Poll: Is featuring rape in a game going too far?
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It really depends on the situation and how it is played out. Is it going to be the wank fodder that is rapelay? Or is there a story reason why the rape is occurring? I don't think actually having the player be the rapist is very helpful and certainly not desirable, its far to easy to do it wrong and end up with a situation that either glorifies rape or is just plan hilarious (c.f. something like Urotsukidoji or La Blue Girl for when rapes become so ridiculous that they actual start to look funny). On the other hand cutscenes involving a third party being raped in the right context, say you come across soldiers raping a woman in a CoD style game could work. I was even thinking last night how powerful and shocking such a scene could be if committed on the actual player from a FP perspective. But this would really have to be done right and I don't think any publisher or developer would ever go far enough to actually make the scene worthwhile, they'd either play it for laughs or leave it so ambiguous that it might not as well be in there.
Its one of two possible bad endings. If you get in the cowgirl position with one of the girls she does stab you to death. Another ending is getting pushed in front of a train by your child if you don't abort any pregnancies that may occur.viking97 said:
Well, it really depends, if you make it a quicktime event (press X now to blow load in the face) would be too tasteless, but if rape can be done in film (excellent example: The Sopranos) then it can probably be done in games.
I wouldn't fancy it as a Gameplay mechanic, as part of the story, yea. Whatever.
Its the same as it being featured in a movie.
Its the same as it being featured in a movie.
Really? Ahem, Boys don't cry, She Fought Alone, The Accused, The Virgin Spring, Deliverance, American History X, the entire Rape/Revenge genre, Fat Girl, Lipstick, Born Innocent, Baise-Moi (translated as either Rape Me or Fuck Me, I believe Fuck Me is the more accurate translation), Kids, Straw Dogs, Thriller- a cruel picture, Ms-45. All of these films have featured rape as a central plot device and range from deep analysis of the after effects of a sexual assault to the mere exploitative. Rape is hardly new ground when it comes to film.SODAssault said:
Edit: So not a double post
I may be the only person who believes this but I actually think murder is a lesser crime than rape. You can only be murdered once but with rape you can relive it every day of you life.Denamic said:
So long as it's done in a mature way that's in keeping with the tone of a game, no. Of course it would have to adhere to the restrictions in place - it'd be the equivalent of an 18-rated film.
It seems a lot of people think that as a plot point it would be fine, but as a gameplay feature it would be wrong. I think there's a lot of potential being missed in this line of thought. You have to remember gameplay features don't have to bullet points on the box like "Awesome gunfights! Epic cinematic set pieces! Ultra realistic rape!"
An event can take place in gameplay without it being "encouraged" or trivialised. There's multiple ways rape could take place in gameplay and still be an effecting, powerful moment in the story.
1) You could be forced to do it - say, if the story put you in the shoes of the antagonist. It would be uncomfortable for the player, it would feel wrong, and it wouldn't be enjoyable in the slightest. Which, wouldn't you know it, are the kind of feelings you're aiming to invoke in a rape sequence. Discomfort, wrongness, etc. An example of how this sort of thing would work is featured in inFamous 2.
And if it was from the perspective of the antagonist, then the player's feelings of disgust with this character would create a genuine desire to put a stop to them when they finally get the opportunity, not just "he's the bad guy because the objective marker says so."
2) You could be the victim. The strip tease sequence from Heavy Rain provides a good example, your character in a situation they don't want to be in, and the player has a few options visible in front of them. As the sequence progresses, your options become less and less unless you find a way out of it in time.
A rape sequence in this form could present the feelings of helplessness and despair as you try every option you think of. Try to kick, it fails and your leg gets pinned down, try to grab an object but fail and lose the freedom to move that arm, etc. until you realise there's nothing you can do, you've been overpowered. Where interactivity presented you with hope, and options, the lack of it shows you that all you can do is watch and experience the horror of the situation until it's over.
An event can take place in gameplay without it being "encouraged" or trivialised. There's multiple ways rape could take place in gameplay and still be an effecting, powerful moment in the story.
1) You could be forced to do it - say, if the story put you in the shoes of the antagonist. It would be uncomfortable for the player, it would feel wrong, and it wouldn't be enjoyable in the slightest. Which, wouldn't you know it, are the kind of feelings you're aiming to invoke in a rape sequence. Discomfort, wrongness, etc. An example of how this sort of thing would work is featured in inFamous 2.
When playing the evil path in inFamous 2, you find yourself face to face with your best friend Zeke, who is determined to stand against you. You enter into a stand off, each aiming at the other and the game gives you two control options - Aim, and Fire. With no choice, you repeatedly shoot him until he can't get up, which you realise, is when he's dead. It's an effective moment that makes you feel horrible. A similar mechanic forcing the player to commit rape could likely invoke the same response.
And if it was from the perspective of the antagonist, then the player's feelings of disgust with this character would create a genuine desire to put a stop to them when they finally get the opportunity, not just "he's the bad guy because the objective marker says so."
2) You could be the victim. The strip tease sequence from Heavy Rain provides a good example, your character in a situation they don't want to be in, and the player has a few options visible in front of them. As the sequence progresses, your options become less and less unless you find a way out of it in time.
A rape sequence in this form could present the feelings of helplessness and despair as you try every option you think of. Try to kick, it fails and your leg gets pinned down, try to grab an object but fail and lose the freedom to move that arm, etc. until you realise there's nothing you can do, you've been overpowered. Where interactivity presented you with hope, and options, the lack of it shows you that all you can do is watch and experience the horror of the situation until it's over.
Point goes to the Brits in that video.
First off, most amounts of censorship are a strict can-not-have, so I would not say that any game should be banned or stopped by the government just because it contains, or even features, rape.
That being said, I would not play a game that contains rape as anything more than a plot point or minor content. If it is graphically displayed in any way, treated as a good thing, or treated as something that shouldn't inspire me to be very mad (at the characters in game) then I am not going to continue to tolerate it. But that is for me. Other people consider these things much more "fair game" than I do, and they have the right to consume the content they want.
Even people who get a sexual thrill from a game like RapeLay or what have you: go forth and prosper, I say. All the better if it keeps anyone from choosing to go out and actually do something like that.
First off, most amounts of censorship are a strict can-not-have, so I would not say that any game should be banned or stopped by the government just because it contains, or even features, rape.
That being said, I would not play a game that contains rape as anything more than a plot point or minor content. If it is graphically displayed in any way, treated as a good thing, or treated as something that shouldn't inspire me to be very mad (at the characters in game) then I am not going to continue to tolerate it. But that is for me. Other people consider these things much more "fair game" than I do, and they have the right to consume the content they want.
Even people who get a sexual thrill from a game like RapeLay or what have you: go forth and prosper, I say. All the better if it keeps anyone from choosing to go out and actually do something like that.
Totally dependent on the situation.
I find it odd that I can run around as a totally murderous ax crazy loony in so many games yet the trope RAPE IS A SPECIAL KIND OF EVIL still carries a lot of weight.
Hell in Red Dead Redemption I could tie people to train tracks and watch them get run over. Yet something that evil just gets shrugged at.
As a medium I think that games should explore everything about life just like other mediums do. If we outlaw or ban certain things I think that games are never going to be taken seriously.
IE: Part of what the City Elf Origin so powerful in Dragon Age was how Shiani is raped by Vaughan and his friends. To me there were few moments as emotional in the entire game as that.
Do I support rape as a mechanic? err No.
Do I support rape as a part of story or something like that? Yes.
TV, movies, books, and other forms of media do it so why cant games?
I find it odd that I can run around as a totally murderous ax crazy loony in so many games yet the trope RAPE IS A SPECIAL KIND OF EVIL still carries a lot of weight.
Hell in Red Dead Redemption I could tie people to train tracks and watch them get run over. Yet something that evil just gets shrugged at.
As a medium I think that games should explore everything about life just like other mediums do. If we outlaw or ban certain things I think that games are never going to be taken seriously.
IE: Part of what the City Elf Origin so powerful in Dragon Age was how Shiani is raped by Vaughan and his friends. To me there were few moments as emotional in the entire game as that.
Do I support rape as a mechanic? err No.
Do I support rape as a part of story or something like that? Yes.
TV, movies, books, and other forms of media do it so why cant games?
No, thanks. Violence and power is the theme of games from play fights in school yards to chess but rape is a whole different thing. Rape is sexual violence. (And though I appreciate the OP's note about rape victim status being open to men too we know what this would most likely involve don't we? - female characters being raped). So yes, I think you can draw a line at sexual assault being a regular part of gameplay. I even think we can do without it in plots - it's clichéd and it's lazy, saving someone from writing a decent story for a female character (with the exception of Lady Snowblood that is).
But how about this - what if your (male) playable character got raped in the game? maybe even regularly? Would that add to your fun? How would that sell?
But how about this - what if your (male) playable character got raped in the game? maybe even regularly? Would that add to your fun? How would that sell?
Personally, I hold the same opinion as Bennett the Sage on featuring such controversial topics such as 'rape' and 'child death' in video games.
That opinion is that such depictions of horrific, gratuitous violence and despicable behavior often brings the entire story to a complete and grinding halt, and that featuring them better have a damn GOOD reason for why it's there, a type of symbolic or philosophical symbolism that contributes to the overall story or theme that the game is trying to present. If it's there for shock value, imo, then you've gone too far and you've lost my respect. If it's incorporated in a way that it makes the experience more enriching and makes the person think (something that I'd expect Silent Hill to pull off if it ever did something like this), then I think it's well deserved.
But I haven't seen any game so far that has featured any of the two in an enlightening light, so it's really situational as to whether rape should be in a game, but given the relative maturity of the video game industry right now, I don't think it should be in any game.
That opinion is that such depictions of horrific, gratuitous violence and despicable behavior often brings the entire story to a complete and grinding halt, and that featuring them better have a damn GOOD reason for why it's there, a type of symbolic or philosophical symbolism that contributes to the overall story or theme that the game is trying to present. If it's there for shock value, imo, then you've gone too far and you've lost my respect. If it's incorporated in a way that it makes the experience more enriching and makes the person think (something that I'd expect Silent Hill to pull off if it ever did something like this), then I think it's well deserved.
But I haven't seen any game so far that has featured any of the two in an enlightening light, so it's really situational as to whether rape should be in a game, but given the relative maturity of the video game industry right now, I don't think it should be in any game.
Of course not: Murder is more morally reprehensible than rape, and that's often featured.
The question is, respect, and marketability. If the subject matter is treated respectfully and insightfully, it could bring the medium forward. If the matter is tasteless and simply offensive, then it wouldn't sell.
It would offend me to play the game: But it's a vocational activity. No-one is forcing you to buy or play games, and you can vote with your wallet as to what you want to be created. If someone makes a game you don't like, don't buy it. It's that simple.
The question is, respect, and marketability. If the subject matter is treated respectfully and insightfully, it could bring the medium forward. If the matter is tasteless and simply offensive, then it wouldn't sell.
It would offend me to play the game: But it's a vocational activity. No-one is forcing you to buy or play games, and you can vote with your wallet as to what you want to be created. If someone makes a game you don't like, don't buy it. It's that simple.
First of all, no censorship in any media ever, for any reason. If it exists, we should deal with it. Hiding it isn't going to make it go away.
Secondly, I think it should be done, but carefully (obviously). The only reason games are allowed to display such insane amounts of violence is because we publicly worship violence and conflict as means to and end, but any form of sexual interaction is still somewhat taboo in public. A rape game could be used to help victims deal with trauma, to regain control of the situation by playing the rapist etc. I don't know if these are valid suggestions since I'm not a psychologist, but I know that repressing things don't make them go away. It could let a potential rapist live out his (or hers I guess) fantasies, and perhaps even prevent them from actually acting on them. These are just ideas, but like any topic, rape becomes less shameful and traumatizing the more you talk about it and try to deal with it instead of pretending it doesn't exist.
Secondly, I think it should be done, but carefully (obviously). The only reason games are allowed to display such insane amounts of violence is because we publicly worship violence and conflict as means to and end, but any form of sexual interaction is still somewhat taboo in public. A rape game could be used to help victims deal with trauma, to regain control of the situation by playing the rapist etc. I don't know if these are valid suggestions since I'm not a psychologist, but I know that repressing things don't make them go away. It could let a potential rapist live out his (or hers I guess) fantasies, and perhaps even prevent them from actually acting on them. These are just ideas, but like any topic, rape becomes less shameful and traumatizing the more you talk about it and try to deal with it instead of pretending it doesn't exist.
It depends entirely on how it's handled.
If games are to be taken seriously as an artistic medium then they need to address the same problems that all other media have addressed, and this includes rape. Hell, Lolita managed to make paedophilic rape a protagonist activity, so one day games will do the same.
But, if it's something like rapelay, where it's being treated as, well, as the Japanese porn industry treats rape, then it's going too far. Japanese porn has a weird relationship with rape anyway, so they are not the standard to go by.
Look at games like Fahrenheit (or Indigo Prophecy if you're American) that had you playing as a murderer for most of the game, and actually tried to show how murder can affect people, and how it's treated by the cops etc. Saw what you like about the game, but before the ancient prophecies got involved it was a very interesting and sometimes quite scary game.
That sort of depiction of rape, with the consequences being explored very maturely, would be fine.
If games are to be taken seriously as an artistic medium then they need to address the same problems that all other media have addressed, and this includes rape. Hell, Lolita managed to make paedophilic rape a protagonist activity, so one day games will do the same.
But, if it's something like rapelay, where it's being treated as, well, as the Japanese porn industry treats rape, then it's going too far. Japanese porn has a weird relationship with rape anyway, so they are not the standard to go by.
Look at games like Fahrenheit (or Indigo Prophecy if you're American) that had you playing as a murderer for most of the game, and actually tried to show how murder can affect people, and how it's treated by the cops etc. Saw what you like about the game, but before the ancient prophecies got involved it was a very interesting and sometimes quite scary game.
That sort of depiction of rape, with the consequences being explored very maturely, would be fine.
I'm really all for the complete use of every single action we are capable in videogames. Do i believe rape should be in video games? yes, actually i whole heart-idly do. it sure as sin is gonna get some flak for it, but if handled maturely it shall be fine. i mean if it's a minigame in say grand theft auto where you can drag a woman to the back ali push her up against a wall or car then rape her against her will, then kill her. thats a little uncontextual. But if it was put into a situation like say, james's in silent hill 2. where he meets a attractive woman and the battered psychology of his mind and the place have screwed him up more then he already was, and his combatant sexual frustrating practically oozing from his every move finally gets a hold of him and he viciously rapes someone. that would make the story so much deeper, scarier and terrible, but engrossing none the less.
i have the same stance on killing children in games except for slightly more open. simple reply to this one, children are people, people are living, living things can die. no exceptions. simple as that. I'm not a child murderer nor would i promote it in real life, but I'm sick of people trying to justify murder in games with morality or war, or age. if your killing people your still killing people, simple as that.
But you know what, I'll make a context for child killing in games. Take the Vietnam war for example, so many of the soldiers in Vietnam were kids or teens. any game that takes place in Vietnam never shows the children the American's were shooting at. think of juxtaposition's that could be made with that simple addition.
i have the same stance on killing children in games except for slightly more open. simple reply to this one, children are people, people are living, living things can die. no exceptions. simple as that. I'm not a child murderer nor would i promote it in real life, but I'm sick of people trying to justify murder in games with morality or war, or age. if your killing people your still killing people, simple as that.
But you know what, I'll make a context for child killing in games. Take the Vietnam war for example, so many of the soldiers in Vietnam were kids or teens. any game that takes place in Vietnam never shows the children the American's were shooting at. think of juxtaposition's that could be made with that simple addition.