Poll: So I found this "feminist" site

[DevilWithaHalo]

Mind control through blowjobs! what will they think of next?

I'm guessing the phrasing was a bit misleading. It's more likely that they're saying blowjobs reinforce a cultural mentality of female submission and the act of doing it further instills that mentality in the participant.

I doubt they're actually saying penises have magical mind control powers that are activated via fellatio. Although, considering some of the "feminist" literature I've read, I wouldn't be to shocked if that actually was the case.

snip

I think you accidentally quoted me. That or you blew my comment's intentions way out of proportion.

Nah, I used it as a jumping point. While the blowjob comment may have simply be in jest, I just wanted to point out that there are political feminists that think much worse. Mind controlling blowjobs - blowjobs illustrating female submission to the patriarchy - all sexual activity with men is evil... rhar!

I quote people to reference the springboard of my reply sometimes, not to call anyone out on anything.

 

[Mortons4ck]

A womyn writes a book about a womyn in a shitty relationship and becomes a smash hit among bored womyn across the world, but offends the sensibilites of a few womyn.


[HEADING=1]OMFG IT'S THE PATRIARCHY AT WORK!!![/HEADING]

 

[axlryder]

Mind control through blowjobs! what will they think of next?

I'm guessing the phrasing was a bit misleading. It's more likely that they're saying blowjobs reinforce a cultural mentality of female submission and the act of doing it further instills that mentality in the participant.

I doubt they're actually saying penises have magical mind control powers that are activated via fellatio. Although, considering some of the "feminist" literature I've read, I wouldn't be to shocked if that actually was the case.

snip

I think you accidentally quoted me. That or you blew my comment's intentions way out of proportion.

Nah, I used it as a jumping point. While the blowjob comment may have simply be in jest, I just wanted to point out that there are political feminists that think much worse. Mind controlling blowjobs - blowjobs illustrating female submission to the patriarchy - all sexual activity with men is evil... rhar!

I quote people to reference the springboard of my reply sometimes, not to call anyone out on anything.

To be fair, I'm not sure I've ever seen a notable feminist actually use the concept of legitimate mind control or something similarly fictitious in an everyday context as a talking point to be taken seriously. Though maybe they're out there. A dark room full of ominous woman petting their cats and discussing ways to eliminate the deadly mind control semen.

 

[FoolKiller]

My biggest issue with this topic is still the title: Feminist. It may only be semantics but how can a group want equality and then have a sexist name?

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

snip

That's not what feminism means. You aren't a feminist if you don't believe in equality...you are something else, supremacist maybe :/

Again, third wave feminism=/=the entire feminist movement. You can keep repeating your no-true-scotsman fallacy but that is all it will be....a fallacy.

Mary Daly is just as much of a feminist as Gloria Steinem.

If they don't believe in equality then yeah they aren't feminists...-.- and I explained earlier why it's not a 'no true scotsman' fallacy.

Repeating simple logic is so much fun!

You keep repeating what your saying like it will somehow be true. Look it up [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Daly], Mary Daly is a feminist.

 

[pppppppppppppppppp]

Erm, is it common for radical members of groups to actually label themselves as radical? That was sorta giving me the feeling that something is off about the whole site.

I'm guessing it's a matter of wearing like a badge of honor. People call them radical and they turn around and say, "So what if we are? We're still awesome and right about everything."

That's my assumption anyway

 

[Nieroshai]

I just wish true equalists and feminists would call out radical feminists on their destructive actions and rants. You hear from the radicals all the time, but no one stands up to rebut them. We even keep electing them into public office! If we want to shut them up, we need to actually do it.

 

[Nieroshai]

So, a women doing something that she sexually enjoys makes her less empowered? That is some bullshit. While I don't want to fight on the side of EL James, that really makes no sense whatsoever.

But you know, you're only a true warrior for the cause if you suffer for the liberation. It's why so many of them are bitter; unless they're lesbians, they'll eternally be attracted to the devil himself. At least, I'm sure there's a lot of sexual repression there. It would explain a lot. Like how a guy I know acts more macho and aggressive to hide the fact that he likes My Little Pony. And possibly men. It's funny, really. My friends know I'm bi and don't care, but he puts on this show for them like they'll hate him or something. It's sad. To sum it up, I think radical feminists deny their own nature because they feel it makes them weak. And in this self-denial, they become weak.

 

[DanDeFool]

I've been on radfemhub before and I'd never read such ridiculousness in all my life. They were calling male pornstars 'paid rapists', saying the Utoya Island massacre was the fault of the patriarchy and one delightful user said that women will never be safe as long as men make up more than 20% of the population.

These people aren't feminists and I refuse to call them that. They're just bigots and they're views are so detached from reality it's not even funny.

Surprise, surprise. Any ideology taken to an extreme becomes harmful.

We already knew chauvanism was bad. Guess feminism is building its own black reputation.

 

[Russirishican]

The admittance section utterly rejects the presence of men, as they?re "carnivorous necrophilia?s" that exponentially prevent meaningful conversations. (It's intended to be a private site. Fine... but wow.)

Oh men, they're all meat eating, corpse fuckers the lot of them. Never has a graveyard been found that didn't have a man or two and an open grave.

Spoiler: Necrophilia

 

[DanDeFool]

snip

That's not what feminism means. You aren't a feminist if you don't believe in equality...you are something else, supremacist maybe :/

Again, third wave feminism=/=the entire feminist movement. You can keep repeating your no-true-scotsman fallacy but that is all it will be....a fallacy.

Mary Daly is just as much of a feminist as Gloria Steinem.

If they don't believe in equality then yeah they aren't feminists...-.- and I explained earlier why it's not a 'no true scotsman' fallacy.

Repeating simple logic is so much fun!

Well, then, explain this: Why is it that feminists stand for equality while their opposite, chauvanists, stand for male superiority?

The answer is that it has more to do with the historical context than strict definitions. If both men and women had been considered equivalent in the eyes of society from the get-go, then I'd wager both feminism and chauvanism would stand for the superiority of their respective genders. The reason the feminist movement has the reputation as fighting for equality is because they started out behind.

Nowadays, that men and women are considered equals within society at large (at least on paper; the fight for equality isn't quite over yet), a subset of the feminist movement seems to have emerged that sees men as an oppressive force that will always seek to dominate women. They're still feminists, technically, but their ideas and goals don't jive with those of the larger feminist movement. Hence, "radical" feminists.

 

[Calibanbutcher]

There are extremists to any group of people feminism is not a exception to this. While all extremism should be exposed and opposed none of this is shocking at the least. I proudly call myself a feminist and I am a male, while I would never support the extreme end of it I see feminism as both a respect and equality issue. A real man has a respect for others therefor any real man must be a feminist.

I'm starting to think we should have our own sub-forum for discussing Feminism.

Or you know what?

Hmmm discussion and support of women's rights or the life of a single common baby animal.
I think women are more valuable than a cat. Things like this are a hot topic because they need to be discussed. This is something that has to happen gender equality and mistreatment issues are a real thing and are still common to this day. The only way it will ever change is if it gathers wide and constant attention. This is something all people should be exposed to and not hidden and tucked away.

This is something that doesn't just effect just women but all of us including you. So just try to bear with it. If you have any doubts that these topics need to exist here go ahead and go to the comments regarding the sexual assault that took place at the PAX minecraft party. The Escapist is no miracle exception.

How is discussing the same topic over and over and over and over and over and over and over again on the "off-topic" forums attached to a site dedicated to video-gaming "supporting women's rights"?
How?
By spreading awareness?
Nope, the news section does that already.
By convincing others to "see the light", aka agreeing with "your" take on things ?
[sub][sub]"your" being used as a placeholder for "everyone arguing in such threads[/sub][/sub]
Anyone truly believe that arguing over the internet will ever change someone's mind?
So, I would rather save a few kittens by NOT arguing about feminism on the escapist, whilst leaving the feminism discussions to the rest of the internet, where I am quite sure many forums dedicated to sexism and the fight against it already exist.

I fail to see your objection on being in off-topic, this thread certainly wouldn't be worthy of falling under news nor should the discussion be limited to news worthy events.
And yes, whether you realize it or not, or perhaps refuse to accept it or not it does create awareness. Also I find no wrong in trying to send a message to others on what I believe to be right when the goal is to aid others and harm none.

While changing a persons views is hard it isn't impossible. As I grow older I still find myself evolving over issues and have changed my positions on things over time. These very forums have actually witnessed myself changing my position on a certain subject and while the discussion itself wasn't a main drive it certainly was a minor one that aided opening up the gate-way of thinking about the subject. I will never be a perfect man but I do wish to better myself and I cannot do that if I make all my behaviors and stances on issues ironclad.

But aiming at those who are ironclad isn't the goal anyways. To win over those who are undecided or young minds who need to be put on the right path. Take America and racism as a great example of this. While racism is still very present it looks pathetic compared to the terrible past and the actions that were common place. This isn't because the majority saw the light suddenly but rather people age out and die. Entire generations go away and this leaves opportunity for progress within the next. This is how society evolves over time on issues and why we often find ourselves still tackling what generations before us were.

The aim should focus on young males to sway them towards the path of respecting women and young females to teach them to NEVER see themselves as less than a man or to endure being treated like such. If you think such a thing cannot be done online you would be wrong.
I met a 13 year old kid who happened to stumble into one of my clan's servers and right away he goes straight to harassing and saying the typical rhetoric to one of our female members.
Not the stuff boys stupidly do at that age either but the stuff that is learned and passed down. Instead of banning the kid I decided to step in and talk to him, which of course lead to unpleasantry at first. But in the end I convinced him to talk to me more and we did, I shared my views and he began evolve his behavior and his views. I also learned that he was extremely disrespectful to his mother who was the single parent in his life and that changed too. He is now 19 year old a man in the US Army, respects women and is a fine example of what a man should be. I still talk and game with him to this day.

I do not take credit for his progress but I did point him in the right direction and tell him why I believe it is such and he did the rest. We should not shirk our duty as adults in guiding the youth onto a better path no matter where the opportunity arises.

Feminism is not a topic for the "Off-topic" board.
It belongs with religion and politcs, since it is primarily a political issue.

And I still stand by my point, that this board has seen enough "feminism" topics already.

There were 3 topics concerning feminism/sexism/gender issues on the front page of the off-topics board just now, and in the news section there is another one being advertised to me, as is in the most commented section, plus there is ANOTHER one in the gaming forum.


yes feminism is important.
yes we need to reach the youth, but NOT BY SPAMMING THIS BOARD WITH MORE FEMINISM THREADS EACH AND EVERY DAY, but by educating them IN REAL LIFE.

you managed to change one guy one-on-omn. And kudos to you for doing so, I appreciate what you did.
But I still stand-by what I said:
On an internet forum with communications taking place in the form of anonymous messages, you will not sway a single mind, no matter how eloquent and thoughtful your posts are.

While I do agree that it spans into a political issues I would disagree that it is primarily such. Even if every government world wide came into full acceptance of gender equality and respected all of the rights women should have Feminism would still be required. It isn't just laws that are flawed, this wouldn't solve behavior and attitudes towards women. It's not like once African Americans achieved equal rights after so long of oppression that suddenly public flipped like a light switch and everyone was kind and loving to them just because the laws changed. The political agenda if anything is the minority part as nothing will truly change unless the people willfully adopt the methods of thinking over time.

So feminism threads if regarding actual political talks such as "Middle eastern country X has opened voting to women for the first time" That would be political. A topic like this however would be a random and thus off-topic discussion. It of course isn't limited to that a discussion about the Hitman game's trailer with the latex nuns that many found offensive would fit right into gaming with a feminist discussion.

If you disagree with me still, just reverse the role a bit. Imagine a AAA game with so much hype and buzz was found to have a extremely racist outlook and message upon a certain race. You wouldn't go post a thread in the political section about it. Misogyny is really no different than racism but instead of race it's gender based. It shouldn't be treated any differently.

As for minds being reached or not I cannot guarantee such but you, yourself point out the popularity of these discussions and they do clearly get a-lot of attention so I believe you are mistaken. These forums I would presume have a rather young in median age and if anything getting attention with the current trends with the youth is by far the way to go.

Ah, on one part you are wrong: I would banish a "triple A racism-discussion" to the "gaming" subforum. (And we had a rather extensive hitman discussion as well)
And as for popularity:
Who is it that reads these discussions?
People like me, that find the flame-wars amusing and those that are already interested in the subject at hand.

And I had another idea:
Maybe we should change religion and politic to "religion, politic and society" that way we could banish the feminism threads there, thos interested in them could spend their time there, the youth would be reached through the news feed
(Hitman Nuns, Borderlands 2 Girlfriend mode, Notch rage over sexual assault).
Your thoughts?

 

[littlewisp]

snip

I can't read any more of this argument without pulling out my hair. I think the problem here is that you need to stop using the "buzzwords" and go with you are in a very deep and committed relationship in which, 100% of the time, one person is the dominant in the relationship and one is the submissive. Besides which, using a safeword doesn't mean necessarily that a dom/top will stop; they might just adapt what they're doing so as to not physically or emotionally hurt their partner. That doesn't mean they lose their power. And honestly, imo a good dom/top knows their partner well enough to play with those limits, and stretch them at their discretion. Doesn't necessarily mean they're bad, just that there is trust there and the lifestyle is what it is.

I know where you are coming from. I am attracted to that lifestyle. I have researched it, and thought about it. I dipped into it once, but that person was not to be a life partner for me. The love and trust people in this lifestyle show to their partners is indeed humbling and wonderful to see. At least to me. *shrug*

Boudica will never take you seriously because s/he has already defined those specific words in her head. They are just convenient labels, and do not mean the same thing to everyone no matter if you think they should. Besides which I'd say there's a pop version, and a lifestyle version. The two may sometimes brush by each other, and maybe in some cases they even intersect, but they are two wholly separate things.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Well, then, explain this: Why is it that feminists stand for equality while their opposite, chauvanists, stand for male superiority?

Holy crap THEIR OPPOSITES ARE CHAUVINISTS?!?! that's what you actually think of feminism?

I'm going to stop you right there. This is also to the rest of you who quoted me okay?

fem·i·nism/ˈfeməˌnizəm/
Noun:
The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.

Feminism does not equal supremacy. If someone does not believe in equalism they aren't a feminist. THEY MAY SAY THEY ARE but they are not.

Just like Stalin was not a fucking communist he was an asshat dictator.

Feminism has promoted women's rights because we have been in a large disadvantage in the world for a very long time and it needed re balancing. To people who are very protective of their male privilege this might annoy, but sorry for wanting equal rights and all that, our bad. -.-

Why is this so hard to follow.

Why.

If anyone says No true Scotsman again I will scream...

It isn't a 'No true Scotsman fallacy' The thing is this person says they are a feminist but they aren't, look at Stalin he said he was a communist but he wasn't, he was a dictator. It was like a someone saying it they are a banana. They may think they are a banana but they are clearly not a fucking banana however much they may claim to be.

In the Scotsman example the person is from Aberdeen, that's an indisputable fact, but in this case this person may say they are a feminist but since none of their views are actually feminist they cannot be categorized as such.

Read it again. Logic people! YAY

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

snip

Lotsa No True Scotsman up in this thread...

You may scream when ready ^.~

*eyetwitch*

I guess I asked for that one -.-

I'm starting to wonder if a lot of people on this forum hate feminists because they don't actually know what feminism is.

Personally I find a lot of so called feminists very extreme and not feminist at all but supremacists. Unfortunately extremists tend to be very vocal.

 

[Techno Squidgy]

Oh, oh and the main character drinks Twining's English Breakfast tea, she always writes "Ana has some Twining's English Breakfast tea", never "Ana drinks some fucking tea"./quote]
So how does fucking tea differ from regular tea? Where would it be in a supermarket? I NEED ANSWERS DAMNIT!

OT: I didn't even bother to look at the website. I'm sick of being told I'm the devil. As a white cis-gendered straight male, there are a lot of hurt minorities out there who are all too happy to tell me just how fucking evil I am. I'm just a quiet dude, going about, doing my business, not really bothering anyone, not oppressing anyone but nope, these people who don't even know me are still calling me satan's spawn. It kinda gets me down, I could probably have a decent conversation with these people if they'd give me a chance. Gah, I want off this rock. Ship me off to Mars, I'll build the damn colony myself with my bare hands.

 

[Teacakes]

Radical feminists don't matter on the current United States political stage and therefore mean nothing to me.

 

[TeletubbiesGolfGun]

Does the fact that some women enjoy submitting and handing over control to a man really bother you so much that you refuse to respect what they do?

Who said it bothers me? Or did you just assume? Oh you did. Cool.

I don't like the male dominant version because I dislike men having any power. My current boyfriend enjoys it, so I've little reason to care about changing lol.

I'll refuse to allow a man any say sexually, but am willing to take a lesser role with a woman.

>Radical personal views, does everything to justify it

>Claims never said anything and purposefully trolls instead of having a level headed debate

....the world is clearly against you, we will all submit to you since that is the only way in your eyes.

 

[DanDeFool]

Well, then, explain this: Why is it that feminists stand for equality while their opposite, chauvanists, stand for male superiority?

Holy crap THEIR OPPOSITES ARE CHAUVINISTS?!?! that's what you actually think of feminism?

I'm going to stop you right there. This is also to the rest of you who quoted me okay?

fem·i·nism/ˈfeməˌnizəm/
Noun:
The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.

Feminism does not equal supremacy. If someone does not believe in equalism they aren't a feminist. THEY MAY SAY THEY ARE but they are not.

Just like Stalin was not a fucking communist he was an asshat dictator.

Feminism has promoted women's rights because we have been in a large disadvantage in the world for a very long time and it needed re balancing. To people who are very protective of their male privilege this might annoy, but sorry for wanting equal rights and all that, our bad. -.-

I have to say, I'm a bit upset that you only read the first two lines of my reply. Read the rest of it; I'm sure you'll find that I was being more understanding of your position than you give me credit for.

And since you brought it up, I've never directly observed, or knowingly reaped benefit from any form of "male privilege", not would I want to. I've known plenty of intelligent, motivated women and as far as I know they've achieved success which is commensurate with their ability. I've never heard one complaint about sexism affecting their careers or personal lives.

In that regard, I have to congratulate the feminist movement on their success so far. There are a lot of bigoted men out there who no longer have a voice thanks to their hard work. There may still be a few bastions of male privilege out there in the world, bit the fact that it isn't an everyday thing for everyone in this country is a positive sign.

I understand that calling feminists "man haters" is a strategy that has been used to discredit feminism in the past.

That said, even if male privilege were a thing for me (and it isn't) it has nothing to do with this particular discussion. Whether you believe.these women are "feminists" or not is irrelevant: FEMINISM IS THE LABEL THEY'VE CHOSEN FOR THEMSELVES. I can appreciate that you want to distance the positive feminist movement from these types. Unfortunately, they're going to keep using it as the banner under which they will continue preaching that all men are despicable creatures to be hated and feared.

Also, Wikipedia agrees with you (i.e. That feminism = woman's rights movement =/= belief in female superiority) Also it turns out that the strict definition of chauvinism is closer to nationalism than anti-feminism. A better descriptor for these "radical feminists" might be misandrists
(for misandry, the male-directed equivalent of misogyny). I apologize for not at least looking up the definitions before opening my mouth.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Why are we giving this so much attention? I feel like we're feeding a troll here.