Poll: Final Fantasy 12 - Did u enjoy it
- Thread starter vejtornado
- Start date
Vaan and Penelo contributed absolutely dick to the plot, and they're meant to be the protaganist + love interest. That's a pretty big mistake right there. Making a real-time battle system was good in theory but you ultimately ended up just watching the characters fight by themselves without any input from you. It was far too mechanical.
And no summoning Shiva/Ifrit/Bahamut? We've been able to do that for ages (VII had 3 Bahamuts), and suddenly you get rid of them? And 13's version of Shiva is going to be a pair of lesbian motorcycles? Who thinks this stuff up and thinks it's a good idea?
On the other hand, I think making Ashe a widow was genius, Basch was a badass, and Balthier was all kinds of awesome. The License system was good, if a little straightforward, and allowing everyone to equip every weapon was good for customisation.
It was a half-decent game with a lot of missed oppertunities and unnecessary additions.But did I enjoy it? Not really, no.
And no summoning Shiva/Ifrit/Bahamut? We've been able to do that for ages (VII had 3 Bahamuts), and suddenly you get rid of them? And 13's version of Shiva is going to be a pair of lesbian motorcycles? Who thinks this stuff up and thinks it's a good idea?
On the other hand, I think making Ashe a widow was genius, Basch was a badass, and Balthier was all kinds of awesome. The License system was good, if a little straightforward, and allowing everyone to equip every weapon was good for customisation.
It was a half-decent game with a lot of missed oppertunities and unnecessary additions.But did I enjoy it? Not really, no.
I didn't care about the characters or what they were fighting for. I didn't care for the battle system that used real world distance (from enemies or allies, and with area damage) or real-time battle (I know you could turn that off, but the distance interaction still annoyed the piss out of me). I thought the setting was beautiful though. And I kind of liked the way the encounters were set up. You could avoid if you wanted to.
I didn't like the story. For one thing, I couldn't figure out who the main character actually was (Vaan's story kind of petered out after the first few hours - then it alternated between Balthier and Ashe) and the game did repeat itself a few times (go to temple/tomb, take ancient artifact, find out it's not as useful as you thought, Empire bad, repeat).
The gameplay was pretty good though - much more realistic than standing in a line and taking turns to run up and attack - but the mega-boss fights were infinitely more nerve-shredding than Emerald Weapon/Ozma/Dark Aeons. Your characters chip away at some gargantuan hell-spawn until your mind starts to wander - which is invariably when they all get fried by some sort of ludicrously powerful shockwave and your controller goes out of the window. Again.
At least when all of your party are wiped out by the giant dragon's deus ex machina attack your other characters can step in and run their arses away.
The gameplay was pretty good though - much more realistic than standing in a line and taking turns to run up and attack - but the mega-boss fights were infinitely more nerve-shredding than Emerald Weapon/Ozma/Dark Aeons. Your characters chip away at some gargantuan hell-spawn until your mind starts to wander - which is invariably when they all get fried by some sort of ludicrously powerful shockwave and your controller goes out of the window. Again.
At least when all of your party are wiped out by the giant dragon's deus ex machina attack your other characters can step in and run their arses away.
Are you people kidding about the plot? You must be...
FFXII had some of the most complexly motivated villains the series has EVER seen. The Empire was NOT really evil, it was ambitious. Notice how there is still an empire at the end? Notice how Vayne WANTED his brother to succeed him and be a better emperor than him?
*sigh*
No love of complex narratives... don't EVER play Suikoden II
FFXII had some of the most complexly motivated villains the series has EVER seen. The Empire was NOT really evil, it was ambitious. Notice how there is still an empire at the end? Notice how Vayne WANTED his brother to succeed him and be a better emperor than him?
*sigh*
No love of complex narratives... don't EVER play Suikoden II
That appraisal is fairly accurate... the pacing is broken and they should have put a lot more focus on the characters. Though I don't understand the complaint about there being "no" main character, I prefer it that way.NoMoreSanity said:
I agree with the points about a complex narrative. The problem is the main characters have no part in that narrative. The world is lush and vibrant, but the main characters are empty, almost cold in their lack of worth. Vaan, our empty self-identification gamer insertion protagonist seems ambitious, but does very little, fitting with Cloud, Squall, Tidus, etc. Ashe, our princess emerging through the trial of something going wrong with her kingdom seems power-hungry enough to betray the party and suffers visions, yet does very little, filling the role played by Aeris. Penelo, our childhood love interest who amazingly isn't the princess seems helpful enough and does very little, not nearly living up to Tifa. Basch is honourable to a fault and does very little, much like Kimahri. Fran is distant, insightful and very different in her outlook on the world, but unfortunately doesn't do enough, much like Red XIII. That leaves Balthier to carry large chunks of the plot, which he does with amazing flair, along the same lines as Auron. Because Balthier gets the vast majority of the good lines and displays the most of a wonderful personality, he's easy to like. Basch makes a couple of hard calls to try and defy a Princess going about stupid things for revenge. Penelo follows Vaan around to help him out of his occasional stupidity, while Vaan follows Balthier hoping to osmose some of his sheer awesomeness. Fran is herself, she's chosen to be Balthier's travelling companion because it suits her and lets her get out in the world to breathe, but we don't get much more than that.
There's a sense of disconnection from most of the characters which other games haven't had quite so much of. Sure, every Final Fantasy game makes the protagonist bland to allow the gamer to self-identify, but this is usually counteracted by the presence of a number of diverse personalities. That sense of personality wasn't here to the same degree this time. What was here that hasn't been for a while, is a sense of the world as an interesting place, not just something to trek through. Annoying as it is to be completist about, having Rare spawns turn up and give you a random challenge is a nice addition. Hunts have been a fun way to go about the little bit of genuinely challenging content for the level Final Fantasy games provide and thanks to the automation provided by gambits, the battles don't feel quite as stunted where the action pauses all the time for you to select your next move, while allowing you to be tactical
There also wasn't too much of the gimmicky push sequence of buttons to get the powerful move to go off and that's something I welcome and others miss, I'm with Yahtzee on the overprevalence of Quicktime Events.
All up, it's been a world I've been happy to go into and enjoy finding my way through, but it hasn't been a compelling story through the main characters. The real story's in the background characters and the plots happening within the empire and the politics surrounding their occupation of various city-states which would prefer to maintain independence. There's potential similarites to real-world politics and it does paint war properly as a horrific affair in which ultimately people are playing for high stakes and no one really wins. That's a nice thing to depict well and they have. Hearing stories from the survivors of Nabudis makes me understand that little bit more about the Japanese perception of the nuclear bombs dropped on them. Everyone wishes it hadn't happened no matter which side they were on if they've directly seen the results.
There's a sense of disconnection from most of the characters which other games haven't had quite so much of. Sure, every Final Fantasy game makes the protagonist bland to allow the gamer to self-identify, but this is usually counteracted by the presence of a number of diverse personalities. That sense of personality wasn't here to the same degree this time. What was here that hasn't been for a while, is a sense of the world as an interesting place, not just something to trek through. Annoying as it is to be completist about, having Rare spawns turn up and give you a random challenge is a nice addition. Hunts have been a fun way to go about the little bit of genuinely challenging content for the level Final Fantasy games provide and thanks to the automation provided by gambits, the battles don't feel quite as stunted where the action pauses all the time for you to select your next move, while allowing you to be tactical
There also wasn't too much of the gimmicky push sequence of buttons to get the powerful move to go off and that's something I welcome and others miss, I'm with Yahtzee on the overprevalence of Quicktime Events.
All up, it's been a world I've been happy to go into and enjoy finding my way through, but it hasn't been a compelling story through the main characters. The real story's in the background characters and the plots happening within the empire and the politics surrounding their occupation of various city-states which would prefer to maintain independence. There's potential similarites to real-world politics and it does paint war properly as a horrific affair in which ultimately people are playing for high stakes and no one really wins. That's a nice thing to depict well and they have. Hearing stories from the survivors of Nabudis makes me understand that little bit more about the Japanese perception of the nuclear bombs dropped on them. Everyone wishes it hadn't happened no matter which side they were on if they've directly seen the results.
All in all, I liked it quite a bit.
Visual design was excellent. Music was quite good. The gameplay was also a good combination of Western and Japanese RPGs. Story was meh. But you can't win 'em all.
Visual design was excellent. Music was quite good. The gameplay was also a good combination of Western and Japanese RPGs. Story was meh. But you can't win 'em all.
Yes! I did like Final Fantasy 12. It was one of the best games I have ever played. Even though I found Vann and Penelo likable, the game could have been done without them.
I wish it focused on Basch and the rest of the gang. Plus Ashe could've used some pants. Ahem...yeah.
I wish it focused on Basch and the rest of the gang. Plus Ashe could've used some pants. Ahem...yeah.
I felt it was more of a spin-off to the main series. I clocked alot of hours on it, but it all felt like mmorpg grind. Its not bad, in facts it's pretty good. I just don't think it deserved its numeral. Still, after X-2, i was expecting something much worse.
No, absolutely not! Story, combat, charakterdevelopment...all were terrible. I still don't know WHY Vaan was the main charakter. He had almost no background. And, as often as the crew got caught after they had cleared a temple, they could have brought their own handcuffs, just to save some time.
EDIT: And before I forget, if I ever have to play those ascends again, I 'll crush that gamedisc.
EDIT: And before I forget, if I ever have to play those ascends again, I 'll crush that gamedisc.
What was Vaan's motivation? As the lead male he as some of the worst character developement i've seen in this series (and as you can imagine he's up against some pretty stiff competition there). It's no wonder Balthier refers to himself as the leading man so often, developers obvislously realising we'd be using him more often than Vaan.
Let's look at his predecesors:
Cecil: After revenge on Golbez
Bartz: following in his fathers footsteps
Cloud: Out to save the world from an evil company and a sociopath with mommy issues
Squall: It's his job
Zidane: trying to win the heart of a princess
Tidus: trying to find a way home and save his friend's life
Vaan:... um... wants to be a sky pirate... oh dear... he probably just like to hang around with the cool guys.
Seriously it's no wonder he was exiled from Dissidia in favour of Basch/Gabranth.
Let's look at his predecesors:
Cecil: After revenge on Golbez
Bartz: following in his fathers footsteps
Cloud: Out to save the world from an evil company and a sociopath with mommy issues
Squall: It's his job
Zidane: trying to win the heart of a princess
Tidus: trying to find a way home and save his friend's life
Vaan:... um... wants to be a sky pirate... oh dear... he probably just like to hang around with the cool guys.
Seriously it's no wonder he was exiled from Dissidia in favour of Basch/Gabranth.