony?
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I'm still trying to figure out how a country gets 10 trillion dollars in debt.
It's fucking mind boggling how much money that is.
Privatisation will always cripple a country, especially when they find a loophole through rewording bribery (Lobbying)
Well, America's in relative decline in that it's economy is slowly growing but many other countries like China, Brazil and India etc are fast catching up and China's likely to overtake in a few decades.
So in some way's America's decline is going to be like Britain's. Living standards will continue to increase, people are still going to work in relative safety and Hollywood will still make it's blockbusters. The main thing that America will have to mentally adjust to is not being the worlds sole-superpower. America won't have unquestioned military superiority of China continues to ramp up military spending, America won't be the first place where the worlds foremost intellectuals will go nor will America be at the very forefront of scientific research.
But given it's large population America won't shrink into the middle-power league like Britain has. America will be either joint superpower or second superpower to China for most of this century. I'd be surprised if Americas's not in the top 3 world powers by the end of this century. Assuming some sort of disaster, political, civil or environmental, devastates America.
In all likelihood, America will in the next few decades have it's own "Suez Crisis".[footnote] In British history, the Suez Crisis, occurring in 1952 i think, is when Britain and France conspired to create a war between Isreal and Egypt that would allow the UK and France to step in as "peacekeepers" to re-take control of the Suez Canal which had been nationaised by Egypt. The USA disapproved of this and threatened to call in the debt that Britain owed the US, forcing an embarrassed Franco-British withdraw. The point of this is that it brought to everyone's attention that Britain was no longer a major power.[/footnote]Perhaps the USA will perform a military intervention in South America one day and China, disapproving of this, threatens to call in it's debts and America's forced to withdraw. Or maybe it will be something more symbolic like China beating the US into putting a man on Mars. It may be something like that, a few political embarrassments for America, that will lead mean the country will have to come to terms with no longer being the sole superpower of the world.
Still, i don't think anything drastic will happen, and America will continue to be a major world power, just not the sole world superpower.
So in some way's America's decline is going to be like Britain's. Living standards will continue to increase, people are still going to work in relative safety and Hollywood will still make it's blockbusters. The main thing that America will have to mentally adjust to is not being the worlds sole-superpower. America won't have unquestioned military superiority of China continues to ramp up military spending, America won't be the first place where the worlds foremost intellectuals will go nor will America be at the very forefront of scientific research.
But given it's large population America won't shrink into the middle-power league like Britain has. America will be either joint superpower or second superpower to China for most of this century. I'd be surprised if Americas's not in the top 3 world powers by the end of this century. Assuming some sort of disaster, political, civil or environmental, devastates America.
In all likelihood, America will in the next few decades have it's own "Suez Crisis".[footnote] In British history, the Suez Crisis, occurring in 1952 i think, is when Britain and France conspired to create a war between Isreal and Egypt that would allow the UK and France to step in as "peacekeepers" to re-take control of the Suez Canal which had been nationaised by Egypt. The USA disapproved of this and threatened to call in the debt that Britain owed the US, forcing an embarrassed Franco-British withdraw. The point of this is that it brought to everyone's attention that Britain was no longer a major power.[/footnote]Perhaps the USA will perform a military intervention in South America one day and China, disapproving of this, threatens to call in it's debts and America's forced to withdraw. Or maybe it will be something more symbolic like China beating the US into putting a man on Mars. It may be something like that, a few political embarrassments for America, that will lead mean the country will have to come to terms with no longer being the sole superpower of the world.
Still, i don't think anything drastic will happen, and America will continue to be a major world power, just not the sole world superpower.
I'm very optimistic about this. America won't collapse, as has been said, it will just cease to have quite the dominance and relevance across the world. There's no colonies to pull out of and economies / politics to threaten (e.g. the state of affairs at the end of the age of empire).Kalezian said:
I think a multipolar world will be beneficial. Although I am the kind of person who eventually wants a World Government (and if anyone says the UN is already that then I will scream...).
America's economy seems to be in shambles from a laymans point of view and will most likely stay like that until you sort out the mess that is your political system of having two elected houses that both swing back and forth in terms of who controls them. The American president (dem or rep) steps forward and says I want to do this and the other house (who from what I have seen thus far) immediately says no because they are from the other party. I understand the point of having two houses of debate to act as a check and balance but when both are so politically dominated it becomes a mess and just stagnates the country.
Take a look at the British system which although ain't a shining beacon is still imo much better then the American system because although the House of lords ain't elected it actually does mean we get some form of impartial debate going that is outside of politics which is a proper check and balance and doesn't just stagnate.
Take a look at the British system which although ain't a shining beacon is still imo much better then the American system because although the House of lords ain't elected it actually does mean we get some form of impartial debate going that is outside of politics which is a proper check and balance and doesn't just stagnate.
It's not so much about the amount of debt. The amount of debt affects the balance of payments but it's not such a bad thing as long as the money was put to good use.Daystar Clarion said:
The bigger problem is that a sensible financial system would insulate speculators from lenders. In America they became mixed sectors when they should have been separate.
And the solution, apparently, is to have even less regulation and that large bank that fails should have it's company loses covered by the government.
In this situation it should be the borrowers that were covered by the government (the money will go to the banks anyway) but it appears that the priority was share holders.
In a sensible banking system the government should cover account holders only and let both share holders and borrowers accept risk.
Apparently, in the American system, shareholders have no risk, borrowers get fucked and everybody apart from financiers lose as capital dries up.
This isnt an attack in anyway im just curious. Many people here (UK) and in the states think that Israel is agrresive towards its neighbors and expands into land which it has no claim to. Then youve got the blockade youve got going on (though I dont know too much about it) and many incidents of unprovoked attacks and executions of civilians in nieghboring countries. I dont know enough about the situation to make a judgement (partially ignorance and its very difficult to find unbiased sources) and I dont know the validity of these claims. Would you be able to explain if these are true or not and if not, why do people think them and dislike your nation. I am not insinuating that you are the only ones at fault, I know that your neighbours seem to be as agressive, I am interested in what its like for an israely and how thigs seem from your perspective. So as to not clog up the forum further if it is a problem could you send a response privately?TheIronRuler said:
.ablac said:
Give me some specific questions please. We are at fault as much as our neighbors are at fault. people claiming we are torturing and killing civilians in Gaza and the west bank do so because the topic in brought into light and intensified, even while other much worse cases are ignored and thrown out because the Arab countries (And the anti-america block) has no ned for them to use. The Palestinians are suffering through this conflict and had been beaten and killed and tortured by both the Israelis and the neighboring Arab nations, see the way Jordan treated the Palestinians when they were illegally annexed to Jordan between '49 and '67.
A segment of the Israeli population wants to colonize and inhibit the west bank and throw all of the Arabs out. They believe that what was done in '49 and '67 can be done yet again. I don't support that. This is aggressive expansion, and my current government is supporting it.
The blockage on Gaza in my eyes is fully justifiable. There had been an election there followed by a civil war between the semi-militarized political entity, and also terrorist entity HAMAS and the semi-militarized entity FATAH. HAMAS is hostile towards Israel and Jews in general. In its charter it promises to kill all Jews and drive them off their lands. They routinely plan terror attacks and launch rockets from the strip and into the cities and towns around the Gaza strip. They are rumored to have missiles that can reach Tel-Aviv, Israel's largest coastal city. The blockade is to prevent from certain materials from entering. Those materials can theoretically be used to build contraptions like bombs and rockets to be used against the IDF and the citizens of Israel. For some god damned reason they are gaining legitimacy, even though they butchered their own when they fought against the FATAH for control over the Gaza strip.
Shit is complicated.
International politics is funny OP. There was some degree of doubt over who would win the Cold War. I think it is fair to say the US is in decline but I would be less confident in calling it irreversible. I tend to think we are going to go from a uni-polar system to a multi-polar one but meh.
While America has big problems so does everyone else. The Chinese have to continuously deal with the fact that they face a pretty severe demographic future while having to deal with a quite fractious country and also they have to ensure GDP growth. Those are big big problems.
Do I think America will ever be as strong in comparison to other states as it was after the end of the Cold War? No. Do I think the US is still going to be a major playor in world politics? Definitely.
While America has big problems so does everyone else. The Chinese have to continuously deal with the fact that they face a pretty severe demographic future while having to deal with a quite fractious country and also they have to ensure GDP growth. Those are big big problems.
Do I think America will ever be as strong in comparison to other states as it was after the end of the Cold War? No. Do I think the US is still going to be a major playor in world politics? Definitely.
All empires rise, experience a time of unparalleled glory, power, and influence, and then decline, usually from overexerting themselves in some way, or becoming complacent, or by resting on past glories.
History tends to repeat.
I don't feel it's my place argue social-politics, but as a man of history, I can say this:
-Consider how quickly the USA went from rag-tag nation of disparate British-American entrepreneurs to the undisputed world power. This happened in the span of time from the 1770s to the 1940s, less than 200 years.
-Also consider that in the middle of that time span the USA fought one of the bloodiest and most destructive civil wars in history.
-Also consider that most world empires built up to their high point significantly slower over the course of several centuries.
Based on all this, I would not at all be surprised if America's decline was more rapid than the decline of other world empires. It'd be unnatural if it wasn't.
History tends to repeat.
I don't feel it's my place argue social-politics, but as a man of history, I can say this:
-Consider how quickly the USA went from rag-tag nation of disparate British-American entrepreneurs to the undisputed world power. This happened in the span of time from the 1770s to the 1940s, less than 200 years.
-Also consider that in the middle of that time span the USA fought one of the bloodiest and most destructive civil wars in history.
-Also consider that most world empires built up to their high point significantly slower over the course of several centuries.
Based on all this, I would not at all be surprised if America's decline was more rapid than the decline of other world empires. It'd be unnatural if it wasn't.
Also has nothing to do with the fact that Greece hid its financial problems until after it got accepted into the EU and then almost collapsed.ACman said:
Yes, the US is in a phase of significant decline. There's no two ways about it.
Our politics are blatantly corrupt and fractured along partisan lines. No one votes on values, only ideologies.
We've eschewed a solid manufacturing base for the manufacture of large quantities of credit and currency, which one day, we'll find we cannot eat or wear.
Working for success has been replaced with praying for a handout.
Education for success is being replaced with praying for high standardized test scores.
We cannot find money for education, but we can fund endless war.
There is no thought for the future, only the here and now, and only for the profit margin.
We want everything for free, but will pay no taxes to get it.
I'm worried the revolution will come within a decade, and it will come when the majority gets tired of being pushed up against the wall for another's small slice of profit-share.
I'm not being doom 'n' gloomin' for the sake of doomsaying. The signs of the decline are everywhere. Question is, do our people honestly care enough to do anything about it before it affects their personal bottom line, the single driving force for seemingly every self-absorbed fucker around this place? We'll drown in our sense of ungrateful entitlement and me-first mentality before we collectively realize putting on the blinders and ignoring the issues won't make them go away, and neither will voting once again for the same fuckers who continually screw the people in favor of corporate thank-yous.
Our politics are blatantly corrupt and fractured along partisan lines. No one votes on values, only ideologies.
We've eschewed a solid manufacturing base for the manufacture of large quantities of credit and currency, which one day, we'll find we cannot eat or wear.
Working for success has been replaced with praying for a handout.
Education for success is being replaced with praying for high standardized test scores.
We cannot find money for education, but we can fund endless war.
There is no thought for the future, only the here and now, and only for the profit margin.
We want everything for free, but will pay no taxes to get it.
I'm worried the revolution will come within a decade, and it will come when the majority gets tired of being pushed up against the wall for another's small slice of profit-share.
I'm not being doom 'n' gloomin' for the sake of doomsaying. The signs of the decline are everywhere. Question is, do our people honestly care enough to do anything about it before it affects their personal bottom line, the single driving force for seemingly every self-absorbed fucker around this place? We'll drown in our sense of ungrateful entitlement and me-first mentality before we collectively realize putting on the blinders and ignoring the issues won't make them go away, and neither will voting once again for the same fuckers who continually screw the people in favor of corporate thank-yous.
Leon Declis said:
When Japan makes games like this about your country, it's reason enough to have state worship.
You realise that government spending makes up a huge proportion of demand in any economy and simply removing it would completely destroy the economy in question, right?lacktheknack said:
I said "deeply slash", not "destroy".Namelessjake said:
Sure, the economy would take a hit. But do you have a better suggestion for tackling the debt? All the methods I can think of boil down to "less spending".
Democracy and free market economies are both coming to an end, they were step ups from barter and kingdoms but they are failing hard now, time to move on to a resource based economy and the next evolution in politics, which i think might be a step back to restricting the vote to those intelligent enough to deserve it, or maybe adopting a method similar to the scientific method.
Its ironic , 40 years after the event the Vietnam war is still propelling the USA in its downward spiral, sure there have been other causes to , the move from production to service industries etc, But Nixon dropping the gold standard and the decision to rule by debt has been the drumbeat that drives it ever downwards.
were not talking about the end of days its just the sun is setting on the US as being a dominant economic and military strength, Frankly i think the world will be happier for it. its not like their tenure has been a good thing , weve seen the decimation of Africa, countless 3rd world countries are still crippled by the IMF and WB and the policy of free trade.
Its ironic , 40 years after the event the Vietnam war is still propelling the USA in its downward spiral, sure there have been other causes to , the move from production to service industries etc, But Nixon dropping the gold standard and the decision to rule by debt has been the drumbeat that drives it ever downwards.
were not talking about the end of days its just the sun is setting on the US as being a dominant economic and military strength, Frankly i think the world will be happier for it. its not like their tenure has been a good thing , weve seen the decimation of Africa, countless 3rd world countries are still crippled by the IMF and WB and the policy of free trade.
Yeah well, until we get a big change in China's human rights attitudes, I don't really want America declining too much, even if they sometimes don't back their talk up.deadman91 said:
Which is why Julia Gillard is a uselss ruler and manages to undermine everything that Kevin Rudd did for us as PM in relation to China-Australian relations, and she undermines his continued efforts as foreign affairs minister to keep a healthy relationship afloat.EclipseoftheDarkSun said:And we should be learning Chinese all around the world and Indonesian in AustraliaTheIronRuler said:
I cannot believe that she neglected china on her world tour, she's fucking mental.
OT: Yeah, it'll happen, I dunno if I'll be alive by then, provided Australia or GB are still decent to live in I'll be fine.
I'm pretty sure that's a parody (wo)man.Freechoice said:
Tomorrow When the War Began - John Marsdenravenshrike said: