Poll: How is this not piracy

[LooK iTz Jinjo]

So after hearing countless ads regarding Teltra's latest and great new product the Telstra T-Hub (no that was not a plug) I've been thinking, one of the MAIN selling points of the damn thing is the ability to record live TV. Great that's a cool feature. On the topic there are dozens of DVD Recorders on the market, many with built in hard drives, allowing you to record all the TV and movies you want. Foxtel IQ (Australian cable) allows you to record any movie or tv show they play.

Yet when I go download a TV show via a torrent, because you know IT WON'T BE PLAYED ON AUSTRALIAN TV FOR AT LEAST 2-3 MONTHS IF EVER! I am technically breaking the law and costing these movie companies millions of dollars. But I can't see how the two are different. Ok they had to originally watch it with the ads and the network paid for it. They also paid for their recording device, but hey I paid for my computer, modem and internet connection. But you know what they do is fine, even though they're are usually the ones uploading these movies and TV shows to my torrent sites.

So Escapists, what is your opinion? Are they really that different? Or is recording via a legal device completely different and just fine?

 

[KarmaTheAlligator]

I was tempted to say they were different since they're supposed to be for personal use only, but then I remembered people can't be trusted with such things. So they usually end up as illegal copies sold somewhere.

 

[Floppertje]

yep, it's totally crooked and hypocritical. welcome to life.

 

[Cogwheel]

Using a recording device is, by all definitions of it, actually illegal.
Why? I don't know. I just remember reading about it.

Not that I really care about that.

Ah, good, so it's not just me. I seem to recall hearing something along those lines too. Sadly, I don't have any real evidence either.

That said, I'm fairly sure it IS some form of piracy, ridiculous as that is. Again, I don't care a great deal... partly since I don't watch TV at all, but that's besides the point.

 

[Cid Silverwing]

Nope.

Tapes and DVD's can be circulated just like torrents, except you don't have the torrent as a proxy and you're actually moving the content rather than copying.

 

[Merkavar]

arent you meant to get prior written consent before recording a movie or tv show on a t hub or dvd recorder?

 

[octafish]

Freeview PVRs and the Telstra thing, you cannot get the files off of it. Legally anyway, I'm sure there is a hack for it somewhere but they are designed to hold the live recording and not export them. It is the same as free to air TV except you can watch it any time. If you torrent an illegal file you are helping other download that illegal file. A personal recording which the TV network/content makers have licensed is very different from a pirate torrent.

 

[Jordi]

There is a very slight difference in that when you record something from radio/tv the publisher has already sold the material, and in a sense you already paid for it by having a network subscription. And it is very hard to condemn recording such material (especially if you only watch it once), because the network/publisher doesn't really gain anything from you being at home at the exact time that the material was broadcast. They did try though. Did you know that (cassette) taping was going to kill music [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_Taping_Is_Killing_Music] at one point in history. Yeah, it got that stupid...

But back to the main topic: if a tv show is on tonight, but you can't watch it because you need to go save kittens from firey buildings or something, I really don't see a difference between using your computer to get the episode and using some kind of recording device on your PC. But if you are already downloading the torrent when a movie is only just in theaters, it can be argued that there is a small difference. Of course, you still aren't costing anyone millions, but that's the extreme anti-pirates for you...

 

[Anarchemitis]

Illegal distribution of copies is different than making copies for personal non-distribution use.

 

[darth.pixie]

I don't think they're different. I mean, pirate sites aren't getting paid for what they post and it would end up the same way as you inviting someone to watch said movie.

If they end up making a DVD of the TV Show or whatever, that would be piracy since you could buy it but otherwise it's just watching. I'm mainly thinking about new shows or those that aren't available everywhere and won't be shown on TV.

It's different with theatre movies since there's always a DVD available and rentals and whatnot. So I guess it just depends on how available it is.

 

[Natasha_LB]

Freeview PVRs and the Telstra thing, you cannot get the files off of it. Legally anyway, I'm sure there is a hack for it somewhere but they are designed to hold the live recording and not export them. It is the same as free to air TV except you can watch it any time. If you torrent an illegal file you are helping other download that illegal file. A personal recording which the TV network/content makers have licensed is very different from a pirate torrent.

I'm not sure if that's true.. maybe in the States, but certainly not here in the UK (as far as I'm aware) Every PVR I've ever owned has been really easy to copy the files off, no workarounds or cracks necessary. My current TV has a built in PVR which records to a USB hard drive, all I need to do is plug the drive in to my PC and there are all the files, correctly named and in AVI format. It was clearly designed to make this process very easy, and I'm sure they wouldn't have done so if it was illegal.

My opinion on torrenting TV shows, is that it's okay (ish) for BBC shows... I've paid my license fee, and there's no advertising on the BBC, so it doesn't feel like they're losing out.

 

[octafish]

Freeview PVRs and the Telstra thing, you cannot get the files off of it. Legally anyway, I'm sure there is a hack for it somewhere but they are designed to hold the live recording and not export them. It is the same as free to air TV except you can watch it any time. If you torrent an illegal file you are helping other download that illegal file. A personal recording which the TV network/content makers have licensed is very different from a pirate torrent.

I'm not sure if that's true.. maybe in the States, but certainly not here in the UK (as far as I'm aware) Every PVR I've ever owned has been really easy to copy the files off, no workarounds or cracks necessary. My current TV has a built in PVR which records to a USB hard drive, all I need to do is plug the drive in to my PC and there are all the files, correctly named and in AVI format. It was clearly designed to make this process very easy, and I'm sure they wouldn't have done so if it was illegal.

My opinion on torrenting TV shows, is that it's okay (ish) for BBC shows... I've paid my license fee, and there's no advertising on the BBC, so it doesn't feel like they're losing out.

Ahh I should clarify, Telstra is the ex-Govt owned tele-comunications company in Australia. A T-Box is a combination network hub, phone, tablet computer thingy they try to win people over to their pricey phone/internet packages. Digital free to air television is called Freeview here (I don't know why, I think it is just marketing the cancellation of the analogue signal and making sure people understand the possible upgrade paths). There are two types of PVR on the market those that are labelled Freeview and those that are not. The Freeview models, which are becoming more and more prevalent do not allow you to copy files off the HDD. By carrying the Freeview "brand" they are endorsed by the Australian TV broadcasters. As the OP was talking about Telstra I left out a bunch of background stuff because we are both Australian.

 

[Trolldor]

So after hearing countless ads regarding Teltra's latest and great new product the Telstra T-Hub (no that was not a plug) I've been thinking, one of the MAIN selling points of the damn thing is the ability to record live TV. Great that's a cool feature. On the topic there are dozens of DVD Recorders on the market, many with built in hard drives, allowing you to record all the TV and movies you want. Foxtel IQ (Australian cable) allows you to record any movie or tv show they play.

Yet when I go download a TV show via a torrent, because you know IT WON'T BE PLAYED ON AUSTRALIAN TV FOR AT LEAST 2-3 MONTHS IF EVER! I am technically breaking the law and costing these movie companies millions of dollars. But I can't see how the two are different. Ok they had to originally watch it with the ads and the network paid for it. They also paid for their recording device, but hey I paid for my computer, modem and internet connection. But you know what they do is fine, even though they're are usually the ones uploading these movies and TV shows to my torrent sites.

So Escapists, what is your opinion? Are they really that different? Or is recording via a legal device completely different and just fine?

It's permissable under some legal yak, and such things are only temporary. The system automatically deletes them after a time.

 

[TiefBlau]

It's not piracy until you give it to someone else.

As a sidenote, you're comparing recording devices, a method of acquiring video, to torrents, file-sharing software. That's a big difference.

If you wanna compare them though, neither of them are inherently illegal. If you share some freeware software over Bittorrent, more power to you. If you record a movie you saw on TV for your own leisure, that's your choice. You make it illegal if you decide to share some some of that recorded material.

 

[DefunctTheory]

Torrents: Shows that do not contribute to network ratings and give no revenue from Ads/network subscriptions.

Recordings: Shows that contribute to network ratings and give revenue from Ads/network subscriptions.