Poll: What are the problems with MMO's and what could we possibly learn inorder to make a better one

Lazzi

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Apr 12, 2008
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We've all seen the forums that are always some thing along the lines of "what your idea for a new and great mmo". and Im shore that most of us have put up some idea or respsonce. Yet heres some thing that has crossed my mind 'do we knwo what makes a good MMO in the first place'.

I belive its would benifit every one greatly if we firgured what makes and break an mmo befor we come up with ideas.

I am aware that i dotn have an all of thee above option but thats becasue i want to now your opinions of the BIGGEST problem. Also please do not state "this is a good game, play" or any veriation of that, its s useless opionion i watn thoguhts not brain dead comentary.

So i invite you all to come and think PRODUCTIVLY about what would assist the game industry and help them create better games for us or at least for our child (THINK ABOUT THE CHILDREN!!!!). So post your anilitacal opinion ,and please no flaming each other people.

I want us to think creativly.

P.S. Im dyslixic so i apologize in advanced for any spelling mistakes i make.
 

CanadianWolverine

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My major problem with MMO's is the monthly payment structure. The only one I have ever considered getting was Guild Wars because of the prospect of only dealing with a one time payment. Micro payments also "kinda" work - for other people, for me I just keep playing the free game indefinitely. In my life, I just don't want to not be able to play a game months or years later, just because I don't make a monthly payment or what have you.

If there was some way to make a MMO have that same bit of entitlement I feel to the ownership of the game, plus only having to do a one time payment, then I can swallow that pill and go down the rabbit hole. I am not against multiplayer only games, just being unable to play it any time after I purchase it.
 

Keet

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Largest problem with MMORPGS for me is the complete and utter lack of any overarching storyline. Sure, there are individual guild quests and item quests and "please help me scratch my nanny's bum" subquests, but when all is said and done, there really isn't any depth to it. The industry can regurgitate fanfiction into official storybooks as much as it wants to, but the fact remains that if it is not in the game, then ipso facto, it is a commercial figment and nothing more. PSO was the only online rpg that managed to avoid this pitfall, but they made the game so rigedly structured that partying was a hassle and the whole experience seemed somewhat hollow in retrospect.

Also, I have to agree with Canadianwolverine on this one. Blizzard has a strict no-tolerance policy on private servers and will actually ban players caught on them for life from their little toy world. This kind of negates the idea that you're paying a monthly fee for server maintanance and development, since a private server isn't draining on them. Most people that are on ps's are the people that wouldn't shill out money to keep playing the game in the first place, but I digress (frequently). Generally speaking, it's my firm opinion that the online games industry is barreling down the wrong way, flames spewing off the rear and taking people along for a very pretty and short ride.
 

Deathbird

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Jan 30, 2008
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If you want to find the faults of an mmo, just play one.
Theres plenty to go around in every game.
 

The Franco

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I liked WoW for a while, until I realized it commandeered my life and I had to schedule everything else around raiding. Raiding was fun for a week or so, but pressing the same fucking button mindlessly got really annoying. It was like that episode of the Simpsons where Homer became fat enough to go on disability leave, then he set a toy bird to keep pressing "y" on his computer. It honestly felt like that, so I guess you can say that the downfall of MMO's is grind. Better writers than me have already beat the grinding issue into the ground far enough to open a deli in Shanghai, and I don't feel like trying to add to the topic. Short story, grinding sucked.
 

AngryMan

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Mar 26, 2008
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Flip the question on it's head: ask "why is WoW so popular?"

It's a sad but (generally) true fact that originality does not give a game mass appeal. Sure, it may sell the game to a niche market, and that niche market may even be fairly large, but a considerable percentage of the world's "average" gamers - the people not posting in forums like this one - don't give a swollen cancerous testicle about originality. They want popularity. They want ease of use.

Many people will ignore gaping flaws in the game mechanic, procedure, and setting for the secure knowledge that they are surrounded and supported by as many fellow players as possible. This is especially true of MMOs, but is by no means limited to those. How else do you think games like FIFA soccer games, NFL sequels, the Need for Speed series and the like continue to thrive? People buy them because people buy them, not necessarily because they're any good.

That's why WoW is so immensely popular - it's enormous popularity provides it with a sort of "gravity" that draws other players in. The process snowballs, meaning that the bigger the game gets, the bigger the game will continue to get until it finally reaches an equilibrium point where it has already drawn in as many of the lowest common denominator as it can achieve.

From that point onwards, games have to rely on their originality. Not just in setting, but also in game mechanic, execution, style, appearance and intellectual content.

The fact is that players who are interested in games that are mould-breaking, envelope-pushing experiments into new creative territory are a minority. A fairly sizeable minority, maybe, but still less than 50% of the whole.

In order to improve MMOs, therefore, we need to improve human nature to the point where such improvements will reap financial success. An MMO is a commodity that must be sold, and game developers are companies out to make money. I'm sure quite a lot of developers would be interested in creating the next truly original online gaming odyssey. But at the end of the day people have to eat when they go home and that inevitably means sacrificing some degree of artistic vision in favour of the safe bet.

It's like how you have to have staple foods in your diet. Sure, Oreos, chocolate, crumpets and Guinness are wonderful things, but if you neglect your meat, rice, potatoes and vegetables you're going to suffer because of it.
 

jezz8me

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Mar 27, 2008
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all of the above. The formula and mechanic is made form the game but the story, meaning, themes and everything is not there. We need a world (city, town, state ect) not just a basic (if large) environment.
 

misterk

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AngryMan said:
Flip the question on it's head: ask "why is WoW so popular?"


That's why WoW is so immensely popular - it's enormous popularity provides it with a sort of "gravity" that draws other players in. The process snowballs, meaning that the bigger the game gets, the bigger the game will continue to get until it finally reaches an equilibrium point where it has already drawn in as many of the lowest common denominator as it can achieve.
I think you're being unfair to Wow, as many are these days- while what you say has some truth, there has to be a reason why the game was popular in the first place. It took what the biggest MMos had done, and gave them polish, made them more forgiving and more fun, and set it in a well realised world with stories to tell.

Wow lacks an over arching plot, something difficult for any MMO to acheieve and exist for longer than a set period of time, but has lots of minature stories to tell, and by creating a very beautiful world which the player can explore, draws the players in that way. From a basic level, the early quick level progression is probably what drew me in- getting more abilities, and also competing with my friends, fighting new quests and going on my first instance, it sucked me in, of this I have no doubt. Crafting provided a distraction, and there was always a new goal to aim for. Goal orientated playing is ultimately what most gamers crave.

Sadly, the problems cropped up. The grind got to me, and advancement slowed down to a crawl as I wondered round, looking sadly for quests to complete that were worth my while- not being the most social of players I had avoided any real structure and had managed to hit level 34 without any real allies, other than my friends, who shared the same computer. So most of the quests available to me at that time were dull, and the interesting ones were far too hard for me to do solo. I no longer had goals I was interested in- level 40 looked fun, for the prescene of a mount, but by this point it occured to me that the reward of going faster wasn't really all that amazing- it was kind of something they should already have.

Pvp briefly sparked my interest with the introduction of battlegrounds, but I was quick to notice that this was not a proper challenge- certain players, by getting epic gear, meant that I could not enjoy these matches- the enemy was just too strong.


So, how to improve? I think it's important to let players play their own way on this kind of experience, and for it to remain fun at all levels. People tell me that the experience at level 70 is great, but I really do wonder if 70 levels of boredom is really worth it to get there. Being in a group is fun, but you need to be online a LOT to maintain that structure if these people aren't real life friends. If I want to play a few times a week, then I'm going to have difficulty forming social groups. I don't mind group playing, and admirably the system for finding groups for instances works quite well, but it's annoying to say the least that often the best quests require two players. If the game is going to do that, it would be helpful to allow people to form groups far more easily.

Pvp needs more balance. For sure, there should be rewards for obssesive playing, and those people can play each other, but an element of matching in battlegrounds would be useful, and make it more fun for people who cannot devote the same amount of time.

A variety of enemies would be nice. As any character specialises, they tend to get into a rut of using exactly the same moves against every enemy they face- it would be nice if there was some more variety that forced you to change your tactics against these people- some spells being more effective than others, perhaps.
 

portuga-man

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I would choose the first four options, if i could.

Most mmo's (if not all) lack originality. It's the same thing over and over again. Medieval setting, mythical beasts, arcane magic, and the story is something in the lines of "[evil-sounding god name]'s power is rising. The [evil race] are preparing for a full-scale invasion of the [cliché land name]". Then you start the game and you're ordered by the general himself to kill five slimes...

Talking about killing slimes, you spend most of the time grinding to get to a decent level, having no fun at all in the process. They could, at least, figure out a compelling, fun way to do it, but nope, let the customers suffer. By the time players notice, they'll be so hooked to the game that they won't be able to leave it, and even if they leave, the mmo has already sucked a ton of money from him.

As for the ingame economy, there's only one thing you can talk about: Gold farmers. Bot's that collect a shitload of money to sell it for real cash. And game developers couldn't care less, because this gold farmers are also subscribers who pay to play the freaking game, so the only chance you get to see this guys getting banned s if they forget to pay their subscription.

As for lack of individuality in character appearance, there's really not much mmo game developers can do about it. And the bigger an mmo gets, the more player individuality you'll have.

(sheesh, I'm going on an mmo rant rage today...)
 

Lazzi

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Deathbird said:
If you want to find the faults of an mmo, just play one.
Theres plenty to go around in every game.
oh hell i no whats wrong with them, i just want people to start thing about what can be done to IMPROVE them. Not saying "oh dear you've just fallen a well" i made this forum so we can come up with ideas to fix them.
 

JakubK666

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Jan 1, 2008
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Can I select all of them?

First thing, they should be less grind dependant.
So far I only know one game(AirRivals) where skill is more important than levels but even there it doesn't work our to well.But you still need to grind to 70-80 in order for skill>level to really work which can be a pain in the ass.
 

soul_rune1984

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Mar 7, 2008
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You should have given an all of the above option but since you didn't I clicked Other. My friend bought me WoW for Christmas one year I tried playing it used up the free month and haven't touched it since. The lack of an actual story, plus all the morons shouting racist and homophobic insults at each other and the lagging. They actually expected me to pay a monthly fee for that? If there isn't a good story to follow forget it.
 

scoHish

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Mar 27, 2008
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It just seems to me, that for the most part developers try to hide the fact that they dont have any new ideas, by covering a dying MMO with a new skin. Just because now im digging for ore with a laser-drill instead of a pick-axe, it doesn't change the fact that im still doing the same thing for hours on end. Not to mention I'm paying 60 bucks a month to click the same spot on the ground over and over until I can go do somthing else repeditive. There are MMOs that have broken away from this and tried to be different, but as far as I can tell they are usually not accepted by the general public and never really get anywhere.
 

sun_and_earth

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Feb 28, 2008
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My biggest problems with MMOs:

1) Severs are entirely populated by MORONS. Am I really the only one who actually wants to ROLE PLAY in a ROLE PLAYING GAME?

2) Monthly subscriptions. I understand that servers don't come cheap, but if I pay sixty dollars for a game I want to be able to play it.

3) Obsessive need to be EXACTLY like World of Warcraft. Can't anyone try something new with these games? How about a turn-based game? Are they illegal or something?
 

strangemusic

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Mar 20, 2008
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EVE Online, in my experience, solved all of the problems in that poll except "Wannabe cyber badasses"... BoB, I'm looking at you! Heh... I played City of Heroes, and while I loved the game, it just boiled down to grinding around the lv.30 range. I played Guild Wars, which was just... full of assholes. I played PlanetSide, which was awesome, but then Sony gave it the finger. And then EVE... was like... a breath of fresh space-air, I suppose. No "direct" grinding (but a lot of waiting!), a vast conflict with actual importance, death was more than an annoyance, lots of cool people to fly with, a robust (if sometimes kinda broken, thanks CCP!) economy, and no elves with pointy ears. Although, if you're not playing with a competent corp, you're essentially done for. Unfortunately I've stopped playing due to time commitments, but it was, for me at least, essentially the cure to this poll's list of major ailments.
 

Lazzi

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Tunaphish6 said:
The problem with this poll is that a few of the options have nothing to do with the actual MMO game but are about the people playing. Options should have included 'lack-luster graphics,' something I personally have problems with WoW, or the opposite, 'too system demanding,' something I've seen in EQ2.
with hind sight i have to aggre with you to a setin extent. However we need to understand the graphics while very nice and pretty, take up alot of computing power and that would drive up the cost of game development. Also high graphics woudl require more complex and powerfull severs and woudl give them more reason to drive up the price of monthly payments
 

Meshakhad_v1legacy

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Feb 20, 2008
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As strangemusic said, EVE has few of the problems of other MMOs. We do have the wannabe cyber badasses, but they are easy fodder for actual cyber badasses. Also, CCP shows no mercy with regards to ISK sellers/buyers, since they piss off the rest of the player base.

I'd say that the players are a big problem. It's endemic to multiplayer games.
 

nightmare_gorilla

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Jan 22, 2008
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my biggest problem with mmos has always been the combat, i loved diablo 1 and 2, i enjoy starcraft, but it seems this real time turn based combat is now required by law in all mmos these days, i hate it it's so boring i just can't find the strength to care about anything thats going on around it. if they did another game like diablo 2 with skills and interesting stuff going on i'd probably play it.

i'd also like an objective, it seems in most mmos these days the ultimate objective is to level up and gain more skills so you can level up faster... how about a story, how about something to freaking do.