Poll: Is it inaccurate or offensive to call Anime "Cartoons"

[Chemical Alia]

They're just cartoons, any justification made to separate them into another category of entertainment sounds to me like some highly nerdy elitism. Style, pacing, intended audience, etc. may be different, but it's all the same shit and not worthy of some honorable distinction.

 

[xdom125x]

I personaly think anime shouldn't be called cartoons just because they both fall under animation but there should be a supertrope term for both.

 

[Pyro Paul]

what the word means in modern usage is 'Short, simple, and unrefined'

the problem is every one else is appending on additional terms which don't belong, which is why you need to bring up history and etymology.

Got a source for that? Otherwise, quit trolling. You're not directly breaking any of the rules, but you are most definitely being a highly successful troll. I'm done responding to you, because you aren't going to change your opinion. You'd have to be arguing from a position of logic to do that.

Spoiler: and for anyone who is still arguing with this guy, remember

i got it from a 'History of Art' text book which was going over the subject of 'Modello'
unfortunatly, the title of the book is simply 'History of Art' so i can't exactly point you to any specific text book.

as much as i hate quoting wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modello

"Cartoon", named for the sturdy cartone paper on which they were generally executed, is usually used of working drawings, often at full scale, but the distinction is not a firm one, and the terms cartoon and working drawing are often used interchangeably.

In the text book it goes over the evolution of life drawing and the capturing of motion in illistration starting with Gesture drawing then continuing to Modello which is effectively the same thing but for more structured art such as painting, stain glass, or Mosaic. 'cartoons' where defined by my teacher as being the 'blue print' or 'sketch' to a painting.

 

[Pyro Paul]

... hate to break it to you...

but here in america, we call 'soccer' soccer.
Every where else in the world calls it 'FootBall'

why should i consider your in put if you can't even get that right?

Do you even know Why they call it 'Soccer' here in America, Canada, and Australia while it is 'football' in Europe and Africa?

Regardless of which way you say it or why they are called two different things my point still stands because they ARE the same game. It is just called something different in two different regions.

You havnt actually said anything at all to refute my point and instead are attacking a non relevent aspect of what I said. Im going to take this as you are trying to reject the reality of what you read and your this was your only escape since you cant the truth. Dont worry though yours is a common tactic among people who have lost a discussion but refuse to admit it.

probably because i've refuted that point several times over 12 pages and am a bit aggrivated that you don't take the time to read through the discussion before trying to attack me with a point i've already adressed.

simply said.
Cartoon does not Mean Animation.
So you can not use the word interchangably.

Cartoons are a subcatagory of animation...

to call Anime cartoons is like calling 'Football' 'Hockey'

 

[RevRaptor]

Pokemon is an Anime, i class that as a Cartoon same as Digimon or DragonBall Z...however things like this

http://www.spawn.com/toys/spawn/series27/spawni131/images/series27_spawni131_concept_01_dp.jpg

Are clearly different...i know it's still Anime, but i would never call it a Cartoon

Actually, it's not an anime at all. If you look at the signature, it's a Todd McFarlane comic book -- you know, the guy who did Spawn. That thing came from somewhere in the west.

honestly any one who makes a fuss when you call an anime a cartoon needs to get a life. Anime is just Japan's word for cartoon. I've been a fan of asian cartoons from way back, when I first started watching them the movies were called manga, because manga entertainment was the only company importing them hence manga. Now if you do that the fan boys get all angry because apparently only the comics are called manga. Bet most of them don't even know where the term comes from.

?

It's the Japanese word for comic books, just like "anime" is the Japanese word for animation. U.S. Manga was and still is an awesome distributor of Japanese animation, but it didn't invent the word.

Sigh, Alright I'll explain how we ended up calling them manga's in the west.

Firstly: manga is not Japanese for comic it translates as whimsical drawings and was originally a form of drawn entertainment that was around way before comics, so when comics came to Japan it seemed natural to call them manga's

2nd: I never said manga entertainment made up the term (learn to read).
What I said is at the time they were the only ones importing anime so to us in the west it seemed natural to call the movies manga's like how photocopies are called xerox's.

3rd: I'm right you're wrong I was a fan of anime back when the only way to get it was to order it direct from manga entertament, you simply could not buy it in stores. Another reason we called it manga, the damn magazines called it manga too. It's simply a fact that way back when the movies were also called manga in the west.

4th: I get that comics are called manga now, hell I never refer to animes as manga anymore but I'm not going to make a fuss if someone does.

5th: I've been a fan of anime for about 22 years now. Long before it was mainstream and was very hard to get, I remember every one calling them manga's I guessing you were still crapping you nappies back then.

There explained it, feel better now?

I'm not denying that people incorrectly called the animation Manga because of the company that distributed it. It actually makes a lot of sense -- I know Streamline pictures referred to their dubs as video comics, so it's not too far out to think that US Manga influenced a lot of people to call it Manga. But Manga is the word for comic book in Japan. It may mean "whimsical drawings" literally, but then so does "comic."

According to wikipedia, it has referred to cartoons (in the newspaper sense) since the 18th century, and it has referred to the modern form of Manga since the 19th century.

Etymology

The Japanese word manga, literally translated, means "whimsical drawings". The word first came into common usage in the late 18th century with the publication of such works as Santō Kyōden's picturebook Shiji no yukikai (1798), and in the early 19th century with such works as Aikawa Minwa's Manga hyakujo (1814) and the celebrated Hokusai Manga books (1814?1834) containing assorted drawings from the sketchbooks of the famous ukiyo-e artist Hokusai.[14] Rakuten Kitazawa (1876?1955) first used the word "manga" in the modern sense.[15]

true true but the word cartoon is also from print, cartoons were in newspapers long before animated cartoons is this really any different. after all anime/cartoons are just moving drawings right?

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

what the word means in modern usage is 'Short, simple, and unrefined'

the problem is every one else is appending on additional terms which don't belong, which is why you need to bring up history and etymology.

Got a source for that? Otherwise, quit trolling. You're not directly breaking any of the rules, but you are most definitely being a highly successful troll. I'm done responding to you, because you aren't going to change your opinion. You'd have to be arguing from a position of logic to do that.

Spoiler: and for anyone who is still arguing with this guy, remember

i got it from a 'History of Art' text book which was going over the subject of 'Modello'
unfortunatly, the title of the book is simply 'History of Art' so i can't exactly point you to any specific text book.

as much as i hate quoting wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modello

"Cartoon", named for the sturdy cartone paper on which they were generally executed, is usually used of working drawings, often at full scale, but the distinction is not a firm one, and the terms cartoon and working drawing are often used interchangeably.

In the text book it goes over the evolution of life drawing and the capturing of motion in illistration starting with Gesture drawing then continuing to Modello which is effectively the same thing but for more structured art such as painting, stain glass, or Mosaic. 'cartoons' where defined by my teacher as being the 'blue print' or 'sketch' to a painting.

Okay, so you've given the print comic definition of a cartoon... again. Nobody here has refuted that definition. But what does that have to do with the definition in regards to animation? More importantly, you gave a source for the wrong question; I asked for a source on your definition of a cartoon as "Short, simple, and unrefined," which you really haven't provided. Under that definition, a short person with down syndrome and bad table manners could be (offensively, but accurately under the definition) called a "cartoon."

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

Pokemon is an Anime, i class that as a Cartoon same as Digimon or DragonBall Z...however things like this

http://www.spawn.com/toys/spawn/series27/spawni131/images/series27_spawni131_concept_01_dp.jpg

Are clearly different...i know it's still Anime, but i would never call it a Cartoon

Actually, it's not an anime at all. If you look at the signature, it's a Todd McFarlane comic book -- you know, the guy who did Spawn. That thing came from somewhere in the west.

honestly any one who makes a fuss when you call an anime a cartoon needs to get a life. Anime is just Japan's word for cartoon. I've been a fan of asian cartoons from way back, when I first started watching them the movies were called manga, because manga entertainment was the only company importing them hence manga. Now if you do that the fan boys get all angry because apparently only the comics are called manga. Bet most of them don't even know where the term comes from.

?

It's the Japanese word for comic books, just like "anime" is the Japanese word for animation. U.S. Manga was and still is an awesome distributor of Japanese animation, but it didn't invent the word.

Sigh, Alright I'll explain how we ended up calling them manga's in the west.

Firstly: manga is not Japanese for comic it translates as whimsical drawings and was originally a form of drawn entertainment that was around way before comics, so when comics came to Japan it seemed natural to call them manga's

2nd: I never said manga entertainment made up the term (learn to read).
What I said is at the time they were the only ones importing anime so to us in the west it seemed natural to call the movies manga's like how photocopies are called xerox's.

3rd: I'm right you're wrong I was a fan of anime back when the only way to get it was to order it direct from manga entertament, you simply could not buy it in stores. Another reason we called it manga, the damn magazines called it manga too. It's simply a fact that way back when the movies were also called manga in the west.

4th: I get that comics are called manga now, hell I never refer to animes as manga anymore but I'm not going to make a fuss if someone does.

5th: I've been a fan of anime for about 22 years now. Long before it was mainstream and was very hard to get, I remember every one calling them manga's I guessing you were still crapping you nappies back then.

There explained it, feel better now?

I'm not denying that people incorrectly called the animation Manga because of the company that distributed it. It actually makes a lot of sense -- I know Streamline pictures referred to their dubs as video comics, so it's not too far out to think that US Manga influenced a lot of people to call it Manga. But Manga is the word for comic book in Japan. It may mean "whimsical drawings" literally, but then so does "comic."

According to wikipedia, it has referred to cartoons (in the newspaper sense) since the 18th century, and it has referred to the modern form of Manga since the 19th century.

Etymology

The Japanese word manga, literally translated, means "whimsical drawings". The word first came into common usage in the late 18th century with the publication of such works as Santō Kyōden's picturebook Shiji no yukikai (1798), and in the early 19th century with such works as Aikawa Minwa's Manga hyakujo (1814) and the celebrated Hokusai Manga books (1814?1834) containing assorted drawings from the sketchbooks of the famous ukiyo-e artist Hokusai.[14] Rakuten Kitazawa (1876?1955) first used the word "manga" in the modern sense.[15]

true true but the word cartoon is also from print, cartoons were in newspapers long before animated cartoons is this really any different. after all anime/cartoons are just moving drawings right?

Well, yeah, but that's what the word means in English; my understanding of the Japanese terminology is that Manga always refers to print comics, while Anime exclusively refers to animation. Imagine if, in English, the word "cartoon" never picked up the "animated cartoon" definition, and we instead referred to all such works as "animated shorts" or "animated series." That's my understanding of how the words work in Japanese. Take this with a grain of salt, though, because I don't actually speak Japanese; "anime" and "manga" just happen to be a couple of the few words of the language I know.

 

[Blindswordmaster]

animated cartoon
 
?noun
a motion picture consisting of a sequence of drawings, each so slightly different that when filmed and run through a projector the figures seem to move.

The dictionary says that anime are cartoons.

That definition is not for 'Animated Cartoons'
that is a definition for 'Cel Animation'

a Animated Cartoon is a simplistic exaggerated illistrated short animated film (7-15 minutes) with little plot or point.

cartoon itself is synonomous with short and simplistic.
such as the cartoon strips on news papers as they always are only 2-3 frames and often only presented in Black and white line drawings.

But modern animation descends from this technique, thus making anime a cartoon by process.

 

[CrazyMedic]

well I think they technically are cartoons but there is such a vast difference between the too it would be like call a tank a car ok they are both motorized vehicles but one has a big as gun and rolls on tracks rather than wheels.

It would be more akin to comparing a PZVI Tiger to the M4 Sherman. Sure, one's much more refined and intricately designed, with the other being cheaper/faster to make, with different intentions for each (in this case it's survivability and gun power Vs "fill the firld with tanks and more tanks" attitude) but they're both essentially Tanks.

Sure, you can say Anime is more intricate and refined, with deeper storylines and better(more effort put into) characterisation, but this doesn't stop it being Animated Drawings.
Same as a cartoon.
Both are Animated Drawings.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/animation
Imparting motion or activity.

The reason people don't like the words being interchanged has more to do with intent- a large amount of "anime" are directed at teens/older, where many (if not most) western cartoons are aimed at children. The fans don't like their more "mature" cartoons being "tarred with the same brush" so to speak, as the Looney Toons or Flintstones.
That, I would guess, is why people get offended when you confuse the two.

I find it more fun outright mocking the more terrible "westernised" anime, because the kind of person who'll stick up for a genre regardless of the awfulness of a particular example, really needs to be taken down a peg.
For the British out there, try pronouncing the Z in Dragonball Z as "Zed" instead of "Zee" in front of any anime fans you know.
Watch the rage climb >

I am more saying that it is better to speak in a way that people know what you are talking about if someone says "want to watch cartoons"I Think daffy duck so I would say you should just use anime to refer to anime there is no point in doing otherwise.