Skeleon said:
Nicholas Chandler-Yates said:
Lets say that the criteria for making something a 'console' means having a Custom OS, a new controller, and games that run on it.
Why those particular criteria?
Because thats all that sparates the Xbone and PS4 from a PC. and whether you agree or not, a PC is not considered a 'console'. So what then is a console? well i just counted the differences between PC's and the Xbone/PS4 and this is what I came up with. I *suppose* you could say that the additional thing that makes something a console is a closed ecosystem, i.e., no hardware upgrades, no hack-ability, and a closed marketplace. In which case the stem machine would not classify as a console.
The other argument i was trying and failing to make is that the PC hs its own version of these three criterion (controller, OS, and game library), it has a custom OS (windows), custom game library (the biggest and most legacy accessible), and a custom input device (keyboard/mouse)
Semantics really, I was just thinking off the top of my head what makes each gaming machine special from the others.
of the three new consoles, which of them SHOULD you want? Which gives the best policies, options, etc.
PC. Definitely the best options. And you don't tie yourself to a particular developer, giving them a monopoly on your gaming experience.
But I asked about consoles specifically (PS4, Xbone, SM)
Yes... for you PCs are the best. but many console gamers don't want a PC, they want a console, and the convenience that comes with it, and the SM is being marketed as a console. (more on this below)
...or convert your existing windows PC over to a Steam Machine.
What would be my incentive for doing so?
you? not much to be honest, but you could run a dual boot, because games designed for linux natively might run better through steamOS, after all it is being designed as a slimline operating system with a low processor overhead.
and then argue that this somehow makes CONSOLES better???
[...](even if a few of the ones they do have are exclusives, they still have less exclusives compared to the open 'PC' platforms)
Don't worry about that, I don't want a different console, either. But at least they have exclusives to hold people's games hostage. That could be a reason to get a console if you really, really want those
specific games rather than just the largest exclusives-count.
The other big reason is convenience. PC gamers always underestimate how little the 'average console joe' just does not want to deal with the hassles of PC gaming. Steam machines change that for them, gives them an option that is both as convenient as a console, and as versatile as a PC (no exclusivity or locked down firmware hardware, upgradable, etc. This gives a great avenue for the whole group of console gamers that have wanted to join the PC gamers, but don't want to deal with the hassle.
You might say that a PC can already do all these things, after all, put an Xbox controller on your PC, plug into TV, run steam in big picture mode. However, the PC has never been *marketed* this way, and its really only a duct-tape type solution anyway, most PC games designed for PC won't run well with a controller with thumb sticks, precisely why valve had to invent a new input device.
So it's about marketing and the controller, basically? Let's ignore marketing then. Is there any word on whether that controller will
only work with the SteamOS? I'm also curious how any old PC converted into a Steam Machine by way of SteamOS and controller will somehow be less of a duct-tape type solution. The vast differences in hardware setup and all that remain in that case.
Nope, the controller will work just fine with windows or mac too. Valve is building the Steam Controller to work with all versions of steam. Valve doesn't care what platform you use, as long as you buy steam games. Steam OS was a way of pushing PC gaming a bit in the direction of Linux, while simultaneously reducing the cost of the steam machine consoles (how would they be able to compete for price if each of them cost $100 more because of a Windows license?)
As for the Steam Controller, Valve wants to bring the convenience of couch gaming to all steam users (if they want it), not just to steam *machine* users. Steam machines are just a convenient entry point.
...and in most ways outclasses the current PC setup
In what ways? You need to be more specific on that, because I'm not seeing it.
i don't remember in what context i said this, and don't have time to go back and check just now, send me the whole quote and ill let you know what i meant.
You could say that a PC has all the same functionality, but at the point where you hook up your steam controller and install steamOS (or stick with windows whatever), and plug it into your TV, it BECOMES a Steam Machine.
That makes it sound like the controller
will work without SteamOS. Meaning that, apparently, all that is left is the marketing. Grand.
Yes exactly, marketing to console gamers, basically valve is making a SUPER CONVENIENT gaming PC, set up and ready to play games through steam, with none of the non gaming stuff in the way of the experience. You might it just a nerfed PC, but it actually has the capability of all the functionality that a PC has, *IF* you want it to have that functionality. PC gamers act like it would be ludicrous to want features to be 'removed' but thats exactly what console gamers want, a more streamlined experience. Turn on the machine, play games, turn off machine. PC can do that, but its not as straightforward for a non PC gamer, especially when setting up the system.
Think about it, if you buy a prebuilt PC can you open the box, plug it into the wall does it boot straight to a screen where you can start playing games? Hell no, install some antivirus software, download steam, download a browser better than IE, mess around with your network settings for a few hours sometimes, etc, etc. While this shit is easy for *me*, for the average 'console gaming joe' this is all foreign territory.
Steam Machines offer the convenience of a console's plug-and-play system with the fact that it is open source and fully changeable (if you want to do all the rest of the stuff a PC can do, go nuts). While PS4 and Xbone offer the same convenience, its the second part that they are lacking. Yet PC gamers are CRITICIZING the steam machine idea for having the GALL to be both a convenient gaming console, and a fully functioning PC.
As another note, it would be remiss of me not to note that another thing that separates gaming PCs from Steam Machines is size. While you *can* build a PC as small as a Steam Machine, no one does, and I have yet to see pre-builds that are super small either. Many console gamers don't want a dirty great massive PC tower in their living room (myself included). I move around a lot, and the size of a steam machine seams useful in and of itself. That said, I'll probably build one myself, I have *just* enough know-how, and water cooling mods do look pretty fun.
Doom972 said:
I already have a powerful PC so I don't have a reason to buy a Steam Machine at the moment. I do plan to install Steam OS on my laptop and try out the streaming feature.
I like this idea, using an old laptop as a streaming device. I wonder how powerful the streaming machine has to be? if not much, this will be done a lot I think, lots of people have old laptops sitting around in the attic from when they upgraded 5 years ago or so. I wonder if a laptop from the days of WindowsXP would be powerful enough.
--->TL
R, Steam Machines have two advantages over PCs, plug-and-play functionality for people who just want to play games, and physical size (though this is arguable). The controller isn't an 'advantage' because as soon as Steam Machines release, the controller functionality will be added to the list of PC pro-points as well.
