Poll: Nintendo pulls ahead

[Guffe]

That's a rather bold statement.

You can't win a race when you're the only horse on the track.

Of course you can! but you can also lose... ;D

On Topic:

I won't go into winning and losing and the "battle between consoles" because I think the whole thing is BS

People buy the consoles they want because of a few facts.
1) They had the earlier console and liked it, so they stick with the same company
2) The games they like to play are on said console
3) You buy a console you think suits you best (new gamers)
4) Someone gets more than one console to get all the games
5) Most likely there are very very many more reasons

Let people buy the console they want, let them play it and YOU stick to your console and be happy with that. I have a WiiU, most of my friends have Xbox360 and a few the PS3. Do we hate each other? No we don't, we relish the opportunity to try games on each others consoles that we can't play on our own.

Then there's one more thing, stop thinking about the other consoles as a bad thing for the one you prefer! We have 3 big companies at the moment in the gaming world (consoles) and these 3 are competing with each other. Competition in the market means that everyone tries to make their consoles and games better than their rivals which means we, the gamers, keep getting good and interesting games. And it keeps the price on a reasonable level.

So in stead of saying I am better than you and you suck because this and that. Just play the games you want to play and hope the variety of the gaming community and companies keeps the way it is so we can continue to enjoy our games.

 

[LaoJim]

Certainly enough to leave Microsoft in the dust, and they may even be vying for the lofty perch Sony now sits on.

I can't see it happening. At the moment all there is very few games that are helping to sell the Wii U. Take a look at Metacritics list of all the Wii U games, nearly everything there is stuff people can already play on their current Xbox or PS3. Except for Pikmin, Monster Hunter, New Super Mario Bros and the Wonderful 101. These are all nice to have, but nothing I would buy a new console for.

Once the next generation starts in earnest, developers will have to decide if they are willing to cut down their games so they can run the lower specced Wii U. Last generation they mostly didn't bother and the noises they are making at the moment make it unlikely they will do it this generation either.

Gamers seem to have decided that Sony have one this generation before any of us have seen the consoles yet. Maybe. I'm not underestimating the damage that Microsoft has done itself with its reveal and starting price. I'm just not sure how much it is going to matter in the long run if the console generation lasts for 8 years again. I can't see the new XBox as a console that developers are going to start to abandon, nearly all third party games will be available on both systems.

 

[The_Echo]

So, not only has the handheld dropped drastically in price, their most expensive console is $100 cheaper than the cheapest model PS4 will be for some time. This - in my opinion - is big. Very big. Certainly enough to leave Microsoft in the dust, and they may even be vying for the lofty perch Sony now sits on.

Noooooooooooo, no no no no. A WiiU price cut isn't going to make their sales skyrocket.

The WiiU has two fatal flaws:

1. The name is too close, almost indistinguishable, to its predecessor. This is just poor marketing at its finest.

2. No matter how cheap the console gets, nobody's going to buy it without a good library of games. Obviously this will change in time, but I think they've waited far too long and are suffering the consequences.

The 2DS, likewise, won't be making a huge splash. It's obviously aimed at the tablet audience (a largely casual/young demo), which cripples it in concept due to its software being far more expensive than the competition. One look at the price for Animal Crossing: New Leaf is sure to make a potential buyer from that demo think otherwise.

 

[Dryk]

Nintendo could stop producing products for the rest of the generation, have all their employees sitting at their desks twiddling their thumbs and still avoid bankruptcy. They'll be fine.

Nintendo's on hand cash on the 31st March 2011 (launch quarter of 3DS) 812,870,000,000 Yen ( $8.3 billion todays exchange rate)

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2011/110425e.pdf



Nintendo's on hand cash on the 30th June 2013 492,334,000,000 Yen ( $5 billion todays exchange rate)

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2013/130731e.pdf



Yes Nintendo's doing fine!

+ $4 billion in short-term investments

Not to mention that nosedive happened last year and they've started to pull up since then.

 

[Something Amyss]

Oh, but there can only be extremes. Nintendo either win, tie with Sony or they go bankrupt. Just look at the GameCube, it's not like that sold 1/8th of what the PS2 did. If it did they would have gone bankrupt. And if the Nintendo 64 had sold one third of what the PSOne did then they would definitely have gone bankrupt.

I think I need a pause from the internet. I am tired of black and white. Even old movies had some grey in them.

In fairness, the Gamecube wasn't sold at as huge a loss, and didn't take long before they were making a profit on them. They gambled big on the 3DS and were apparently taking a loss before the price cut. And the Wiiiiiiiu isn't exactly cheap to produce, either.

I can see why they'd need a better showing than the Gamecube. Bu still, even if this is an absolute failure, Nintendo isn't going bankrupt.

In fact, if they do fail this time around, it might benefit gaming. Maybe they'll get their heads out their asses and make things people want, rather than trying to dictate to us what we want. Wouldn't it be nice to have an alternative to Microsony?

 

[Comocat]

I don't wish nintendo any ill-will, I'm just not interested in mario-type games anymore. I have every mainstream Nintendo console ever made but I don't see a future with a company that doesn't embrace game development outside Mario and Zelda.

 

[Mr.Mattress]

In fairness, the Gamecube wasn't sold at as huge a loss, and didn't take long before they were making a profit on them.

Actually, to my knowledge, the GameCube never sold at a loss: It always made a profit, similar to the Wii, N64, SNES and NES. In fact, the only consoles to my knowledge that have made Nintendo loose money are their current ones: 3DS and WiiU.

OT: I've always had the prediction that Nintendo will barely be in the lead this gen, and will be neck and neck with Sony. So I voted for the Neck and Neck option. But I have faith in Nintendo. I know they can do it.

 

[Yopaz]

Oh, but there can only be extremes. Nintendo either win, tie with Sony or they go bankrupt. Just look at the GameCube, it's not like that sold 1/8th of what the PS2 did. If it did they would have gone bankrupt. And if the Nintendo 64 had sold one third of what the PSOne did then they would definitely have gone bankrupt.

I think I need a pause from the internet. I am tired of black and white. Even old movies had some grey in them.

In fairness, the Gamecube wasn't sold at as huge a loss, and didn't take long before they were making a profit on them. They gambled big on the 3DS and were apparently taking a loss before the price cut. And the Wiiiiiiiu isn't exactly cheap to produce, either.

I can see why they'd need a better showing than the Gamecube. Bu still, even if this is an absolute failure, Nintendo isn't going bankrupt.

In fact, if they do fail this time around, it might benefit gaming. Maybe they'll get their heads out their asses and make things people want, rather than trying to dictate to us what we want. Wouldn't it be nice to have an alternative to Microsony?

I just picked the GameCube because it didn't do well in its lifespan, not as a measure of what they needed to stay afloat.

However for that last point I don't really agree. I consider Nintendo separate from Microsoft and Sony because they focus on entirely different things. I don't consider that a bad thing though. They have an audience and they want to appeal to that audience. Microsoft and Sony might offer great consoles, but for any third party game that isn't exclusive to consoles I want it on my PC. In that regard Nintendo is quite different. Motion controls on the Wii was sometimes thrown in just because it was possible, but in games like Resident Evil 4 I found them to be really good and actually improved on the game. I don't need Nintendo trying to take the turf from Microsoft or Sony. If I want to have a Playstation then I buy a Sony product rather than a product pretending to be a Sony product. I've had some great fun playing Nintendo Land with my friends and I think it's an example of how the console can be used right. I don't think it will be a huge success, but I don't think they should abandon their ideas and just offer the same with 10 times the power.

 

[Something Amyss]

Actually, to my knowledge, the GameCube never sold at a loss: It always made a profit, similar to the Wii, N64, SNES and NES. In fact, the only consoles to my knowledge that have made Nintendo loose money are their current ones: 3DS and WiiU.

It was sold at a loss at multiple points in its life cycle. Granted, one was a mere 3 cents (US), and most were under a couple of bucks. The notion that Nintendo always sells at a profit (or always used to) is false.

 

[StriderShinryu]

Will the price cut help? Absolutely. Will it be enough to keep them in the race? Nope.

A price difference is really only a big issue amongst those who are looking at price being a big issue, which isn't the traditional gaming audience. The vast majority of the traditional audience like lower prices but don't really use that as a guide for what they do or don't buy. At best for Nintendo, it will make the Wii U a little more appealing as a secondary system assuming they can get some games out that people actually care about.

The people that a price difference does have a massive appeal to, those who picked up the Wii in droves, seem to have already passed on the Wii U. Now, I'm not saying that this non traditional audience will be flocking to Nintendo's competitors either, but in this generation it's actually going to be a fight for that market instead of Nintendo running away with it.

 

[Ashadowpie]

if Nintendo would just stop with the gimmick bullshit i'd gladly jump back to liking them. i love mario games, Zelda games. i HATED Skyward Sword Only because i had to waggle my controller. give me a normal controller and i would have loved that game. no one wants gimmicks stuffed down there throat damnit! Nintendo hints of the new Zelda game their making and i am super excited but just like Skyward Sword i will never play it and it pisses me off and makes me sad. i cant and wont play it because there is no normal controller. now its a giant tablet waggle block with a 5 minute battery life.

...wonderful just what a gamer wanted


i actually would like a 3DS because of the games and the new pokemon coming out but i could not care less about the gimmick 3D bullshit. the damn handheld is alittle over 200 bucks and its expensive for the 3D aspect, something i dont want nor care about. now the 2DS, it can play 3DS games AND DS games. this is wonderful now plus its cheaper! i can actually buy this now.

Nintendo just needs to lay off the gimmicks, once they do they'll get there fans back. i know they'd get Me back thats for sure.

 

[Something Amyss]

I just picked the GameCube because it didn't do well in its lifespan, not as a measure of what they needed to stay afloat.

But you made the argument that poor sales don't equal failure based on the facetious statement that they couldn't have sold poorly because if they did they'd be dead.

The point must stand, then, that there's a huge difference between the GCN and the current units.

I consider Nintendo separate from Microsoft and Sony because they focus on entirely different things.

But...I just treated them as separate from the two. I even went so far as to give the two a portmanteau title to emphasise their sameness. What are you disagreeing with?

They have an audience and they want to appeal to that audience.

Except the Wii and DS were built around appealing to a new audience. And honestly, so are the 3DS and WiiU. Unless you ignore their prior audience, that's kind of a pointless statement.

I don't need Nintendo trying to take the turf from Microsoft or Sony.

But.

They.

ARE.

That was the whole point of having an HD system that had third party games and advertising it was "more powerful than" the 7 year old opposing hardware. That was the point of saying they wanted to target and appeal to core gamers.

If I want to have a Playstation then I buy a Sony product rather than a product pretending to be a Sony product.

That's nice, sweetie. It's irrelevant, but it's nice.

I mean, honestly, where did I say that Nintendo should be a Sony clone? The correct answer is "nowhere." There's a difference between being just like everyone else and being valid competition by providing a service people want. Nintendo's "woes" right now have been caused by their attempts to make lightning strike twice. They promised shareholders Wii/DS sales and can't provide them because they're shit at marketing. Nintendo seems to run a "feast or famine" deal. Except they're not going to capture the fad market twice.

They will likely do okay, but in no world will they meet up with those big, lofty promises. And one of the reasons is they decided NOT to target their audience once more, but go for that sweet sweet "broader audience."

 

[Ryan Hughes]

First of all: The 2DS is basically a cheap Pokemon Machine for kids, I think it is actually a smart move by Nintendo, though the system itself may look a bit odd. The system is supposed to attract parents who wish to buy it for their children.

Also, Nintendo is far from bankruptcy. So saying they are dead is premature at best. Even though the WiiU is struggling, there is no indication from the company's financials that they are in any sort of trouble, to the contrary, the 3DS is making enough money to float Nintendo even if the WiiU never takes off.

Keep in mind that while Nintendo is by no means the industry leader, they are still aware -at the very least- that they make video game machines, so they evaded all the pitfalls Microsoft fell into earlier in this year. Though with Larson-Green in control of Xbox, perhaps they can turn things around.

In any event, Nintendo has enough money to float the WiiU and even release another home console in the future. The 3DS started out very poorly, but was turned into a pretty decent system eventually.

 

[Yopaz]

I just picked the GameCube because it didn't do well in its lifespan, not as a measure of what they needed to stay afloat.

But you made the argument that poor sales don't equal failure based on the facetious statement that they couldn't have sold poorly because if they did they'd be dead.

The point must stand, then, that there's a huge difference between the GCN and the current units.

Sorry, this was intended as a sarcastic statement and also an agreement to what you said. Sony outsold Nintendo by a great deal 2 generations in a row, once by 1:3 once by 1:8 (actually 1:7.5).

But...I just treated them as separate from the two. I even went so far as to give the two a portmanteau title to emphasise their sameness. What are you disagreeing with?

Not sure, I'm probably misunderstanding something or saying something outlandish here, but I'm lost right now, it's been a long day.

Except the Wii and DS were built around appealing to a new audience. And honestly, so are the 3DS and WiiU. Unless you ignore their prior audience, that's kind of a pointless statement.

Actually this was more focused on their audience being more concerned about Nintendo titles over third party titles. The audience wants a new Zelda, a new Super Smash Bros. and all that.

But.

They.

ARE.

That was the whole point of having an HD system that had third party games and advertising it was "more powerful than" the 7 year old opposing hardware. That was the point of saying they wanted to target and appeal to core gamers.

Oh they can pretend that they are, but they don't really compete on the same grounds.

honestly, where did I say that Nintendo should be a Sony clone? The correct answer is "nowhere." There's a difference between being just like everyone else and being valid competition by providing a service people want. Nintendo's "woes" right now have been caused by their attempts to make lightning strike twice. They promised shareholders Wii/DS sales and can't provide them because they're shit at marketing. Nintendo seems to run a "feast or famine" deal. Except they're not going to capture the fad market twice.

They will likely do okay, but in no world will they meet up with those big, lofty promises. And one of the reasons is they decided NOT to target their audience once more, but go for that sweet sweet "broader audience."

Never said you did, but I'll take the blame for this one. This was more of my personal opinion and an answer to your last question. I like the Wii U tablet controller and I like the 3DS. I don't want an alternative to the other major consoles because I've got a PC to supply that alternative.

If there's anything else you disagree with that's probably just a matter of opinions or me talking in a mixture of starvation and sleep deprivation and making no sense. Also, I apologize for not making my initial sarcasm more clear.

 

[go-10]

you do realize that it's impossible for Nintendo to go bankrupt during our life time right?

just look at how much the 3DS sales and if you need any further proof... Pokemon; the end all be all video game that at this point Nintendo should just ask people when to charge their card and mail the game. I mean it's going to be the highest selling game of the year without much doubt

 

[Saelune]

Nintendo has little competition. People think Microsoft and Sony are these big bullies hurting Nintendo, but they are not. They only fight eachother while Nintendo, the only one with any legit exclusives, casually strolls at its own pace. It innovates, or tries to, cause it wants to, not cause it has to. It made motion controls as an attempt to further gaming. Sony and Microsoft didnt. Nintendo added glassesless 3D to enhance gaming, and it worked. Sometimes Nintendo flops on things. Virtual Boy, ROB, maybe this 2DS thing will or wont float, but it doesnt shoot itself in the foot, then whines when fans dont like that. (Xbox One). It also makes gaming consoles, for playing games, not for watching movies (PS3) or watching TV (Xbox One).

Yeah, playing CoD or AC4 on a Nintendo system is a bad idea, but Pikmin 3 is easily on the level of any great PS3/4 or 360/One game. People are too busy not paying attentionto Nintendo to see how well they are truly doing.

Also Nintendo is a gaming company and only that. Not a entertainment company (Sony) or a computer company (Microsoft). Nintendo is literally run by gaming developers. Iwata MADE Kirby. Miyamoto MADE Mario. The people who made MGS, Tomb Raider and Crahs Bandicoot arent running Sony. Certainly the people who made Halo arent running Microsoft (since they mostly jumped shiped to Activision).

 

[teebeeohh]

they still don't have games for the amn wiiu
basically the only way they get my money if they make exclusivity deals with grasshopper and platinum.

 

[Matthew Jabour]

Nintendo could stop producing products for the rest of the generation, have all their employees sitting at their desks twiddling their thumbs and still avoid bankruptcy. They'll be fine.

Nintendo's on hand cash on the 31st March 2011 (launch quarter of 3DS) 812,870,000,000 Yen ( $8.3 billion todays exchange rate)

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2011/110425e.pdf



Nintendo's on hand cash on the 30th June 2013 492,334,000,000 Yen ( $5 billion todays exchange rate)

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2013/130731e.pdf



Yes Nintendo's doing fine!

+ $4 billion in short-term investments

Not to mention that nosedive happened last year and they've started to pull up since then.

Nintendo had a similar amount of short term investments in 2011 as well so that's still a $3.3 billion decrease in liquid assets in 2 years.

Gee, it's almost like they had to invest some money in something big. A new console, for example, that cost a lot to make.

 

[Lightknight]

This really depends on a number of things. Nintendo's biggest fault is marketing and a lack of games. Have those things been fixed? I don't think so, not yet. They have a couple titles so far and several on the way but this is a year into the console life cycle. By the end of Sony's first year they're saying 33 exclusive titles with every one of their studios working on at least one game for the ps4. That's the competiton. Marketing-wise, plenty of people are still unaware that the WiiU is a different console and are especially unaware of the reason why they need it. That's another problem Nintendo has officially acknolwedged. With the Wii seeing a non-trivial amount of old people and casual gamers, you really can't expect them to kept abreast of the issue like we do and that's a problem when coupled with a terrible marketing campaign that really needs to be the best there is. The Wii was a boon to senior centors and really gave casual gamers party experiences and family friendly entertainment they could count on. They don't see why they need to get a WiiU now that they have a Wii.

$50 doesn't take away that problem. It's still $50 more than the previous system's target market bought in. I don't think the money is as important as getting games. With an upcoming bundle containing a game people want, however, I think that will do the most good of all.

http://www.ign.com/games/upcoming/wii-u
http://www.nintendolife.com/wiiu/games/soon

Looks like they're releasing Mario 3D world. That'll help them for Christmas but it's a couple weeks after both the ps4 and XBO launch with a significant number of big titles to their names. Rayman and wonderful 101 are supposed to hit in september according to that link so maybe they'll see a bump. But that price drop doesn't show up until the end of september after that those games. They should have combined the release to leverage the sales.

I'd say their game problem is beginning to get remedied. Is it enough? We'll see. I think their biggest problem so far has been games and we should have at least 5 big Nintendo titles by then. Luigi U, Wonderful 101, Zelda, Mario, Pikmin with a decent list of third party games. If they don't see a pick up in sales this year I'll be very surprised.

Still, again, this is a year in and is shameful. The Wii launched not only with a revolutionary use of a motion controller that has forever changed the inclusion of system peripherals, but it launched with a more mature-looking version of the Legend of Zelda (not this more kid-friendly version we're getting on the WiiU), Red Steel that was all the buzz at the start, hugely popular Wii Sports bundled in, and a few other titles like Rayman and Wario Ware that was launch in Japan but took a few months to come out. That's day-one. There's no excuse for them not being ready here. People now may be wary of buying it because of its sales performance so far.

I don't think they'll ever pull ahead. Their most optimistic forecast is 40 million units by the end of the console lifespan. I think this will be a down generation for them in which they can spend their copious amounts of cash on the next big thing. They certainly won't go bankrupt unless they start paying people $300 just to take the console and even then I don't think they'd go bankrupt for some time. The best case scenario may just be them making a profit. Right now they're tracking at worse than the dreamcast.

If they really want to make headway, they should make the WiiU no longer bundled with the gamepad. We know it's $140 so you'd be talking a $160 price mark for the system. That's not just impulse buying range, that's people beginning to ask what system they should buy in addition to the WiiU. Just continue to require game developers to support the gamepad function and continue selling it seperately for people that want it. The games that require it should be patched if possible and marked as requiring the pad if not possible. I think that would shock people and turn it around. Demanding people buy a peripheral that doubles the price of the system is a terrible strategy (I'm looking at you too, Microsoft).