Poll: Let's Get Some Honesty, Shall We? (Regarding Big Breasts/Sexy Female Game Characters)
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I don't hate them on all designs but sometimes a moderate sized rack or even a small one looks better when accompanied with certain faces, hair styles, and asses. That said by "Big" i mean like Samara from Mass Effect or something in that ballpark. Any bigger and it actually begins to become unattractive to me. I personally hate the designs of a lot of the DOA girls and found the Dragon's Crown sorceress to be pretty damn ugly.
The thing is, not only does it look ridiculous, it makes me feel uneasy because I know it's supposed to be marketed at me. Look, I like huge boobs, I have no limit. I like pornstars with stupidly huge boobs (oh sweet Hitomi Tanaka) and I will sample breast expansion hentai till the cows come home. But that's all purely sexual stuff, with no other merits.
On the other hand, when I am playing a game, and I'm being pandered too by some stupidly over proportioned female, designed specifically to try and get my rocks off, I start bearing the game ill will, especially if it does actually turn me on. Being turned on by that sort of stuff, would be like me enjoying an Adam Sandler movie. It genuinely makes me feel like a worse person, because I'm so against this sort of stuff that's so prevalent. That and if you genuinely enjoy Adam Sandler movies, I need know no more about you, your sense of humour is that of a 2 year old and even then they've got better taste.
And because it gets done and you have people complaining quite loudly when the women aint sexy enough (Femshep comes to mind.."Wahh she's too capable and not sexy, why doesn't she seduce her enemies like some badly acting pornstar?!", yes that was a real complaint), it just perpetuates vapid incapable over sexualized women, and we barely get any decent female characters.
I mean seriously we have like what...Yuna, Alyx, Samus, Jade, Terra and Femshep? Plus the female characters in GoW to a certain degree, which is very surprising the testosterone fuelled fest that it is, but they're hardly iconic.
I mean that scene in ME1 where she picks up Kaiden with one hand, throws him over her shoulder and makes her the way to the ship all while still blasting Geth? Gotta admit, total turn on.
On the other hand, when I am playing a game, and I'm being pandered too by some stupidly over proportioned female, designed specifically to try and get my rocks off, I start bearing the game ill will, especially if it does actually turn me on. Being turned on by that sort of stuff, would be like me enjoying an Adam Sandler movie. It genuinely makes me feel like a worse person, because I'm so against this sort of stuff that's so prevalent. That and if you genuinely enjoy Adam Sandler movies, I need know no more about you, your sense of humour is that of a 2 year old and even then they've got better taste.
And because it gets done and you have people complaining quite loudly when the women aint sexy enough (Femshep comes to mind.."Wahh she's too capable and not sexy, why doesn't she seduce her enemies like some badly acting pornstar?!", yes that was a real complaint), it just perpetuates vapid incapable over sexualized women, and we barely get any decent female characters.
I mean seriously we have like what...Yuna, Alyx, Samus, Jade, Terra and Femshep? Plus the female characters in GoW to a certain degree, which is very surprising the testosterone fuelled fest that it is, but they're hardly iconic.
Yeah that was the thing, it was impossible for me to play as BroShep, as not only was he boring as all buggery in every aspect, none of the females in that game really fit my type, (Sam was pretty cool actually, but she's a lesbian, and my FemShep was with Thane), I mean I think FemShep is a great character through and through, and should be the measuring stick of a great female character, but I'd be lying if I didn't think she was damn damn hot. But shes sexy in a totally organic way, true ME3 default FemShep is attractive, but it's not conventional, and she never gets any pandering shots or moments of sexualization, she's sexy on her own basis as a well developed character, has moments of softness when appropriate, and never feels any less capable than BroShep.CloudAtlas said:
I mean that scene in ME1 where she picks up Kaiden with one hand, throws him over her shoulder and makes her the way to the ship all while still blasting Geth? Gotta admit, total turn on.
Yeah I mostly liked the Mass Effect series and I agree it feels kind of weird to give Bioware crap for its sexualization in that game considering how many other things they got right that almost no one else ever bothers with. The armor change between 1 and 2 mostly just feels like a 2 steps forward 1 step back kind of thing, they improved overall, but this one decision was really bizarre going from realistic armor to catsuits and belt bras.CloudAtlas said:
My only real problems with the ME series (outside gameplay and story stuff, but this isn't the topic for that), was the camera, the stepback in armor (and only for combat missions, I don't care if the characters are in weird clothes around the ship), and the gratuitous ass, lip, and breast implants they gave Ashley in ME3.
For all the crap Bioware gets, they at least seem to make an attempt to cater to their female audience.
They don't attract me. I'd rather have a character with a personality and history, that makes me find them attractive, or encourages me to get to know them.
If people outright try to sell their media (whether it be anything, from games to books to movies) simply with the fact that some female character somewhere has large mammary glands, then yes, I do have a problem with that.
If people outright try to sell their media (whether it be anything, from games to books to movies) simply with the fact that some female character somewhere has large mammary glands, then yes, I do have a problem with that.
CONTEXT.... there it means everything. So big breasts and action with the CONTEXT of a kamp self aware action game is not a big deal, in fact I find it quite enjoyable. Every woman having big breasts JUST BECAUSE... is honestly tiresome. Just from a sheer perspective of my personal taste in women, I like to see more moderate and realistic builds, idealized but believable. STILL I don't demand it in every character or put it above having a character when they're suppose to matter in the context of the story.
STILL.... CONTEXT... context is everything.
STILL.... CONTEXT... context is everything.
I think that a sexy female character does not equal big breasts. They can have a nice ass and face too. Seriously though, personality and bravery is pretty damn sexy. A hardass female character is more sexy to me than one with large breasts.
Nilin is one of my favourite female videogame characters, and it's not because of her looks. It's because of her monologues, where she shows some serious thought and personality, like few other females in modern games.
<spoiler=Although, I will say>
Alice from Madness Returns is still the sexiest female character I know, in any game. It's not really because of her looks either. Normally I don't care for brunettes at all. She has a strong personality, and is both intriguing and insane.
Also, I was number 666 on the vote. lol
Nilin is one of my favourite female videogame characters, and it's not because of her looks. It's because of her monologues, where she shows some serious thought and personality, like few other females in modern games.
<spoiler=Although, I will say>
Alice from Madness Returns is still the sexiest female character I know, in any game. It's not really because of her looks either. Normally I don't care for brunettes at all. She has a strong personality, and is both intriguing and insane.
Also, I was number 666 on the vote. lol
Certainly at times people are seeing sexism when it isn't there. But merely pointing out something is sexist doesn't even mean you necessarily want it gone, it means you want people to acknowledge it's sexist. Quite a lot of time sexism happens because people don't think or are so used to the old tropes they don't question it.generals3 said:
It's possible to like something and acknowledge it has issues. Or that it's over-represented.
And don't act like 'the other side' doesn't like taking moral high-ground. I'm sick and tired of any criticism of depiction of sexuality being met with accusations of censorship and trying to stifle free speech. Or hating sexuality. Or lying, because obviously everyone must find huge boobs sexy.
My first playthrough was as BroShep, and I agree, he was a bit boring. He was your everyday white, thirty-something, one-liner loving soldier guy, just the stereotype that is complained about all the time. And, yea, none of the potential female love interests is a perfect feminist fantasy. Samara and Aria could have been, at least in character, but they were not available. Then again, I think it was pretty bold to design a female love interest whose face is unknown for the most part of the whole series.elvor0 said:
But FemShep, she's just great. She's attractive, but never sexualized, and more than anything, she's capable. I guess that's what you can get when you make the gender of your protagonist flexible.
Yea, she too received a makeover from part 2 to 3, and it didn't exactly make her less attractive either, but what are you gonna do? I can hardly complain about her finally getting a custom face, like BroShep had all along.
2013's Lara Croft, I like her a great deal as well. I payed really close attention but I don't think she was sexualized a single time in the whole game - Lara Croft, of all characters. She's, of course, also smart, very capable, and grows as character. Sexualization in this game, a game that puts his heroine through such an ordeal, would have been so problematic, a game which puts his heroine through such an ordeal. The very last emotion you should want to elicit in moments where someone is so visibly suffering is "damn, I want to bang her". That just doesn't mix well, and I really can't commend the developers enough for this.
... and to a big, and sometimes overlooked, share of their male audience too. I feel the same way about criticizing BioWare here as you do, but I believe they know how to put this criticism in perspective. It's not like they don't receive a lot of praise for what they did right as well - often it's even from the same people. Like us.EternallyBored said:
I've got no problem with it. Honestly, these people getting up in arms over it are silly. There's a place in video games for sex appeal characters, even over the top ones, and a place for serious female characters. And if you can't understand that these fictional characters are nothing like women in reality, then you have a problem. That said, variety in designs is the best way to go.
But usually sexism is brought up as an argument why something should either stop or be less present.Lieju said:
And yes it's possible to acknowledge something has issue or that it is over-represented. But when you're trying to make it look like it's somehow harming society no really good debate can come out of it (mainly when those claims are unbacked hypotheses). It becomes a silly fight about who can claim the highest moral superiority. And no one wins in such debates.
And true the other side sometimes try to take the moral high ground. But what else can they do? They're hopelessly trying to level the playing field. There was a time when this was much less present, and that time seem to weirdly coincide with the times where people wouldn't pull a "sexism" everytime they complain about sexualization or whatever.
Bringing up the sexism card all the time merely hurts the debate and entrenches both sides in extremes. And the vast majority "who don't care" (as this poll can show) retreat out of the trench war.
mm, good point, I'd forgotten about TR 2013, as much as I enjoyed it at the time. I agree, it makes it even more remarkable when you take into account the fact we're dealing with Lara Croft, gamings first major sex symbol. Major kudus to Rihanna Pratchett on that game, and the actual developers for not doing anything that might be considered distasteful. Especially after that dubious uproar about the supposed "rape" scene. I suppose it does have the advantage of being written by a female, so she's going to write a more in line with reality female character, but then that means nothing, as some of the best writers in the biz are female.CloudAtlas said:
On it's own merits, the only problem I had was the huge disconnect between story and gameplay at some points, like Lara freaking out about having shot one guy, then blowing through hundreds of the fuckers without so much as batting an eyelid, I felt they could've done better to make it a gradual thing, perhaps with more stealth for the first half or third, but that's difficult to work around for mainstream games. I will say however, I don't think it was a very good TOMB RAIDER game, if you catch my drift, too much shooting, not enough tombs and puzzle solving. But on it's own merits, very enjoyable, especially the battle up to the Monastery with all the risen Samurai
Fire arrows and swords you say? I've got a fucking assault rifle with napalm grenades, fucking 'ave it! Hopefully TR2 will have more tomb raiding and whatnot. I'd like to see Verna Von Croy make a return for sure.
Have you seen everyone's tiny heads in that game? The only one who doesn't is the withered corpse looking beggar and maybe the dwarf but there's so much beard it's practically a cape so it's hard to tell. Elf is by far the worst offender of that but she has the hood and twin tails to draw attention away from that. I think the artist is covering up for a case of same-face on the ladies.Loop Stricken said:
Everything about that game is ludicrous and overblown examples in a send up of the director's childhood of D&D, Conan the Barbarian, Capcom brawlers and fantasy tropes in general. It might just be me, but that's the feeling I got out of it the entire time, that it was intentionally hyperbolic and that was the point... until someone in marketing thought it was totally sincere and honest. I guess that might be a sign of the poor state of this industry that that would happen in the first place, but I find it weird that THIS was the game that made people cry foul more than a few games in recent memory with completely straight uses of similarly built women.
Reminds me of Bayonetta where a lot of people thought it was built to be titillation and bashed it while comparing it to God of War since they're both action games(though I'd argue GoW is a musou game, but that's off topic) But God of War is a game that most certainly is straight faced in its objectification, without batting an eye at the irony.
Oh, it was the perfect Tomb Raider game - for me. Because I don't care much about solving riddles and raiding tombs, and even less about supernatural stuff and magic artifacts and vengeful gods and all that. That's just not my cup of tea, and, yea, pretty much the reason why I never played a Tomb Raider game before. And because I, of course, always condemned the sexualized portrayal of Lara Croft, even as a 13 year old buy. True story!elvor0 said:I will say however, I don't think it was a very good TOMB RAIDER game, if you catch my drift, too much shooting, not enough tombs and puzzle solving. But on it's own merits, very enjoyable, especially the battle up to the Monastery with all the risen Samurai
For me, it was simply an action adventure, carried first and foremost by the journey of its heroine. And the landscapes were really beautiful too, for a current-gen game.