Poll: Do People Pirate Because it's Free? Or is There Something More to it?

[CheckD3]

I torrent only tv shows that are hard to get a hold of and music. Don't do movies because I work for a rental store and get them for free and games because...I just don't. I do it to get into something. Why spend money, full price, on a band that I don't like? I download their discography and if I like them I'll go out and buy a CD when I have money, though normally I spend my money on movies and games. Tvs that aren't airing and/or are hard to get my hands on, why not pirate it? I tell people about it, and if I could buy it without spending 45 for a single season, I would. I love watching DVD extras, but if I can't get my hands on something or find it a possible waste, I'll torrent it because it's free

Pirating is bad to the industry because there are people out there who WON'T buy things that they can torrent and it takes from sales. Pirates need to find the line between the free and and the expensive, even if it's buying a little bit.

 

[YouShouldDeleteThisAccount]

I have pirated for probably 5 years now. Generally between 5-10 times a year, I'm not a heavy pirate, in any means of the word.

However, for about 4 years, I've only pirated things that'd be hard or impossible to find without piracy. If it's not on GOG, or Steam, or orderable, I'm probably going to pirate it. I generally ignore pre-owned, as it's not like any of that money goes to the developers, which is why I buy games to begin with.

I do disrespect people who pirate EVERYTHING. Particularly brand new things, I mean, come on.

However, as much as I hate the dishonorable extreme-piraters. I hate the strong anti-pirates too. They spread one-sided ignorant and unreasonable statements and assertions about how evil and wrong all piracy is. The grey-tinted actions of the world far overcome the black and white.

Y'know what's funny? Most of these people appear to be convinced by propaganda. The assertions of the evil of piracy at the start of every DVD and so often shouted to heavens by capitalists who know very little moral virtue, or very little of what is fair.


A rich man is allowed to choose to use underpaid Chinese workers in unsafe and inhumane conditions to manufacture their goods in the name of cost-effective capitalism, but a poor man cannot pirate what he cannot afford?

 

[Marmooset]

OT: For the last time people. Stealing a shirt and downloading a game/CD/movie/etc are not the same. A shirt has an intrinsic value, each unit cost the same to make. A game costs $10 million for that first copy but each copy after that cost 10 cents to stamp on a disc.

No it doesn't make it right, yes a copyright holder should be paid back for the work they did in creating it, but it is not the same as stealing.

Steal: v.
to take (the property of another or others) without permission or right, esp. secretly or by force.

Doesn't say anywhere in the definition that it matters whether the property is made of fruity pebbles, ponies, happy clouds, or creative effort. It is the act, in and of itself.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

I pirate music horribly for the soul purpose of not wishing to shell out the ridiculous prices for some of the CDs nowadays. I admit, times are presently tough and money is scarce, thus it is my only means of acquiring a new album I happen to fancy. I have a whole legion of CDs no longer being used and would probably buy if I had more income. In the end, I could not care less if people have a morale objection to my pirating of music. Certainly not about to lose sleep over it.

Never have pirated games or movies though. No... I did once for each. The game was not worthwhile, the movie I still have.

 

[-Samurai-]

Just because one thinks something isn't good doesn't give one the right to steal.
Shits costs money to make, just because it's not in a physical format doesn't mean it's not stealing.

It actually isn't stealing. It's copyright infringement. Huge difference.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

OT: For the last time people. Stealing a shirt and downloading a game/CD/movie/etc are not the same. A shirt has an intrinsic value, each unit cost the same to make. A game costs $10 million for that first copy but each copy after that cost 10 cents to stamp on a disc.

No it doesn't make it right, yes a copyright holder should be paid back for the work they did in creating it, but it is not the same as stealing.

Steal: v.
to take (the property of another or others) without permission or right, esp. secretly or by force.

Doesn't say anywhere in the definition that it matters whether the property is made of fruity pebbles, ponies, happy clouds, or creative effort. It is the act, in and of itself.

There is a significant difference between the two. If I were to steal your shirt, you would be without a shirt. If I download an album, the album is still available for everyone else. It is technically no different than if you had purchased a CD and ripped it to your PC and then your friends PC. Your friend did not pay for those songs, yet is benefiting from your generosity. Piracy of music can be held in similarity, not that I mean to justify it.

 

[Sneaky Paladin]

I only pirate things I believe deserve it. Things that are no longer being produced and things gamestop keeps and FULL PRICE despite it being out for 2 FUCKING YEARS... sorry about that. here's some examples.

Final fantasy 7 because it isn't being produced.

Spore since I tried it knowing fully well it wouldn't be good...It wasn't and it didn't deserver my money.

and I think fallout 3. Thankfully I purchased it and all the DLC off steam later since it WAS good unlike spore.

 

[Therumancer]

I agree with the perspective that there is more to piracy than it simply being free, especially seeing as piracy is defined differantly by differant groups out there.

To put it into perspective things like "fansubs" with Anime and the like are labeled piracy by many people. In that case though one of the reasons why people go through the time and trouble is because the companies are not releasing in your country or language, so if you want to see some things, it's a fansubbed copy or nothing.

The same logic applies to fan translations of various video games that are not released in someone's country of origin.

Or people wanting to obtain uncensored versions of something that censors are chopping to death in their region.

Heck, consider that the only way to get an original version of the "Star Wars" movies before George Lucas' "Improvements" is going to involve what the owner is going to label as piracy because he intentionally doesn't want to release them.

Then of course you have people yelling and screaming about the whole "upconvert" technologies availible out there. People who paid money for a DVD and then use a machine (either purchused or performed by a service by one) to turn it into an HD DVD copy are already being screamed at as pirates by companies who want to sell them the same movie they already purchused.

Ditto for people using machines to record or store shows off of TV to watch later. Burn the latest episode of your favorite show, or a sporting event to a DVD so you can take it with youy to watch on your portable DVD player the next day and there are those who are going to scream "pirate".

I'll be blunt, not everything above is illegal, or hasn't always been in places where it is now. It all depends on where and when your talking about. Piracy and intellectual property rights are a massive mess internationally. Most of it actually winds up skirting a gray line, but falls under what the industry itself whines about as piracy.

I'm not going to go off on my tangents about how I think both the industry and pirates are bad, or any of that stuff. My opinion that it's like the Mafia and Gang Bangers both duking it out where we, the regular users, wind up getting flak from both is well known (though I can go into it again if I have to). All I am saying here is that I think there is more to it than some dude simply grabbing a torrent of a game or first run movie that he could buy, but doesn't want to pay for, especially as the term is being broadened.

 

[-Samurai-]

OT: For the last time people. Stealing a shirt and downloading a game/CD/movie/etc are not the same. A shirt has an intrinsic value, each unit cost the same to make. A game costs $10 million for that first copy but each copy after that cost 10 cents to stamp on a disc.

No it doesn't make it right, yes a copyright holder should be paid back for the work they did in creating it, but it is not the same as stealing.

Steal: v.
to take (the property of another or others) without permission or right, esp. secretly or by force.

Doesn't say anywhere in the definition that it matters whether the property is made of fruity pebbles, ponies, happy clouds, or creative effort. It is the act, in and of itself.

Technically, you're not taking the property of another person. They're giving it to you. They purchased the game/moves(with the exception of movies still in theater)/books/music, and they made a copy to share with as many people as they want.

The reason it's against the law is that copy breaks the copyright that says that it cannot be copied. That's a legally binding contract that you accept when you purchase something.

Piracy isn't stealing, it's copyright infringement. The sooner people realize that, the sooner we can get beyond the whole "you're a thief" thing.

 

[Canid117]

Thats the reason for some but many pirates are just dicks.

no not really 80 percent of pirates pirate stuff because the games aren't released in theyr country

What about US pirates? Almost everything gets released here with the exception of a few of the more batshit insane pieces from Japan and yet there is still no shortage of piracy.

 

[Weaver]

for me, theres 2 kinds of "pirates": REAL pirates, and parrots.

the real pirate i got somewhat respect for. this is a person who uses his hacking skills to achieve what people generally dont understand how works in the first place. where talking about the guy who got the DVD code, those who hacked fallout 3 and REMOVED half of the bugs and so on. these people do it for several reasons:
-theyre rebels; "DOWN WITH THE GOVERNMENT!"
-theyre idealists; "every person should get what rich people get"
-theyre bored and want a challenge; "heck, unhackable you say? bring it!"
-they want to create a better product.

the parrot on the other hand is what we all are. we sit on the pirates shoulder, posing as a pirate, but when theres swashbuckling to do, we fly up high, dodge all legal bullets and let the real pirate do all for us. when the loot is collected, we only eat what the pirate bother to feed us. we might enjoy posing as a pirate, looking as rad as them, but all in all, were just the pirates sheeple.

to speak more clearly without analogies: every "pirate" that says he pirate for other reasons than "its free", is a poser. hes just a consumer who takes freebies whenever he sees it. he might like to glorify whatever he does, but all in all, hes just a money grubbing freeloader, and no better than a christian killing in God's name ("thou shall not kill" anyone?). get over yourself already. if you wanna be a real pirate, start acting like one.

and yeh, im cool with parrots, just as i said, feel parrots who posé as pirates are pathetic.

The aforementioned people are called "Crackers" not pirates.
Piracy in modern terms is about taking media freely or redistributing knock-off versions of things cheaply for a profit.

 

[DarthFennec]

I think all music should be freely distributed. It's easy that way, and nobody has to worry about whether you're getting it legally or not, and also, it's great advertising for the band. Any band worth listening to makes just about all of their income from touring anyway. But in the end, I don't support music piracy because it's free of charge, I support it because I don't like the prospect of the fucking RIAA breathing down my neck whenever I decide that my best friend should listen to this song because it's fucking awesome.

When I get a movie or game, I give myself two options: one, I pirate it, and if I like it enough I'll buy it. Two, I rent it, and if I like it enough I'll buy it. Obviously one costs less to me and is easier and quicker than the other. But as long as the current laws stay in place, I could get busted by the MPAA for doing something illegal. That's fucking stupid, because think about it: I didn't lose the MPAA or the producers or creators of the movie any money by pirating, because Blockbuster Video already legally bought that copy that I neglected to rent. If I'm losing anyone money it's Blockbuster, but they can't sue me because I have the right to decide not to use their service anyway. The point is, I don't think this system we have is right or just.

So to answer the question, my personal reasoning is not because it's free. I support piracy because that stuff should legally be free anyway, and it's unjust to us that it's not. It's about control that the industry needs to give up, because they practically don't have it anyway. Most pirates aren't cheap bastards. Most pirates will pay in order to support something that they like. Most pirates will also do a lot more free advertising if they like a band than if they've been busted by the RIAA. And most of the time, more pirates equals more money for the artist(s) of whatever kind. In the events where more pirates decrease sales, the reason is that the product was genuinely bad, and that should be a negative to the industry anyway. I may have gotten a little off track, I can't tell, it's really late here and I'm about to fall asleep.

 

[Marmooset]

There is a significant difference between the two. If I were to steal your shirt, you would be without a shirt.

Both are stealing. It matters not a whit where a shirt ends up. Somebody owns something, you take it without payment or blessing, it is stealing. The fancy semantic footwork is only a vain attempt to create a grey area in which a pirate feels justified in their actions.
Frankly, I prefer the ones who say "F--- you, I know it's wrong, but what are you gonna do about it?" They're thieves, but they're not liars.

Technically, you're not taking the property of another person. They're giving it to you. They purchased the game/moves(with the exception of movies still in theater)/books/music, and they made a copy to share with as many people as they want.

The reason it's against the law is that copy breaks the copyright that says that it cannot be copied. That's a legally binding contract that you accept when you purchase something.

Piracy isn't stealing, it's copyright infringement. The sooner people realize that, the sooner we can get beyond the whole "you're a thief" thing.

You are a thief. And I'm not condemning that. But when you try to justify it it and pretend it's something else on a phantom technicality, you sound like the junkie who marches out reams of "research" rationalizing the good aspects of drug use. And while you stop to ponder it, he's gone and hocked your TV.

 

[Samurai Goomba]

I mean I can't afford to buy my own home yet, but that doesn't mean I'm going to start living in your place until I can.

But if you couldn't afford to pay for ANY place to live and there was no shelter within walking distance, you WOULD end up at least temporarily "living" at some place you don't own until you could afford to pay for a place to live.

Bad analogy is bad.

Maybe if companies toned down advertising they wouldn't hype people up to see movies they can't afford and thus encourage piracy? But they obviously don't do that, because it'd be stupid. Companies would rather advertise out the bum for new games and movies regardless of who can afford them, then whine about pirates and recoup their advertising budget in lawsuits against Joe Smallpaycheck.

@Topic Creator: I think it's awesome movies in your area are 5 bucks, but where I'm at it's more like double that JUST for the movie ticket. There's no way a low-income person can see every good movie coming out in theater or buy every new release (remember used purchases don't go to the creators) at $20 for a bare-bones DVD or Blu-Ray.

 

[Samurai Goomba]

to speak more clearly without analogies: every "pirate" that says he pirate for other reasons than "its free", is a poser. hes just a consumer who takes freebies whenever he sees it. he might like to glorify whatever he does, but all in all, hes just a money grubbing freeloader, and no better than a christian killing in God's name ("thou shall not kill" anyone?). get over yourself already. if you wanna be a real pirate, start acting like one.

Wow. So being on the consuming end of the piracy cycle=murdering people in the Crusades?

Oh, I've got one! Waxing a car=Firing a muzzle-loading cannon at a church full of orphans. Wow, it IS fun to pull comparisons out of my butt!

You are a thief.

Nice. Every time somebody posts a reasonable counter-point to the whole piracy issue thing, this is what typically pops up. Look, he's not saying it isn't illegal, or wrong, or bad. He's saying it isn't theft as defined by the legal definition of theft. What isn't okay is what you've done. You say you aren't "condemning" him, but you're just insulting him out of lack of any real rebuttal to his statement.

"You sound like a junkie," "you are a thief" ... Don't try to play coy with us, hiding behind your mask of dispassionate civility. You, sir, are an obnoxious flamer who, lacking the wherewithal to debate properly, has fallen back on petty insults.

 

[Daniel_Rosamilia]

I do it because either:
1. I'm broke (which is most of the time, coupled with point 2)
2. My friends are all PC's and I'm a Mac, so they have no games for me.
3. I need new games, and I can't afford them (link to point 1)

BUT!
I only commit piracy so I can save those few cents I have for a car when I get my licence. (Yay for being 16 in Australia, but I don't want to drive.)

EDIT:
What the OP is describing is NOT piracy.

Spoiler: THIS IS PIRACY!