Poll: The Liberal Arts and You; The Importance of the Liberal Arts in the Modern World

[aashell13]

A waste? certainly not. somebody has to deliver the pizzas at engineering conventions

 

[Shock and Awe]

I'm going to major in History at the Citadel so I can't knock Liberal Arts to much, but if I wasn't going to be in the military and have a job waiting after college I probably would choose something else. Though everything has a purpose, though there isn't much for philosophy or English.

 

[Tanis]

Personally, I see NO reason why, as an IS major I even NEED half the crap I'm taking.

A secondary language should be an elective, not a bloody requirement!

 

[BlumiereBleck]

I like it, I became obsessed with Rome and Roman Culture because of it.

 

[Kryzantine]

To say that "Liberal Arts students are worthless" is quite simply a display of prejudice. Yes, it is as bad as saying black people are worthless. You're generalising with no real reason to do so.

To be fair, I remember a particular conversation with an employer when on the issue of hiring workers in China, "In America, 75% of the people coming out of college are worthless and you can't really trust them to do anything; but the other 25% are phenomenal. They'll think creatively, work in groups and do their work better than anyone else. When you're hiring in China, you can trust everyone to do their work, but they need somebody looking over their shoulder." While the China section is fairly irrelevant to this discussion, since it's a different problem entirely for them, the man has a point when talking about American college graduates. Most liberal arts students are indeed worthless to the corporate employer. Most people don't even know what they're studying. Colleges across America are inflated and filled with low-performing students that probably don't deserve to be in a college, but are there because we put them there. The degree itself means little anymore.

On the other hand, if you're a part of that 25%, it's visible. At the very least, you'll come off on other people as an intelligent person that can work well with others. But you can't emphasize the degree. You need to behave like a phenomenal worker, as a lifestyle.

 

[Craorach]

I believe that mainstream education should focus on practical skills such as reading, writing, sciences, maths and on what we called "Humanities" at my school.. History (of the world, not of particular groups), Geography and Social Studies (All Religion, Politics, Ethics). It should also include, however, a reasonably ammount of Art, Music and Sport so young people have the opportunity to discover talent and interests they might not get at home. If people want to chose to study the arts more extensively in further education (College, University, etc) then that should be their choice.. however I don't think it should be encouraged by the education system unless they actually have some creative ability and talent just because the student wants a "free degree".

 

[Snake Plissken]

As a rule, I think liberal arts studies and liberal arts students are mostly worthless.

That being said, my degree is in education. Education is a field of liberal arts. I'm a little torn.

Erm, well, as is pretty obvious, I'd have to disagree on the first bit. I think liberal arts might require one to be a little more creative and think harder to achieve something, but ease isn't really always the goal. Or I'd hope not!

I'll make sure to tell all of the budding particle physicists to quit their degree program because studying liberal arts will make you "think harder"...

 

[BonsaiK]

Personally, the liberal arts are a topic that I have, until recently, disregarded. Furthermore, I would go so far as to say I would put down the idea of the liberal arts as a useless set of studies.

However, after reading a lot on the topic, and talking to quite a few people involved both in education and business, I've found that this superficially impractical group of studies is in fact deeply rooted in the fabric of what we call society.

My question to the people of this fine community;
What do you think of the liberal arts? Why do you think, in recent years, governments have indeed been cutting funding to many universities and secondary schools for their liberal arts programs, in favour of engineering, sciences, and labour related programs?

Also; how many of you all have received a liberal arts education and what do you think it has done to affect your decisions or life since?

How do "liberal" arts differ from any other kind of arts? I don't see what's so "liberal" about arts studies anyway. I studied music but I'd seriously question whether there's any "liberal" element to that at all, especially given the content of the courses. In fact I'm not even entirely sure what you mean by the word "liberal" because that word means something pretty different in my country to a lot of others... you'd have to answer that question for me before I could answer yours. Or maybe you can rephrase your question without using the toxic word "liberal" which really confuses things.

 

[Buzz Killington_v1legacy]

The word "liberal" in "liberal arts" has nothing to do with politics. Look:

liberal arts
late 14c., translating L. artes liberales ; the seven attainments directed to intellectual enlargement, not immediate practical purpose, and thus deemed worthy of a free man (liberal in this sense is opposed to servile or mechanical ).

--Online Etymology Dictionary, © 2010 Douglas Harper

liberal arts definition
The areas of learning that cultivate general intellectual ability rather than technical or professional skills. The term liberal arts is often used as a synonym for humanities, although the liberal arts also include the sciences. The word liberal comes from the Latin liberalis, meaning suitable for a free man, as opposed to a slave.

--The American Heritage® New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third Edition
Copyright © 2005 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

 

[CourtneyCC]

As a rule, I think liberal arts studies and liberal arts students are mostly worthless.

That being said, my degree is in education. Education is a field of liberal arts. I'm a little torn.

Erm, well, as is pretty obvious, I'd have to disagree on the first bit. I think liberal arts might require one to be a little more creative and think harder to achieve something, but ease isn't really always the goal. Or I'd hope not!

I'll make sure to tell all of the budding particle physicists to quit their degree program because studying liberal arts will make you "think harder"...

Well, while I think a liberal arts degree may help them significantly, I'd say keep doing their course of studies; major in liberal arts and complete all the requirements, but at least double major; getting into a post-graduate physics program would be a hell of a lot easier if you can both talk about particle physics and discuss the history, politically and otherwise, of the scienctific advancements that lead to the study of particle physics as it is seen today.

 

[CourtneyCC]

Personally, the liberal arts are a topic that I have, until recently, disregarded. Furthermore, I would go so far as to say I would put down the idea of the liberal arts as a useless set of studies.

However, after reading a lot on the topic, and talking to quite a few people involved both in education and business, I've found that this superficially impractical group of studies is in fact deeply rooted in the fabric of what we call society.

My question to the people of this fine community;
What do you think of the liberal arts? Why do you think, in recent years, governments have indeed been cutting funding to many universities and secondary schools for their liberal arts programs, in favour of engineering, sciences, and labour related programs?

Also; how many of you all have received a liberal arts education and what do you think it has done to affect your decisions or life since?

How do "liberal" arts differ from any other kind of arts? I don't see what's so "liberal" about arts studies anyway. I studied music but I'd seriously question whether there's any "liberal" element to that at all, especially given the content of the courses. In fact I'm not even entirely sure what you mean by the word "liberal" because that word means something pretty different in my country to a lot of others... you'd have to answer that question for me before I could answer yours. Or maybe you can rephrase your question without using the toxic word "liberal" which really confuses things.

Liberal arts, as mentioned by buzzkillington, is by no means having anything to do with liberality in the sense of political or social constructs. It goes back to the root of the phrase meaning freedom. It is a course of studies to help widen the perspective of the student to help persue 'the good life', for both himself and the world. Personally, I have very conservative political (economic) views, (my social views are very liberal), but a liberal arts or liberal education are things I hold in high esteem.

Also, again in response to the people who don't like the phrase 'liberal arts' or 'liberal education', I say we can also call it the 'humanities', as it still gets the point across with it being about helping a person be a human 'being', not a human 'doing'. The human is the focus of the liberal arts education, and considering the human condition in all it's forms. While studying another topic in an isolated and focused way can be productive in that given field, to truly apply what you learn or invent, you need a perspective of the outside world. And I can't think of a better way than a heavy education in the humanities.

Furthermore; I'd like to point out I'm planning on medical school after my liberal arts education, for which I already have many of the prerequisites. I am by no means apposed to being something other than a philosopher or educator (though I think both are well worth their weight in gold), so to everyone who wants to be a computer engineer or physics major, or wants to study film making, I say, go for it. But the liberal arts education will be more helpful than you can imagine, especially for the first and last especially, being such applied professions dealing with interfacing with other people.

 

[SilentCom]

The University I go to is a Liberal Arts university. I find that having an understanding of the Liberal Arts is useful to understanding the society we live in.

Sciences and engineering are more stressed today because society is technology driven and demands more knowledgable and skilled workers in the sciences and engineering.

 

[Nautical Honors Society]

It isn't a waste of time at all. I go to a liberal arts college and here is the list of majors available at that school:

American Studies
Anthropology
Art History
Asian Studies
Biology
Chemistry
Classics
Computer Science
Dance and Dance Theater
Economics
Education Studies
English
Environmental Studies
Exercise Science
Foreign Language
Geosciences
Government
History
Management and Business
Mathematics
Music
Neuroscience
Philosophy
Physics
Psychology
Religious Studies
Social Work
Sociology
Studio Art
Theater
Women's Studies

 

[bdcjacko]

Everyone I know that has a liberal arts degree is working the same level job they had in high school. I mean I could read before college, I do see the point in going into a program that teaches me how to read more better than before. I wanted to learn how to do something that would get me a job. That is why I'm an accountant with average grades and my brother is a sandwich maker with good grades and an english major.

 

[bdcjacko]

Everyone I know that has a liberal arts degree is working the same level job they had in high school. I mean I could read before college, I do see the point in going into a program that teaches me how to read more better than before. I wanted to learn how to do something that would get me a job. That is why I'm an accountant with average grades and my brother is a sandwich maker with good grades and an english major.

And I'm superman.
Claims are easy to make.

I don't follow...are you saying my claims of being an accountant are fictitious?

 

[tigermilk]

I am doing a Masters Degree in film. Will it help by job prospects? No probably not. Am I hugely enjoying it? Do I feel it makes me a better person? Do I belive in art for arts sake? Yes, Yes and FUCK YES.

To be fair my Masters may marginally improve my job prospects. I will have evidence of the ability to plan and write an 20,000 word research project with some finance/economics orientation underpinning my final project.

I'm in my late twenties and living in the UK. Those people with degrees do have an edge in the employment market in general, of course applied degrees will lead you to paticular jobs (pharmacy, dentistry etc) but any degree reflects an ability to work at a certain level.

In the long term I may pursue a career in academia which would be very difficult without an Undergraduate Degree in Sociology and Masters Degree in film.

For those who have a choice an applied degree scheme may help you in the job market, but this somewhat pre-supposes an ability of the individual to engage with both the arts/social sciences and pure sciences/business disciplines.

EDIT:

Why do you think, in recent years, governments have indeed been cutting funding to many universities and secondary schools for their liberal arts programs, in favour of engineering, sciences, and labour related programs?

To placate a (possibly fictional/possibly real) reactionary right wing proportion of the voting public who believe in times of recession funding the pure sciences/business orientated schemes reflect a government attempting to improve the economy. It is essentially the manifestation of the assumption people are stupid and wan't to see simple attempts to resolve complex financial issues.

 

[Tyynn_Kaann]

Third choice. As a major, it's a really, really stupid idea, because with government support for college kids, it artificially increases the number of kids who go into college not knowing what they want to do and going for worthless degrees because the market for specialists in those fields is way over-saturated. Leaves 'em hopeless afterward. However, as a secondary focus of higher education, it actually makes sense to aim for a broader understanding of "liberal" knowledge. If they were costed more based on what they're worth, it would make a lot more sense. As it stands, the cost between credit hours, or full time enrollment, is static, which again artificially boost the enrollment in these overall less demanding courses.

This is the main reason I am still a biochemistry major even though I enjoy English classes more than anything else, and you'll be more likely to see me writing an essay than doing a synthesis in my spare time. I consistently get better grades in these classes than I do in my science classes with less effort. From my perspective, it would seem that anyone is quite capable of getting at least a minor in one of the liberal arts and be a better person from it.

But I still voted yes, not because I disagree that the market is getting flooded, but because I believe there is a place for specialists. My significant other double majored in History/Art History because those were things that she loved and, furthermore, things that she has a preternatural talent for. The ease with which she can closely analyze a painting is always surprising to me, whose first response to a painting is "a-duh, pretty colors!" Even though there are many who major in history and art history because they enjoy the subject and they couldn't do anything with it, Emily has the goal of someday curating a museum, and because of her broad education and talents I'm sure that she would be able to succeed at running any sort of museum.

I guess what I'm actually saying is that everyone should broaden their scope a little. If more of these drifters who aren't dedicated to their field shopped around a bit, I'm sure they would find something they enjoyed far more and eventually the equilibrium of specialists would balance out.

Of course, our current method of schooling just isn't built for this. It rewards people who are completely focused on a single field, and furthermore doesn't offer extra incentive for struggle. General credits aren't doing their job. They're treated like something that needs to be done as soon as possible so that the "real" education can happen when what they should be doing is making a student explore other options while they're on the path to their goal.

Oh, yes...

I believe that mainstream education should focus on practical skills such as reading, writing, sciences, maths and on what we called "Humanities" at my school.. History (of the world, not of particular groups), Geography and Social Studies (All Religion, Politics, Ethics). It should also include, however, a reasonably ammount of Art, Music and Sport so young people have the opportunity to discover talent and interests they might not get at home. If people want to chose to study the arts more extensively in further education (College, University, etc) then that should be their choice.. however I don't think it should be encouraged by the education system unless they actually have some creative ability and talent just because the student wants a "free degree".

Sorry, I know that sounded good in your head, but this is already what is done in high schools and it doesn't work. Encouraging those that have obvious natural talent disqualifies those that would really have a lot to add to a field if they were given the chance to struggle for what they want. In addition, those individuals that are talented are never given the chance to really work hard to receive a reward. In many regards, I actually think that this increases flooding. Talented people (of which there are not a few) never learn to really push themselves because they're coddled, which means that if their talent is superficial they will end up with a dead end degree. On the other hand, the people who, with some effort, might have later found greatness on the easel are forced into degrees that will slowly crush their spirit.

My point is this: In a perfect world the teachers role should be like the role of a DM or game designer. They should challenge the students, not coddle the talented. They should not favor one field over another, instead allowing the student to go as in-depth into fields they enjoy. A teacher should always encourage the student to overcome the challenges that the teacher has set in front of them, but always tailor the challenges to the student. Yeah, this is difficult for a teacher to do this with 20+ students, but then again, that's why when Einstein tutored children he would always tell the parents to pull them out of the public schools.

Ending with this:

Furthermore; I'd like to point out I'm planning on medical school after my liberal arts education, for which I already have many of the prerequisites. I am by no means apposed to being something other than a philosopher or educator (though I think both are well worth their weight in gold), so to everyone who wants to be a computer engineer or physics major, or wants to study film making, I say, go for it. But the liberal arts education will be more helpful than you can imagine, especially for the first and last especially, being such applied professions dealing with interfacing with other people.

You, my friend, are awesome. I'm getting an English degree after my biochemistry degree, so high-five.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

I voted "no" because Liberal Arts are the most important thing colleges offer.

All science and law started out as liberal arts - as philosophies. All art. All modern knowledge and learning.

Has it evolved since then? Sure. But it all started out as liberal arts.

Liberal arts ARE the future.

*Spoken by an individual with a Grad degree in Liberal arts, who teaches Liberal arts for a living. I realize I am biased, but on the other side I chose this evocation because I believe in its importance.

 

[Trolldor]

Everyone I know that has a liberal arts degree is working the same level job they had in high school. I mean I could read before college, I do see the point in going into a program that teaches me how to read more better than before. I wanted to learn how to do something that would get me a job. That is why I'm an accountant with average grades and my brother is a sandwich maker with good grades and an english major.

And I'm superman.
Claims are easy to make.

I don't follow...are you saying my claims of being an accountant are fictitious?

Unless you're willing to substantiate them, I'm saying they're irrelevant.
And I very much doubt you're willing to give a name, work address and photograph to prove you are.