Poll: Should Scotland Become Independent?

[SckizoBoy]

I would like to see an independent Scotland, not despite being English, but because I'm English. Or rather because I'm an English Social Democrat. That is, in layman's terms a democratic Socialist, and one that lives in perceptual frustration deriving from 30 years of Thatcherism. In Britain, since 1979, there has been no-where to escape it, until now.
To put it bluntly, Scottish confidence in rule from Westminster has collapsed. They do not see rule from London as rule in their interests, and this has been a long time coming. De-industrialisation, the Poll-Tax, New Labour, and the now the Coalition. To the Scots, they see all Westminster parties as one and the same. All Thatcherites, all interested in London, the South East, and no-where else. They have had enough.
The question remains, did Tony Blair really know what he was doing when he gave the go-ahead for devolution back in 1997? To be honest, he most likely was trying to do some good back then. Admittedly, this was years before Iraq and way before the monomania began to set it.
In two years time, there will be a referendum on Independence. It will be a three-way vote, giving a middle choice of 'further devolution with financial autonomy'. If things remain as they are, this will be the most likely outcome. The Scots will want greater independence, but don't feel ready to take the plunge completely.
Now what will happen between then and now will be very interesting. All three Westminster Parties will do their best to try and delay or sabotage any Scottish self-determination. Losing Scotland will be a massive blow for the English, not just in terms of the oil, but also the prestige. However, anything too blatant will only make independence all the more likely.
The SNP will attempt to hold a steady course of quiet, competent administration. In affect, running Scotland like a Nordic country. Now that is not to say that they will not act without vision. Their main thrust is investing into modern 'green' technologies. Thus providing jobs and energy sustainability in the future. This of course will be funded by the oil money.
Now it will also be interesting to see the state of immigration/emigration to and from Scotland. Will there be a great flow, or merely a trickle of British Lefties, all seeking to escape the coalition? Who knows, only time will tell.
Strangely enough, this is the first time that I have felt any real confidence about the future of the UK for a very long time.

That's a lot of $0.02!
And you've gotten me thinking about TB (always refer to Tony Blair as tuberculosis in my household) and that devolution affair. Still, I agree insomuch that the English (politically, at least, and perhaps economically as well) need Scotland much more than the other way around. But I feel that many Scots are in two minds about it, for all that they support the SNP. I think they should appeal for greater autonomy, because a lot of the decision making is idiotic, and all matters Scottish should be dictated from Holyrood. Cue lots of paranoia from Westminster.

 

[Lord_Nemesis]

Although I am the most un-patriotic Scotsman EVER, I say independence would ruin us. We have existed and lived as part as the UK for only history geeks know how long, to turn to an independant and solitary state would be like trying to shove your car into reverse while in 5th gear going a 120 mph.

But in the other hand, my... OUR (to my fellow Scots) country isn't exactly paradise now with the unemployment and Junky tits that seem to be rampant in our cities (well in Glasgow anyway). So would independance change that? No probably not.

In conclusion, if you live in Scotland, we may have our kilts to pull the English chicks but you can take that with you when you move... Well anywhere other than where we are now. Emmigrate folks.

 

[GeekFury]

As a Scot through and through, having been born here and living here all my life I think we should, or atleast have the option to if we want. I also don't think anyone but Scots should have a say in it, if we want independace we should be allowed to vote for it, though I'm sure we won't get it.

Though few people seem to remember, Great Britian was coined and invented by a Scottish King.

 

[Thaluikhain]

People like having their voice heard, and when it becomes clear that their voice is being drowned out, they will take steps to rectify the situation. America, Canada, Australia, India, all the other a's, and nearly every spot where the sun once shone upon the British Empire eventually took steps to walk on their own rather than let themselves continue to be led. Why should Scotland and Wales be any different? Particularly given the vast social, cultural, and historical differences which cause them to be unique.

Well, for one, those nations were half a world away, and had to have their own fairly independant governments anyway.

Scotland, England and Wales are part of the same island, a unified government could work.

Having said that, if their voices aren't being heard, the geographical relationship isn't important.

 

[Death-of-Penguins]

I am Scottish, no denying it, but I really don't think we should have independence. By all means, let us vote on it, but I do rather hope we don't get it. Unless something major happens, I'm voting no.

 

[rutger5000]

Scotland should just suck it up. I don't believe it could stand as a independent country, and I for one don't feel like paying EU money to support it. (Because that is what will happen) Screw you Scotland, it's 2011 time to start acting like it and act like a normal province.
Neo-Nationalisme is a worrying trend that should be fought, we as people of the world ought not to go along with it.

 

[bad rider]

Surely this should be in religion and politics.

 

[TheGuiggleMonster]

The UK has a population of about 62,000,000. Scotland has a population of about 5,200,000. Losing Scotland won't be the end of the world.

 

[teebeeohh]

i am not sure that people think things through whenever they vote for a party that promises them less tie to a greater something. it's like leaving the EU (or closing your boarders, thanks again Denmark), you will be more fucked without than with it. I am not sure if they would become a member of the EU if they became independent from GB but i am pretty sure they could not stand on their own.

 

[bloob]

I am English and i would welcome Scottish independance. England subsidises Scotland and the fact that Scotland gets free higher education and English students don't really winds me up. It would be interesting to see if Scotland could maintain such policies without the financial aid from England

 

[Zenn3k]

They can take your lives....

but they'll never take, YOUR FREEDOM!!

 

[Matt-Sama]

Us English have enough problems to deal with. Those drunkards can deal with their own problems.

 

[idarkphoenixi]

People seem to have romantisised becoming an independant nation far too much. What you need to look at is do they have the means to become independant? And I have to say no, they dont. The UK is already a fairly small nation and Scotland is even smaller, only a few million people.
It might sound like a lot, but on the scale of an entire country its really insignificant.

One big thing I noticed is would this mean their army would also become independant? If yes, then Scotlands military forces would be greatly diminished. The UK has one of the most powerful armies in the world and remaining a strong ally is not something you want to throw away lightly. But it goes both ways here, the rest of the UK needs Scotlands troops too, they have some of its most skilled soldiers.

What about the economy? Would this not also be affected?

And if they become independant, would it not be possible that one day they might even become enemies of the UK? I know its an extreme view but still...It could happen. Remaining a part of the UK Guarantees security and become mutually benefitial. Instead of risking internal fighting, they join together and take on far more dangerous foes (Germany, France, the Taliban etc...)

I'll agree that Scotland needs a much larger voice politically. But thats really it. Remaining a part of a larger group is benefitial to all people involved. It might sound nice on paper to become an "independant nation" but as we've seen in the past that doesn't always work out for the best.

 

[Alexlion]

I cant believe what im hearing from both sides its so backward, im british i have a english mother and a scottish father. You know what makes someone different from any one in scotland or england? nothing. Russia for all its problems has the sun rise at one end and sets at the other and they dont seem to try to break themselves up all the time. Democracy supports the majority i know in Scotland you feel your views arnt represented in parliment but they are infact they are and tbh a Scottish parliament only really hurt that. But if every time the minority dosent get into power it declares independance you dont end up with democracy you just end up with a lot of warring states. We should be trying to unite people not draw more lines across a map.

We are GREAT Britain for a reason because together we changed the world, a history lesson would tell you before we united we where 2 inconsequential backwaters in Europe only together did we amount to anything.
Not only is the financially stupid for both country's but in all likely-hood no one on the world stage would take either of us seriously on our own. Do you really think that parliament being in Westminster some how makes them totally different to you and unaware of your issues? Most US states are bigger than the UK for crying out loud.
Dividing the world further for what? Be honest little more than PETTY TRIBAL differences.
Hypocritical tho it may be i must also echo the words of David Mitchell considering myself British "The British will have lost their country."

 

[The Harkinator]

People seem to have romantisised becoming an independant nation far too much. What you need to look at is do they have the means to become independant? And I have to say no, they dont. The UK is already a fairly small nation and Scotland is even smaller, only a few million people.
It might sound like a lot, but on the scale of an entire country its really insignificant.

One big thing I noticed is would this mean their army would also become independant? If yes, then Scotlands military forces would be greatly diminished. The UK has one of the most powerful armies in the world and remaining a strong ally is not something you want to throw away lightly. But it goes both ways here, the rest of the UK needs Scotlands troops too, they have some of its most skilled soldiers.

What about the economy? Would this not also be affected?

And if they become independant, would it not be possible that one day they might even become enemies of the UK? I know its an extreme view but still...It could happen. Remaining a part of the UK Guarantees security and become mutually benefitial. Instead of risking internal fighting, they join together and take on far more dangerous foes (Germany, France, the Taliban etc...)

I'll agree that Scotland needs a much larger voice politically. But thats really it. Remaining a part of a larger group is benefitial to all people involved. It might sound nice on paper to become an "independant nation" but as we've seen in the past that doesn't always work out for the best.

Your point about the 'Romanticised Independence'is very relevant. To many people independence is freedom from a tyrannical opressor that signals a new golden age of freedom, prosperity and other things that Hollywood would love to make into a movie. Instead the Scottish economy would be left in really deep water. Yes they have lots of oil but thats not enough.

To be honest I thought Holyrood was a bad idea. Then again I also thought that the policies that favoured only England were bad ideas. Governments look at the UK and dont see the UK. They see England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

The more autonomy Scotland gets the more worried Westminster will be that their money is being badly spent. If they are sending money that is becoming more like Foreign aid and less like public spending (money that is supposed to be spent in their own country but they have no control over its spending) then there will be less money spent.

Why can't the UK treat the UK like the UK?

 

[Antari]

Equal rights do not mean Special rights. Just because the country isn't going great right now doesn't mean you should jump ship.

 

[Baneat]

The border itself is arbitrary, though, we are no different as a people to the English save for a few cultural quirks. Either way you're having decisions made for you by X government or Y.

I dare say, there are quite a few of your fellow countrymen(and countrywomen)who would care to disagree. Besides, Sovereignty-Association is the way of the future, as is the further devolution of powers to regions.

People like having their voice heard, and when it becomes clear that their voice is being drowned out, they will take steps to rectify the situation. America, Canada, Australia, India, all the other a's, and nearly every spot where the sun once shone upon the British Empire eventually took steps to walk on their own rather than let themselves continue to be led. Why should Scotland and Wales be any different? Particularly given the vast social, cultural, and historical differences which cause them to be unique.

Suum cuique of course.

We're hardly being trampled upon by the English, so it's not entirely fair to just constantly point at England cause of how they treated other countries in their Empire

And the differences aren't vast, by a long, long way.

 

[GalacticNexus]

You can have your independence, but we will just conquer you all over again!