Poll: banned from America , is this fair?

[BGH122]

Because the Bill of Rights states American citizens shall be protected by these laws, not every dipshit who comes to the US. Once those dipshits go through the process of becoming American citizens, then they're protected. Until then, watch your mouth, or you may just find the FBI jamming their foot into it.

Right, yeah. Except that the Bill of Rights includes things like the fifth and sixth amendments which, according to you, don't apply to non-US citizens so my argument still stands. If I come to American as a non-American I don't get due process or trial by jury, a cop can just walk up to me and shoot me in the face because I'm not covered by those rights.

 

[Varrdy]

I would have had more respect for America if Obama had emailed back: "Yeah? Well fuck you too, buddy!"

The guy did something rather daft but the punishment seems a little harsh. I'm heading back to the States next year. Maybe if I email Obama and tell him what a great guy he is and how much I love him, I'll be able to skip customs...

Wardy

 

[Bruin]

What happened to free speech? I believe we should have the right to call world leaders what we like.

As I understand it there were vague threats. Threats are not covered under freedom of speech. Secondly, he's not a US citizen.

exactly right, freedom of speech isnt something America assumes others have a right to only its own citizens.

That makes no sense. I'm not a lawyer so I can't argue this point on basis of facts, but how can a country hold visitors to its laws but not grant visitors its provisions?

If I go to America and murder a bunch of people they're not going to let me off since their rights and laws only apply to Americans. Similarly, they're not going to set me alight with napalm at the airport because I am granted rights even though I'm not their citizen.

It doesn't make sense to say that visitors can be held to American laws but not protected by them.

Because the Bill of Rights states American citizens shall be protected by these laws, not every dipshit who comes to the US. Once those dipshits go through the process of becoming American citizens, then they're protected. Until then, watch your mouth, or you may just find the FBI jamming their foot into it.

When you're in the U.S, you're protected by the rights offered to every human being.

We have natural rights here--rights entitled to every person in our country regardless of whether they're American or not.

When you make threats to the president and the FBI gets ahold of them, American or not, you're going to get looked at, as I said before.

 

[Sinclair Solutions]

America: the World's Largest Forum.

Are we getting all the fact's here? I highly doubt he got banned for calling Obama a prick. I have friends who do that on a daily basis. Did he ever threaten the President's life? Because...you know...that's bad and junk.

 

[Raesvelg]

Blatantly irresponsible speech (shouting "Fire!" in a theater) isn't protected, slander can get you sued, lying under oath can get you arrested, and MAKING DEATH THREATS, particularly to the President of the United States, can also land you a set of negative consequences.

Freedom of Speech is not absolute people, in ANY country.

 

[rebus_forever]

I never had this pegged as an issue of "free" speech, I had it pegged as an issue of the FBI over reacting, the idea that people can be punished for voicing an opinion wasn't even in question, if someone called me a prick and said they wanted to punch me i very much doubt I could ban them from my town, the FBI nor Obama own the USA and as far as i see the gripe was with an individual.

Still at least bush isnt still in charge or there might be a sudden revelation that the kid had wmd which would probably amount to our lap dog leaders helping the usa invade ourselves, that would've been messed up.

 

[JWW]

I swear, this country feels more and more like the USSR every day.

 

[Bruin]

I never had this pegged as an issue of "free" speech, I had it pegged as an issue of the FBI over reacting, the idea that people can be punished for voicing an opinion wasn't even in question, if someone called me a prick and said they wanted to punch me i very much doubt I could ban them from my town, the FBI nor Obama own the USA and as far as i see the gripe was with an individual.

Still at least bush isnt still in charge or there might be a sudden revelation that the kid had wmd which would probably amount to our lap dog leaders helping the usa invade ourselves, that would've been messed up.

It wasn't his opinion that got him banned, it was making threats to the president.

Do that to anybody and you'll get punished.

 

[rebus_forever]

Because the Bill of Rights states American citizens shall be protected by these laws, not every dipshit who comes to the US. Once those dipshits go through the process of becoming American citizens, then they're protected. Until then, watch your mouth, or you may just find the FBI jamming their foot into it.

Right, yeah. Except that the Bill of Rights includes things like the fifth and sixth amendments which, according to you, don't apply to non-US citizens so my argument still stands. If I come to American as a non-American I don't get due process or trial by jury, a cop can just walk up to me and shoot me in the face because I'm not covered by those rights.

i think said cop would still be obliged to follow the law, besides u are saying something cannot be because legally it makes no sense, on what basis were British cops giving a warning to a British citizen on request of the FBI, that's what id like to know legally.
laws don't have to make sense or cover all possibilities although i am sure an explanation is available,i myself was told that a citizen of a foreign state is not protected by American laws, so i assume those laws have a sense of greater importance on American soil, this is me assuming hard, id like clarification myself.

 

[Dogstile]

This could be a great anti drinking ad.

I'm glad I wasn't the only person who thought this

 

[Atmos Duality]

lol.. that's ridiculous. You have to be able to say everything.. Threats I can see.. actual threats.. slander should be constitutionally protected, as it's a civil dispute.. it's he said she said.. the government shouldn't have any say other then perhaps a judge deciding who is probably right in the civil discussion over "Am I a prick or not?"..

"Slander should be constitutionally protected".

No. Absolutely not. There are practical reasons why we ban slander. It simply creates far more trouble than it solves.
You may claim "Slippery Slope", but I think you're ignoring "Poisoning the Well".

Vulgarities? fuck that. You should be able to say anything about a president, prime minister, king, queen, el presidente, or their policies that you want, in any manner you choose to do it. They can choose to ignore you, or personally make a plea that you not act like a complete ponce, but should the government crack down on you? No. Being a Ponce isn't illegal, and if thinking obama is a prick makes you a threat to national security, there are millions of americans who think the same thing, and they may actually be within spitting distance of the president.

It's just a slippery slope.

I agree that this was an overreaction on both governments' part, but perhaps they were trying to set an example, (perhaps "make an example" is closer to the truth).

 

[rebus_forever]

I never had this pegged as an issue of "free" speech, I had it pegged as an issue of the FBI over reacting, the idea that people can be punished for voicing an opinion wasn't even in question, if someone called me a prick and said they wanted to punch me i very much doubt I could ban them from my town, the FBI nor Obama own the USA and as far as i see the gripe was with an individual.

Still at least bush isnt still in charge or there might be a sudden revelation that the kid had wmd which would probably amount to our lap dog leaders helping the usa invade ourselves, that would've been messed up.

It wasn't his opinion that got him banned, it was making threats to the president.

Do that to anybody and you'll get punished.

so when someone, a real threat to the USA decides to say down with the USA and such the FBI send a local Iranian bobby round to ask him not to do it again? i think not, they clearly understood the fact this kid posed no real threat and still decided to go postal.
if i reacted this degree of retardation when my niece play fights with me she would be in a young offenders institute, imagine playing snakes and ladders with these guys and doing a little cheat, u would be screwed.

 

[Littlee300]

Banned for calling him a prick? No.

get back to me when he threatens to kill the President, and I'll take longer to answer.

You don't fuck with leader of free world unless you got a army

 

[BGH122]

Right, yeah. Except that the Bill of Rights includes things like the fifth and sixth amendments which, according to you, don't apply to non-US citizens so my argument still stands. If I come to American as a non-American I don't get due process or trial by jury, a cop can just walk up to me and shoot me in the face because I'm not covered by those rights.

The Due process and equal protection clauses, are phrased as applying to "all persons." Therefore, they cover non-US citizens also.

The Eighth Amendment makes no such inclusion. So I could be cruelly and unusually punished?

 

[Bruin]

I never had this pegged as an issue of "free" speech, I had it pegged as an issue of the FBI over reacting, the idea that people can be punished for voicing an opinion wasn't even in question, if someone called me a prick and said they wanted to punch me i very much doubt I could ban them from my town, the FBI nor Obama own the USA and as far as i see the gripe was with an individual.

Still at least bush isnt still in charge or there might be a sudden revelation that the kid had wmd which would probably amount to our lap dog leaders helping the usa invade ourselves, that would've been messed up.

It wasn't his opinion that got him banned, it was making threats to the president.

Do that to anybody and you'll get punished.

so when someone, a real threat to the USA decides to say down with the USA and such the FBI send a local Iranian bobby round to ask him not to do it again? i think not, they clearly understood the fact this kid posed no real threat and still decided to go postal.
if i reacted this degree of retardation when my niece play fights with me she would be in a young offenders institute, imagine playing snakes and ladders with these guys and doing a little cheat, u would be screwed.

I didn't understand the first sentence.

I don't think it was a "kid". I think it was a grown man.

You don't fucking piss off the FBI. My god, you're talking about the agency that puts hits out on people as if they're folks who will always give you the benefit of the doubt.

 

[twistedmic]

i find it quite ridiculas! if this british guy got threatened and insulted by an american no one would do jack all, but if an american is threatened, OH NO Call the army! besides if this british guy had any national pride he eouldn't visit the states any ways. heck, i am canadien and i hate the usa(not specific people, just the general philosophy of the country)

If I ,an American citizen, called or e-mailed the British Prime Minister, or any part of the Royal Family, and was abusive and threatening in said e-mail I'd more than likely get in trouble. I don't know if I'd get banned from the U.K., but I doubt that I'd be free to run around London at my leisure.

 

[MikailCaboose]

They did say it had threats, right?

That's almost understandable.

Still, America has some shitty mods.

Just because they say it had threats in it doesn't mean that it did. Politicians and those immediately subservient have a nasty habit of lying every now and again.

 

[Silver Patriot]

No, but it will be a great story to tell his kids.

 

[Sacman]

well they just violated the first amendment so yeah... he should call whoever he wants a prick...

 

[bak00777]

thats stupid, i mean completely stupid, i doubt Obama read the email first, or even at all. They shouldnt ban someone from the entire fucking country, but since they did if i was that guy who sent it i would be glad to leave a country that does shit like that...FUCK OFF WHITE HOUSE!!!!

apparentyl his email was right on the money, Banning him from the country is very prickish.