Poll: CNN: Console Gaming is Dying

[Owyn_Merrilin]

The min wage in Australia is more than twice what it is in the states and it's pretty dishonest to not mention that when you are whining about game prices.

And yet, when worked out in International Dollars (based on the purchasing power of the US dollar), the average yearly US wage is around 15-20% higher than the average Aussie wage.

International dollars are cost of living adjusted dollars. You've been claiming Australians basically pay twice as much as Americans, but by your own standard, it's more like 15-20 percent more when adjusted for cost of living. Which makes a hell of a lot more sense -- trust me when I say, if it was double, gaming wouldn't be a thing in Australia.

Edit: Well, it would, but it would be a thing with the kind of people who had 3DOs and Neo Geos back in the 90's, or for a more modern example, the kind of people who have a D-Box setup in their home theater. In other words, the very wealthy. Gaming culture as it exists now wouldn't really extend to Australia if you guys had to pay twice as much, adjusted for cost of living, as we do.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

In short, Mario knows how to talk to my mom and grandma and knows which pressure points to pinch to get them to ooze mnoney.

The Wii sold by the imperial fuckton because it was priced low enough that it could be impulse purchased by non-gamers. Not many people were going to worry about the waste of money when a Wii sat gathering dust... and the Wii Fit balance board was a fucking masterstroke. Give a bunch of worried housewives a reason to use the console AND make an arseload of cash on an expensive periphal as well.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

The min wage in Australia is more than twice what it is in the states and it's pretty dishonest to not mention that when you are whining about game prices.

And yet, when worked out in International Dollars (based on the purchasing power of the US dollar), the average yearly US wage is around 15-20% higher than the average Aussie wage.

International dollars are cost of living adjusted dollars. You've been claiming Australians basically pay twice as much as Americans, but by your own standard, it's more like 15-20 percent more when adjusted for cost of living. Which makes a hell of a lot more sense -- trust me when I say, if it was double, gaming wouldn't be a thing in Australia.

Were did I say Australians were paying double?

It all depends on where your point of reference is taken from... on the surface it is double the price... but then take in minimum wage and it's equal... but then add in average wages and adjusted living dollars and it isn't equal but nowhere near double... and I'm sure we could dig even deeper and change the answer a dozen or so more times.

What is interesting to note is that game prices have hardly changed from when the AUS$ was worth half what the US dollar was (I miss that because I was being paid in US$ from freelancing work at the time CHA-fucking-CHING!)...

What you can take from all of this is that it sucks far less to be poor in Australia.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

The min wage in Australia is more than twice what it is in the states and it's pretty dishonest to not mention that when you are whining about game prices.

And yet, when worked out in International Dollars (based on the purchasing power of the US dollar), the average yearly US wage is around 15-20% higher than the average Aussie wage.

International dollars are cost of living adjusted dollars. You've been claiming Australians basically pay twice as much as Americans, but by your own standard, it's more like 15-20 percent more when adjusted for cost of living. Which makes a hell of a lot more sense -- trust me when I say, if it was double, gaming wouldn't be a thing in Australia.

Were did I say Australians were paying double?

It all depends on where your point of reference is taken from... on the surface it is double the price... but then take in minimum wage and it's equal... but then add in average wages and adjusted living dollars and it isn't equal but nowhere near double... and I'm sure we could dig even deeper and change the answer a dozen or so more times.

What is interesting to note is that game prices have hardly changed from when the AUS$ was worth half what the US dollar was (I miss that because I was being paid in US$ from freelancing work at the time CHA-fucking-CHING!)...

What you can take from all of this is that it sucks far less to be poor in Australia.

Okay, maybe claiming is the wrong word. "Implying" would probably better. The implication is in the whole "$60? Ha, we pay $120" thing that's so popular with Aussies in general, and you invoked earlier in the thread.

Wait, scratch that, it wasn't you who did it, it was Supertegwyn. I apologize; as long as you're not making the kind of claims he did, you're fine in my book. Australians actually /are/ getting hosed worse than Americans are. It's just not as bad as they tend to claim, and we're all getting hosed pretty much regardless of home country.

Also, I totally agree about it sucking less to be poor in Australia than the US. Despite the fact that "in order to promote the general welfare" is in the bloody preamble to the frakkin' Declaration of Independence, the idea of a safety net for those who have fallen on hard times[footnote]yeah, even something as simple as a living wage[/footnote] is anathema to the average American, or at least it seems that way if you listen to our political discourse. Personally, I blame cold war propaganda. We're /still/ feeling the effects of that crap.

 

[Tdoodle]

It's amazing how much of the CNN article gets wrong about gaming:
"...Gamers' tastes have evolved to include quick, bite-size gaming sessions -- something consoles have never been good at. (Gamers must go to the living room, wait for the console to power on, load the game from the main menu, wait for it to boot.) It's much slower than tapping an icon on the smartphone you already carry in your pocket."

He's got a point here, a lot of people do want to just pick something up for a 10 minute blast and go back to what they're doing, but it's not something everyone wants all the time. When you use the word "Gamers" to blanketly describe people who are more inclined toward the casual 10-minute Angry Birds session you're always going to rub everyone who defines themselves as a gamer but has no real interest in casual games the wrong way.

 

[Kopikatsu]

Unfortunately I have been forced into some PC gaming because of Deus Ex, Gothic 2&3, Nehrim, Vegastrike, etc, and I HATE THAT SHIT. It's just so frustrating sitting all hunched over like an assfuck putzing around with a mouse and keyboard that just sitting down to play becomes a chore. And investing in a special PC gaming station with a magic chair and desk that lifts the keyboard and mouse up to my sternum is just unreasonable.

I know how you feel. That's why I bought a table and a futon, then sawed off the legs of the table. Now I can recline and game at the same time! The only problem is that it makes my aim in shooters go from 'godlike' to 'total shit'.

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

The time it takes for me to turn on my PS3, which is already in my bedroom, and load a game is practically negligible. The other side of the coin is of course that the game quality is worth it, compared to iPhone games. I mean for fuck's sake, if people were that easily deterred we wouldn't even have PC games that needed to install anymore. They guy's right in one respect: Tastes HAVE involved to include bite-sized experiences on mobile devices. The thing he fails to realise is that people often play these games when they need something on a mobile device. Not as an alternative to a console. Besides, half the popularity is people who don't game otherwise, and chances are they already have a phone.

Personally I think there will always be a console market as long as they don't get too expensive or controlling. I paid about a grand for my first PS3, I've had to replace it thrice since, but that is about as far as I would go. Sony often produces consoles at a loss, so it's not like they can just shave a bit off the price if they're not sure they'll make it back in game sales. The next gen looks affordable, which brings me to my second point, that if they keep PSN free, games solid, and their consoles without gimmicks, I'll buy them for the security of being able to play my game at the intended level. I don't want to have to upgrade all the time. Last requirement is that they don't fall behind PC in ease of use, price and quality at the same time.

 

[Andy of Comix Inc]

Everything is dead.

Long live everything.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Australians actually /are/ getting hosed worse than Americans are. It's just not as bad as they tend to claim, and we're all getting hosed pretty much regardless of home country.

If you think game prices are bad for these kinds of pissing contests, fuel prices are even worse... although fuel price comparisons allow for much more finger pointing at governments and cartel-like behaviour by fuel companies but usually ends up with even more ridiculous justifications as well.

Besides, I feel sorry for the poor bastards that pay the same sort of prices that Aussies (and similar countries) have to pay but with shitty wages and a local currency with far, far lower purchasing power.

As the old saying goes; "I cried that I had no shoes until I learned the Art of Pimping."

 

[Warachia]

And YouTube has been the killer of films. Who can be bothered watching a whole movie when you can reach into your pocket and watch a dude get hit in the nuts with a football for so much less effort? Stupid analysis is stupid.

Somehow your avatar fits perfectly, why watch a youtube video when I can just make a LEGO swordfight?

 

[Baron_Rouge]

I don't believe it's dying. Diminishing, maybe, but I think it will reach a level and stay there, rather than just die. It may well become a niche market in the future, but even if that's true, I doubt it'll die out. There will always be people who prefer playing on the couch, in front of a TV, with a controller than playing on a smartphone or tablet. It just isn't the same experience. I have a decent PC, and nothing against PC gaming, but I just prefer the console experience. Always have. I'm sure there are others out there like me who'll keep the market alive, even if it does get smaller.

 

[Olas]

No CNN, you're dying. You're the Myspace of News media, you're outdated and irrelevant, and yet you can't pull your head out of your own ass long enough to accept that you have a problem. Who needs quality cutting edge news coverage when we can report gossip and heresay with expensive gadgets and special effects. Console gaming will piss on your grave.

 

[Epona]

The min wage in Australia is more than twice what it is in the states and it's pretty dishonest to not mention that when you are whining about game prices.

And yet, when worked out in International Dollars (based on the purchasing power of the US dollar), the average yearly US wage is around 15-20% higher than the average Aussie wage.

Yes, if you include millionaires into your average which is pretty useless info for many gamers who make closer to min wage.

Just quit fuckin whining about how $60 is nothing, it's not nothing.

 

[Something Amyss]

I don't know about anyone else

Should have stopped there.

That ridiculous statement completely ignores the fact that there is an entire ecosystem of excellent indie games out there (Super Meat Boy, Braid, Limbo, etc.) that are making their developers plenty of money on all platforms except maybe the Wii. There's plenty of original PSN/Live games out there that I've bought.

The lion share goes to the smaller versions of disc titles or retro titles, however. Not to mention, Microsoft seems to hate the indies.

You know, this is still fairly true. Especially since we're talking consoles. I'd give it to you if we included PC, because Steam is awesome for indie games.

No offense to Wii owners (myself included), but I think the main issue with the Wii is that the vast majority early adopters just weren't hardcore gamers. I own a Wii, but I also have a 360, PS3, and a few "antique" consoles, and I'm willing to bet that my fellow Escapists are the same way. The few people I know who own just the Wii bought less than 5 games for it.

That still could point to the failure of the Wii as a console.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Just quit fuckin whining about how $60 is nothing, it's not nothing.

Where did I say $60 was nothing?

When you pull your head out of your arse to take a breather, you might want to read the posts between me and Owyn.

 

[Madkipz]

Which is why 60$ games exist.

...???

Adjusting for inflation, video games have only ever gotten cheaper. Even without it...Super Mario 64, Starfox 64, Majora's Mask, and most other AAA N64 games were all $70~ on release and I distinctly remember Turok being $80~. Even as far back as the SNES, Chrono Trigger sent me back a pretty $60.

That's the reason you have ridiculous situations like where Dead Space 3 would have to sell more copies than the other two games in the series combined just to break even. Part of it is that they're putting too much money into graphics and voice actors, but the rest of it is that games are outstandingly cheap, considering it's probably the only form of media that has gotten cheaper while production values went up as time went on.

I have no idea why people are suddenly complaining about the price of games so much. A brand new AAA title will cost me about as much as a tank of gas. It's practically nothing.

Average hourly earnings in America (adjusted for inflation) have not increased in ~50 years. (Total compensation, which includes health insurance, vacation time, and other benefits has increased, but workers can't spend those things).

-.-

One of the reasons American companies are earning so much money is that they're paying very little to their rank-and-file employees. This is also why average earnings have been stagnant for 50 years and most American consumers are broke. Wages as a percent of the economy are at an all-time low.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/henry-ford-salary-increase-2012-8#ixzz2BwVFQbXn

So when you want to say that people are complaining about the price of games it is just an extension of the now eroding middle class.

 

[kyogen]

The article begins with a description of its author which states that he covers video games and other "male-interest" topics. "Male-interest"? Ok. Sure. Yes, Chicken Little. The sky is falling and consoles are dying.

They're not in a transitional phase as markets readjust to changing technology, and women most certainly do not play or have any interest in video games.

And this post isn't sarcastic, either.

 

[MagunBFP]

I read the first page, then the last page. So if I missed something my bad. I was going to post that Australia's been paying $100 or more for most of the console games that have been coming out... since ever.

Someone's made that point already, and then it was pointed out that American's don't earn much compared to Australian's so by comparing our incomes the inflated prices are actually fair. To that I would like to say You're an idiot. To demonstrate my point I'll give you this example, if you go into a shop looking like a bum and buy something, but your friend walks in dressed in a suit, looking like a million dollars, and buys the same thing you would expect both of you would pay the same. Would you say its right that the guy in the suit was charged double just cause "he looks richer"?

We might have higher incomes, but we also have to pay more just to live, otherwise we'd just make our fortunes here and move to somewhere like America (which is either the free world, or somehow is in charge of everyone else, but thats another rant) where the pay is so miserable and we could live like kings with all out Australian money.

 

[fix-the-spade]

I hope you mean DA2, because Origins was a damn solid PC rpg.

To be honest the whole series has rubbed me wrong.

I know this is purely subjective, but I don't think it's going to last they other RPGs like The Elder Scrolls have.

 

[The Comfy Chair]

Argh, conflicted. A lack of consoles would force the gaming industry to once again discover something other than low risk heavily marketed sludge, but it would also make people who are extremely adamant that it's 'CONSOLE OR NOTHING!' depressed. In the end, i may think they're narrow minded and losing out on so much with that mindset, but they're happy i guess

Lemme tell you a little bit about Sandy, the big fuck hurricane that fucked the eastern seaboard right in its ear. Well, for almost a week I had no power and got my kicks with books, a laptop, and an iPad. The iPad didn't last long because I'm not into sitting with a device in my lap with my neck bent at a 90 degree angle. I also can't deal with computer gaming because of the whole seated-like-a-jerkoff thing.

Unfortunately I have been forced into some PC gaming because of Deus Ex, Gothic 2&3, Nehrim, Vegastrike, etc, and I HATE THAT SHIT. It's just so frustrating sitting all hunched over like an assfuck putzing around with a mouse and keyboard that just sitting down to play becomes a chore. And investing in a special PC gaming station with a magic chair and desk that lifts the keyboard and mouse up to my sternum is just unreasonable.

I'm assuming when you say "console" you mean big, stylish box with a Sony or Microsoft label emblazoned across it, because couch (or Comfy Chair), TV, and thumbsticks ain't goin anywhere. It could be that Ouya will change the business model, or maybe TVs will come equipped with CPUs & GFX cards, or perhaps new contenders will enter the field, or maybe, and this shit sounds far fetched, but maybe games will be fully stored, processed, and rendered ELSEWHERE while you play it on whatever medium you choose, whenever and whereever you choose, via broadband, in which case COUCHTVTHUMBSTICKS will still be used most often. The bottom line is that "consoles" and PCs have existed side by side for about 30 years, mobile gaming entered the fray about 25 years ago, and that fucking couch has been the deciding factor in the dominant market.

Maybe I'm biased though, because my fucking couch is DOPE, SON...
WORD!

The argument should be about whether the current corporate structure of gaming is sustainable, and I don't think it is. The current market is a bloated behemoth in which creativity is a dying virtue and boardrooms control artistic direction.

And don't get me started on Mobile Gaming, that shit should be renamed Mobile-Distraction-that-you-use-while-use-on-line-at-Starbucks-because-the-barista-is-a-dude-today-so-there-are-no-tits-to-look-at.

Anyway, the bottom line is that the "console" isn't the argument. The argument is the current corporate structure of gaming

You're correct, sitting on a couch with a controller isn't going anywhere. But since when was a couch and controller exclusive to consoles anyway? Especially lately, playing on PC with a controller requires very little effort (plug in a 360 controller - job done) I agree with you about streaming too, that, once enough people have a stable internet connection above 10mbps anyway. I doubt TV's will nver come with gpu's/cpu's powerful enough for games to be truly relevant though, for a whole host of reasons which basically is the same reason why the next gen is going to be so performance starved.

However, the whole mobile gaming thing is a bit different to what you're expecting for the reason you also think the Ouya is relevant (an android device the same as a phone). Like I said, controller TV couch isn't exclusive to consoles: you can, right now, play gta 3 at 720p on your TV with a controller on an android phone if you buy a hdmi connector and a bluetooth controller (if you root the phone you can use a PS3 one as far as i'm aware). It's not far fetched to think that could be the future of any gaming device that isn't a hobbyist machine (i.e. a PC) or streaming.

Consoles will disappear, but gaming wont, ESPECIALLY the kind of gaming you enjoy. As you say, playing games on a sofa is a large market. Not quite sure if it's 'dominant' since dominant implies it's the biggest market - but there are roughly a quarter of a billion 'gaming' (>5x faster than a console) level DX11 gpu's floating around sold since 2009, so it's debateable. But it's a big one, especially in the US, so it's not going to go uncatered for. But as long as PC exists that will always be available - no matter what happens, since PC is the only platform that you can set it up to do exactly what you want it to. But i doubt we'll ever be in the situation where PC is the ONLY way to do it, especially with the alternatives listed.