Poll: If a Tree falls in a forest...

[CosmicGrenade]

well i think the real question is - If a Tree falls in a forest, and noone is around to hear it fall, does anyone care?

 

[The Infamous Scamola]

Of course it does.

 

[Phase_9]

Better question, does it matter?

 

[Cowabungaa]

See, the problem is people dont think before they post, everyone is saying "yes of course" but sound by definition is vibrations that someone hears.. look it up.

So again, if noone is around to hear it, is it a sound?

I say no

Sound is a travelling wave which is an oscillation of pressure transmitted through a solid, liquid, or gas, composed of frequencies within the range of hearing and of a level sufficiently strong to be heard, or the sensation stimulated in organs of hearing by such vibrations.[1]

Not just what we can hear. Also remember that there are other sounds (ultrasound) that we can't hear, but are still there. Fact that we don't hear them doesn't mean they're not there.

 

[almaster88]

Check the Definition of sound please.. its vibrations being heard.

 

[AbsoluteVirtue18]

Yes it does. That's like saying that I fired a gun, but since the bullet didn't hit anyone, it was like it was never fired.

 

[fletch_talon]

No it doesn't, its a big tree conspiracy ooooooooooh.

Seriously though claiming that sound doesn't exist with nobody to hear it is like saying that the tree never fell in the first place because nobody saw it.

 

[Cowabungaa]

Check the Definition of sound please.. its vibrations being heard.

Little timewarp happend here (on the forum). Anyway, there are sound frequences we can't hear. Does that mean they don't exist? No. Sound is a vibration in the air, whereither they're picked up or not.

 

[AndyFromMonday]

Check the Definition of sound please.. its vibrations being heard.

That vibration will happen, even if it won't be heard.

 

[almaster88]

EXACTLY! How do you know?

 

[irrelevantnugget]

Oh lawd, I'm the only one so far that said no...

Philosophy professor went on about why there is no sound for about half an hour. He had a point, somewhere, even though I intuitively thought there would be sound.

Sounds is something that only exists when it is perceived by an organism, and each organism experiences it in a different way. 'Sound' might be just some energy moving around, but 'sound' has arbitrarily defined by humans, for humans, thus if it's not perceived, it cannot exist.

Something like that. I nearly fell asleep anyway.

 

[scarbunny]

I think the question is more a case of if no one hears it can the vibration be classed as a sound, considering sound is generally something you hear.

Sure it will create the standard vibrations and presure waves though.

 

[fix-the-spade]

See, the problem is people dont think before they post, everyone is saying "yes of course" but sound by definition is vibrations that someone hears.. look it up.

I did and:

Sound is a travelling wave which is an oscillation of pressure transmitted through a solid, liquid, or gas, composed of frequencies within the range of hearing and of a level sufficiently strong to be heard.

No mention that anyone has to be there, just that it has be strong enough to heard should anyone be present. If the tree falls it makes a sound, the fact that no-one was present to hear it is irrelevant, because if they had been there they would have heard the sound it made.

 

[DalekJaas]

I'd also like to mention that if the tree hits a mime, no-one cares.

(/obscure?)

hahahahahaha

 

[lenin_117]

You forgot to put an unknown option in the poll. Anyway, to the question.

Hypothetically, if the tree did not make a noise, how would you know? And if you aren't sure, how can you say with certainty that it does? So I think that it really should make a noise but you cannot be positively certain about it.

 

[Legion]

Yes it does. That's like saying that I fired a gun, but since the bullet didn't hit anyone, it was like it was never fired.

No it isn't, because you were there to witness it.

Which reminds me, here is a part in a Terry Pratchett book about something similar to this. Along the lines of things having to have a witness in order to exist.

 

[almaster88]

Oh lawd, I'm the only one so far that said no...

Philosophy professor went on about why there is no sound for about half an hour. He had a point, somewhere, even though I intuitively thought there would be sound.

Sounds is something that only exists when it is perceived by an organism, and each organism experiences it in a different way. 'Sound' might be just some energy moving around, but 'sound' has arbitrarily defined by humans, for humans, thus if it's not perceived, it cannot exist.

Something like that. I nearly fell asleep anyway.

See he gets it! Thats what I've been trying to say, thats what sound is, so if noone is there to hear it, logically its not making a "sound"

 

[GothmogII]

Oh lawd, I'm the only one so far that said no...

Philosophy professor went on about why there is no sound for about half an hour. He had a point, somewhere, even though I intuitively thought there would be sound.

Sounds is something that only exists when it is perceived by an organism, and each organism experiences it in a different way. 'Sound' might be just some energy moving around, but 'sound' has arbitrarily defined by humans, for humans, thus if it's not perceived, it cannot exist.

Something like that. I nearly fell asleep anyway.

So...I've I'm standing by the tree, and you're miles away, it doesn't exist because -you- didn't hear it? (Then again, for -you- it didn't exist, you didn't hear it, but that doesn't imply total non-existence does it? Would that be like having someone standing behind my back all the time but not knowing they were there? I mean, just because I don't know, doesn't mean they aren't there does it?)

 

[Rhayn]

This question is the main reason I was close to fail my philosophy course. I more or less answered with the quote that AvantVanguard posted, and I may or may not have hinted on the teacher being an idiot a few times. On reflection though, I was the only idiot there, considering I was in philosophy class and tried to answer with science.

 

[almaster88]

But as to that, the only way we know they existed is that humans, discovered it, otherwise we woulnt know they existed right? Therefor... I forgot, point is it wasnt a sound until we found out it was