Poll: Would you be comfortable killing your country's military in a game?
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whoops didnt realize that hl2 was in eastern europe. you figure with the adminstrator from the black mesa facility being the main baddie that the story still took place in the US (not to mention all of the characters are from the US). My bad.Dalisclock said:
Dude, come on. The English have the best accent ever for villains. Be proud of that fact.Evonisia said:
In general, it doesn't really bother me any more than killing does in other games (which sometimes does get to me). What would bother me would be playing something that's more anti-*countryname* propaganda than actual game, regardless of what country serves as the bad guys.
It all depends on context, If you reversed the playable side in something like Recent Call of Duty games, then no. But like most people have mentioned with the right set up (GTA, Saints Row, Half Life, Spec Ops The Line) then there are reasons why they are the enemy, and its important to the story, or makes sense in the context of the game world.
Destroy All Humans series
Civil War Generals II
Axis and Allies
Saints Row series
Grand Theft Auto series
Civilization: Call To Power
Shattered Union
Panzer Elite
Games are games. If the npcs stand under the Stars and Stripes so what? Have I encountered a few where the reasons given for fighting any given group were disagreeable enough and taken so seriously that I decided to ignore them? Yep. But I won't begrudge anyone else playing them.
Civil War Generals II
Axis and Allies
Saints Row series
Grand Theft Auto series
Civilization: Call To Power
Shattered Union
Panzer Elite
Games are games. If the npcs stand under the Stars and Stripes so what? Have I encountered a few where the reasons given for fighting any given group were disagreeable enough and taken so seriously that I decided to ignore them? Yep. But I won't begrudge anyone else playing them.
Nope; not that one fights the Norwegian army very frequently in games... I can only remember it happening in the Wargame series -and in a mod for BF1942 where Norway fought Sweden. The pre-made voice messages in that game were so silly, half the team would run around spamming "Norsk jävlar" or "Svenske faen" depending on the side.
Often the scandinavian countries are lumped together, does that count? Do vikings count? In any case I don't really mind; nationality has yet to halt my digital murder spree! I often get second thoughts about killing someone for other reasons though. Certain games are good at making me feel bad for my enemies; often I'll go out of my way to avoid taking their digital lives if they get my feels on.
Often the scandinavian countries are lumped together, does that count? Do vikings count? In any case I don't really mind; nationality has yet to halt my digital murder spree! I often get second thoughts about killing someone for other reasons though. Certain games are good at making me feel bad for my enemies; often I'll go out of my way to avoid taking their digital lives if they get my feels on.
I don't really care who I have to kill in a game.
Soldiers, civilians, zombies, other human shaped models, models that don't look anything like humans at all... it's all the same.
Though I suppose shooting range targets are a bit boring.
Soldiers, civilians, zombies, other human shaped models, models that don't look anything like humans at all... it's all the same.
Though I suppose shooting range targets are a bit boring.
actually,there's one game that does it for canada, kind of. in Empire Total War, you have to play the british invading new France. it was not yet canada, but since i'm from Québec i can relate to that.MiriaJiyuu said:
superpower 2 was a pretty realist game where you can play any country, doing war to any country. of course i never played more than half an hour before i send a nuke somewhere witch trigger every nation with nuclear bomb to launch their bombs too... and i've tried a few time, but in the game it's next to impossible to invade the usa with canada...
and it doesnt bother me much to kill army from my country...
The first game that popped into my head where this happens is Spec Ops: The Line. You fight a large amount of american soldiers in that game, they even have a (fictional) battalion and designation. Without spoiling any more, this very issue is addressed by the characters in the game.
Ignoring opinions about the real life wars, I feel it would be insincere to assume that no nation's military is infallible, especially in a fictional scenario. Depending on whose side the game puts you on anyone can be made an enemy. The thing that interests me is that there are a seemingly endless supply of games where you are either an American or British soldier fighting other real world nations but basically none from the other side. Lots of modern shooters go for the America/Britain vs. Russia angle, with the excuse being that neither nation shares any meaningful similarities when it comes to politics (Never played war game where you meet with Obama before fighting Putin). Whats weird is why doesn't Russia do the opposite, make a game where you are a Russian soldier in a fictional time fighting a fictional evil United States or Britain? Maybe these sorts of games are made but never imported to the US but I know that many modern shooters where a fictional Russia is the bad guy are played in Russia. I find the lack of reciprocity weird. I know there are Russian game studios that can make good shooter games and given that military shooters do have some presence in Russia there is clearly a market for it.
I wonder if the US/British governments would do anything to prevent circulation of those games in their respective countries. Despite all the media coverage of unpatriotic video games I am unaware of any actual government statements on the matter from US or Britain. I know Germany has strict rules about representation of German history in games but no other "Western" nation has bothered as far as I know, aside from censoring content to 'save the children.'
Ignoring opinions about the real life wars, I feel it would be insincere to assume that no nation's military is infallible, especially in a fictional scenario. Depending on whose side the game puts you on anyone can be made an enemy. The thing that interests me is that there are a seemingly endless supply of games where you are either an American or British soldier fighting other real world nations but basically none from the other side. Lots of modern shooters go for the America/Britain vs. Russia angle, with the excuse being that neither nation shares any meaningful similarities when it comes to politics (Never played war game where you meet with Obama before fighting Putin). Whats weird is why doesn't Russia do the opposite, make a game where you are a Russian soldier in a fictional time fighting a fictional evil United States or Britain? Maybe these sorts of games are made but never imported to the US but I know that many modern shooters where a fictional Russia is the bad guy are played in Russia. I find the lack of reciprocity weird. I know there are Russian game studios that can make good shooter games and given that military shooters do have some presence in Russia there is clearly a market for it.
I wonder if the US/British governments would do anything to prevent circulation of those games in their respective countries. Despite all the media coverage of unpatriotic video games I am unaware of any actual government statements on the matter from US or Britain. I know Germany has strict rules about representation of German history in games but no other "Western" nation has bothered as far as I know, aside from censoring content to 'save the children.'
Only for the fact that my army is supposed to be 'neutral'. Then that would make me the villain! (Take a wild guess what nationality that is)
Jokes, actually I wouldn't care at all. They're just games, and the more different countries can be played as villains and the more different angles, perspectives and standpoints the better. I realize this can get into some pretty sensitive territory, playing "the other side" can draw a fine line in games as to being simply from another angle of a historical war, to being a modern-day terrorist simulator. But I think if it can leave bias out of it, and just present the motives as factually as possible, it could be quite the eye-opener.
Jokes, actually I wouldn't care at all. They're just games, and the more different countries can be played as villains and the more different angles, perspectives and standpoints the better. I realize this can get into some pretty sensitive territory, playing "the other side" can draw a fine line in games as to being simply from another angle of a historical war, to being a modern-day terrorist simulator. But I think if it can leave bias out of it, and just present the motives as factually as possible, it could be quite the eye-opener.
We've killed how many American Cops in the history of gaming? I fail to see how that would be any different.
Also I'd love a game that takes place in WWII but as an Axis Soldier. Not a Nazi persay, but just your average German Soldier.
Of course that would cause a shitstorm of gigantic proportion though. Sigh.
Also I'd love a game that takes place in WWII but as an Axis Soldier. Not a Nazi persay, but just your average German Soldier.
Of course that would cause a shitstorm of gigantic proportion though. Sigh.
Honestly, a game where we get to play as rebels fighting against a CIA installed government and US "Peace Troops" in South America would be excellent. The entire war on "Communism" could just as easily portray the US as the villains.AT God said:
The United States might do a lot of good, but that doesn't make all the horrible shit they did as well go away. Instead of fighting imaginary foes or the same old tired, how about we get something historical that isn't practically US propaganda? And no, I don't mean propaganda for the United States itself, but of the concept of it (Freedom, Democracy, etc). Yeah, about that...
Point being - It would be nice to see the US as villains for once. Because they most certainly have been.
In a game? No.
Hell no!
edit
whoops sorry. that sound backwards. I meant I have no problem with it)
Anyway, what's with the constant idolisation of the military?
How is it special?
Especially if you use GTA as an example...
A series in which you routinely kill tons of police officers, often many random innocent bistanders and civilians, and so on.
Out of all of that, why is it soldiers specifically I should feel bad about killing?
If anything, they have the job where being attacked, shot at and potentially killed is inherently the most likely, so why would that somehow be the worst thing ever to do in a game?
Then again I'v never understood this fetishistic idolisation of military forces. You're supposed to support them no matter what, treat them like heroes even if it's quite obvious they really aren't, and all kinds of other stuff or else you're a bad person? Why?
It's absurd to treat something with that degree of blind, unconditional respect, no matter what it is...
Hell no!
edit
whoops sorry. that sound backwards. I meant I have no problem with it)Anyway, what's with the constant idolisation of the military?
How is it special?
Especially if you use GTA as an example...
A series in which you routinely kill tons of police officers, often many random innocent bistanders and civilians, and so on.
Out of all of that, why is it soldiers specifically I should feel bad about killing?
If anything, they have the job where being attacked, shot at and potentially killed is inherently the most likely, so why would that somehow be the worst thing ever to do in a game?
Then again I'v never understood this fetishistic idolisation of military forces. You're supposed to support them no matter what, treat them like heroes even if it's quite obvious they really aren't, and all kinds of other stuff or else you're a bad person? Why?
It's absurd to treat something with that degree of blind, unconditional respect, no matter what it is...
i can literally find no reason for it to be a bad thing let alone a deal breaker. as someone that has done no military service, i am able to view the game as a game and not care for the relation to real life. that said, should the game have heavy elements of story and be quite impacting like The Last of Us then... yeah, no I'd be totally fine with it.
Just as Peach needs saving to justify a Mario game, if killing British soldiers is the means to a decent game then so be it.
If it's killing British soldiers for the sake of killing British soldiers however, I might wonder why.
Just as Peach needs saving to justify a Mario game, if killing British soldiers is the means to a decent game then so be it.
If it's killing British soldiers for the sake of killing British soldiers however, I might wonder why.
My country suffered three very murderous military dictatorships over the course of the last century; the last one alone costed the lives of 30,000 forcefully disappeared citizens and kickstarted a stupid war that cost the lives of hundreds of kids. My own dad got shot at in several different occasions and barely made it out where others didn't.
I would be delighted to kill my country's military. And I would do it in the slowest, cruelest possible way. Take the Hugo Stiglitz road.
I would be delighted to kill my country's military. And I would do it in the slowest, cruelest possible way. Take the Hugo Stiglitz road.
I share this sentiment.CrystalShadow said:In a game? No.
Hell no!
edit
Anyway, what's with the constant idolisation of the military?
How is it special?
Especially if you use GTA as an example...
A series in which you routinely kill tons of police officers, often many random innocent bistanders and civilians, and so on.
Out of all of that, why is it soldiers specifically I should feel bad about killing?
If anything, they have the job where being attacked, shot at and potentially killed is inherently the most likely, so why would that somehow be the worst thing ever to do in a game?
Then again I'v never understood this fetishistic idolisation of military forces. You're supposed to support them no matter what, treat them like heroes even if it's quite obvious they really aren't, and all kinds of other stuff or else you're a bad person? Why?
It's absurd to treat something with that degree of blind, unconditional respect, no matter what it is...
Morally speaking, a soldier is the least immoral to kill, simply by virtue of the entire purpose of a soldier being to kill other people - For good or bad reasons.
That said, I have great respect for the people that fight for good reasons. But they do so with the knowledge that they might die. It's the price you need to be willing to pay to wield the right to kill.
So yeah, speaking for real life - A soldier would be the one I would feel the least bad about killing. Likewise, if I were a soldier and got killed in combat, that's perfectly fair (Even though it sucks massively for me). Iffy about non-soldiers killing soldiers though. That tends to lead to reprisals that hurt innocents, which really is just bad news for everyone.