Poll: When do you think Bioware started going downhill?

[Magicman10893]

Around the time EA bought them out. Their games before that were amazing (KoToR, ME, DA:O, and Jade Empire were the only ones I played) and then EA had to muck everything up. I generally liked ME2 and (most of) the decisions they made to alter the gameplay were well received on my end (making a Third-Person-Shooter/RPG hybrid a little smoother in the TPS department makes perfect sense to me), but the story and writing declined on a whole.

Dragon Age 2 was the first time they made a game the genuinely made me upset. At first I was in denial, but the more I think about the game the more I realize how much of a set back it was. To me, the story was fine (the whole Mage/Templar rivalry was pretty apparent from the first game and even the part where the First Enchanter goes crazy was pretty well foreshadowed if you find the hidden Codex Entries). The gameplay and design however was taking 4 steps back for every step forward. Want to make gameplay more fast paced and exciting while still keeping in line with the strategy? Sounds great to me! By that you mean you want to remove auto-attack and flood the screen with enemies when it doesn't make any sense so the end result is a watered-down Dynasty Warriors knockoff? That is where I cross the line.

Not to mention the fact that the entire game apparently takes place in the same building, alleyway, cave, dungeon and mine. That was passable in Mass Effect 1 because they didn't have as much funding and at least there was some kind of lore to hand-wave the problem away (the buildings on planets were dropped from orbit rather than built on location with resources readily available) and they at least varied the content in each room with different box layouts.

I will in all honestly get Dragon Age 3 if it looks like they learned their lesson from DA2, but considering EA's death grip seems to be depriving them off oxygen I highly doubt they'll be able to make the drastic changes necessary to make the game passable given their short development times.

 

[In Search of Username]

Admittedly they've made mistakes recently - DA2's environment recycling, ME3's ending, and generally getting involved with EA at all. But they still make great games, even if they don't match up to KOTOR or Mass Effect or whatever. If DA3 is terrible maybe I'll reconsider, but I don't think they're doing nearly as badly as their so-called fanbase wants to believe.

 

[Danzavare]

I haven't had a chance to play their early games until recently (I bought KOTOR off steam, loving it so far, and am waiting for the new update of original Baldur's Gate) so I can't adequately compare to them. I will say that the reverence I had for the company because of Jade Empire and Dragon Age: Origins was heavily wounded by the existence of DA2. It's a terrible games and easily the most disappointing gaming experience I've had to endure.

 

[shrekfan246]

I don't think they have at all. Yes, they may not be making the games "you" in particular like playing anymore, either because what they are doing has changed and/or because your own tastes have changed, but that doesn't instantly mean they are making worse games.

But... but... developers are never allowed to branch out into other genres! They have to be railroaded into making the same thing year after year, because I say so! If they don't, then they're dumbing down their games and broadening the appeal to wider audiences (which they're doing anyway, because their games are easier and less convoluted, which instantly means broadened appeal)!

Yeah, I'm going to say they've just been going into a steady decline since their acquisition by EA, because I've had tons of fun with every Bioware game I've played, and that includes DA2 and ME3.

 

[Patrick Buck]

I still like them. I haven't played Dragon age 2, nor do i really want to, and I LIKED the mass effect 3 ending. Was it too bleak for you all? Was the message that whatever you do, sometimes it doesn't matter, it doesn't make a difference in the end to bleak? Meh. I liked it. But prehaps I'm just a depressing ol' freak.

 

[Paladin2905]

They were a must buy developer for me back before their takeover, but their methods and feeling seemed to make a sideways shift after Mass Effect was released (which coincided perfectally with their takeover).
Past that point, they were really not in the business of releasing anything new and different anymore, every iteration forthwith of any game they make has just been a generalization towards whatever themes and mechanics are most popular in the current day. For all its faults, Mass Effect contained a bunch of interesting gameplay for the genre it was entering (infinite ammo, the mako / exploration, an actually new and interesting IP not modelled after history or established fantasy). Every generation following the takeover reduced the unique parts and added in more common elements- therefore I believe it is a good breakpoint for where Bioware started to slip.

 

[lacktheknack]

I think they're still doing pretty good, regardless of the EA thumb they're under.

People seem to forget that the first 149/150 of Mass Effect 3 was still pretty dang good.

 

[Riff Moonraker]

For me it was the first Mass Effect that made me step back and question weather Bioware was making games I wanted to play any more.

The plot and setting was good but there did not seem to be anything other than the main quest and anything other than that was usually a lot of talking which is ok but you need to have something worth talking about, running around talking to team members to see which one you are going to sleep with is lame, you would think it would make the game more mature but in a lot of ways it seemed to make it way less. Also the speech options seemed to be pretty limited to the Good, evil, neutral paths without options that I felt Shepard would actually say in that situation. Then again I may be remembering it wrong by now.

Dragon Age:O was better with dialog in general but right off the bat it was the same three choice option with nothing creative, side quests seemed better but the main story was boring and it had the same layout as mass effect, go to set piece locale, do mission, go to camp and progress dating simm, rinse and repeat.

I may also be spoiled by baldurs gate where the chat options could lead to anything from a new ally to being attacked, Life and death first hand, not the fapping about and dating simm chat options in the newer games.

So its Mass Effect for me, used Dragon Age to confirm.

I have to disagree. I think Mass Effect was their pinnacle. I think Bioware started going downhill when EA took over. To me, its painfully obvious, as the focus began to shift to buying outfits for your characters, etc. etc. and thats when the quality began to decline.

 

[shrekfan246]

I think they're still doing pretty good, regardless of the EA thumb they're under.

People seem to forget that the first 149/150 of Mass Effect 3 was still pretty dang good.

I like the people who refute that by going "NUH UH! I HATED ALL OF MASS EFFECT 3 BUT I PLAYED IT ANYWAY."

[sub]Hell, I never even disliked the endings, anyway.[/sub]

 

[AbstractStream]

This is one of those times where I want to defend Bioware and put all the blame on EA, but I rather not go there. Perhaps Bioware was already in decline when ME2 came out, but it took Dragon Age 2 for me to notice.

Let's just hope that EA/Bioware stops funneling all their energy into SW:TOR and aims it toward Dragon Age 3 or something.

 

[Siege_TF]

* When EA decided it wanted to see how much it could tighten the noose around Bioware's gonads.

What do you mean that's not an option?!

 

[dementis]

After they became part of EA. It didn't happen straight away, mass effect and Dragon Age: Origins were fantastic. Mass effect 2 was good, but everything else they've made after becoming part of EA just doesn't live up to Bioware's older work.

 

[Spearmaster]

I'm noticing a few things.

It seems like many believe that EA it purely to blame for most, if not all Bioware's problems.

Another is that there seems to be a huge difference in opinion between people who started playing around MA or DA:O and people like me who were big fans of baldurs gate.

There are also a few people that believe this poll is unwarranted, because Bioware has completely changed in the type of games its making from their beginning and that viewing it as a downhill move is just whining, but some see it as a dumbing down of their games which is clear pandering to gamers in other geners and the TPS and Hotkey hack and slash gameplay styles are nothing more than a cop-out when it comes to coming up with a gameplay style for these grand stories they write, all of which is just a quick cash in.

Honestly if I had to guess I would say anymore EA makes the game and Bioware just seems to be writing the story and dialog and does not really care as much as they used to, With the nice, mean, I don't care, dialog system as an example.

I would say that a lot of people do view it as "downhill" when a company decides to start alienating chunks of their fan base for a quicker lazier cash-in.

 

[Mike Richards]

They aren't making worse games, they're just making different games. You can't say ME3 is entirely worse or better then Baulder's Gate because they are far, far too different to compare on the same terms.

Maybe you like one style more, but that doesn't mean the other is instantly worse because it doesn't conform to your expectations of what Bioware "should" be making.