Poll: Would you not buy a game, if they gender swapped your hero?
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Bayonetta is a genderswapped Dante, yes. That was like the whole joke back then when she was new XD.
Also, since she wasn't the protag of DMC5 but of her own game, which in many ways surpasses dmc btw, nobody had any issue with her being that, as she wasn't seen as REPLACING the original char. We know who did replace him, and he got all the hate in the world, despite being male too.
It's almost as if gender doesn't matter and people just don't want their chars replaced for no reason or something!
Also, since she wasn't the protag of DMC5 but of her own game, which in many ways surpasses dmc btw, nobody had any issue with her being that, as she wasn't seen as REPLACING the original char. We know who did replace him, and he got all the hate in the world, despite being male too.
It's almost as if gender doesn't matter and people just don't want their chars replaced for no reason or something!
Depends.
If they were to reboot a series or make a spiritual sequel then I'd be fine with it. So for example if the new Mirror's Edge (a reboot) had made Faith a male I'd still have bought it. Y'know, assuming the gameplay and whatnot was still appealing.
However, if they were to have a sequel that continued the story of a previous game but have the hero switch genders without in-universe explanation then I'd be left scratching my head. Like if they were to make a Last of Us 2 and Joel is suddenly Joanna that'd be pretty bizarre. Still, if I liked the series enough and the new game looked appealing I reckon I'd still buy it. I'd grumble a bit, but I'd still end up coughing up the cash for more brutal, gritty Last of Us action.
If they were to have a hero switch genders mid series with an explanation, like have the new Deus Ex come out and the opening cutscene introduces Amanda Jensen who just got a sex change operation, well... actually, fuck it, I'd want to see that happen just so I could dance among the flames and falling ashes of the resulting firestorm and sup from the fount of sweet, fermented tears.
That'd be a right fucking hoot. Not that it'll happen any time soon.
If they were to reboot a series or make a spiritual sequel then I'd be fine with it. So for example if the new Mirror's Edge (a reboot) had made Faith a male I'd still have bought it. Y'know, assuming the gameplay and whatnot was still appealing.
However, if they were to have a sequel that continued the story of a previous game but have the hero switch genders without in-universe explanation then I'd be left scratching my head. Like if they were to make a Last of Us 2 and Joel is suddenly Joanna that'd be pretty bizarre. Still, if I liked the series enough and the new game looked appealing I reckon I'd still buy it. I'd grumble a bit, but I'd still end up coughing up the cash for more brutal, gritty Last of Us action.
If they were to have a hero switch genders mid series with an explanation, like have the new Deus Ex come out and the opening cutscene introduces Amanda Jensen who just got a sex change operation, well... actually, fuck it, I'd want to see that happen just so I could dance among the flames and falling ashes of the resulting firestorm and sup from the fount of sweet, fermented tears.
That'd be a right fucking hoot. Not that it'll happen any time soon.
If it's just to genderswap? I'd be pissed.
If it was say, Kojima making another Metal Gear and it was a genderbent Snake, that would be interesting as hell and would only reinforce my decision to buy it.
Diversity for the sake of checking off a list is stupid.
If it was say, Kojima making another Metal Gear and it was a genderbent Snake, that would be interesting as hell and would only reinforce my decision to buy it.
Diversity for the sake of checking off a list is stupid.
Maybe, depends on how they do it. Most of the time people don't just a genderswap someone. If you want to see just how sexist people are have them gender swap a character.
That and it would only make sense if it's not in the same continuity (or it's established they aren't really the same person like Link)
That and it would only make sense if it's not in the same continuity (or it's established they aren't really the same person like Link)
My sister and I rented Saints row 1, but, we ended up not liking it and finding out about Saints row 2 instead. So we switched them. Why? Because we could only play as a male and she wanted to make a female too, we didn't get far into the story either. Lol, we completely forgot about the first game since the second was so good. It was a better decision to take in that one scenario.
But not all games let you choose gender which is fine. Some stories are just told with males as the leads, or females as the leads. In my opinion a story where your main character could be anything, isn't a bad thing, but not much for story telling. The story in Zelda is, "Zelda's kidnapped again by Ganon, go kick his ass." Thats it. Link isn't a character in any of the games except for Wind Waker, where hes actually emotive, we feel anger when the giant bird flies by and kidnaps our little sister, we feel sad when we find our grandmother sick and depressed from missing her grandchildren Link reacts the same way. What sibling wouldn't want to rescue their brother/sister or save their beloved parental figure? Twilight princess is kind of close in the same way, since he cares and works to rescue the village children and his friends along the way.
If a story is written with a main character who is a character, instead of a blank slate for the player to place themselves in that roll, gender shouldn't be changed or even matter. But a game like skyrim, its designed for blank slates for us to shape how we like, thats where such options should be.
But not all games let you choose gender which is fine. Some stories are just told with males as the leads, or females as the leads. In my opinion a story where your main character could be anything, isn't a bad thing, but not much for story telling. The story in Zelda is, "Zelda's kidnapped again by Ganon, go kick his ass." Thats it. Link isn't a character in any of the games except for Wind Waker, where hes actually emotive, we feel anger when the giant bird flies by and kidnaps our little sister, we feel sad when we find our grandmother sick and depressed from missing her grandchildren Link reacts the same way. What sibling wouldn't want to rescue their brother/sister or save their beloved parental figure? Twilight princess is kind of close in the same way, since he cares and works to rescue the village children and his friends along the way.
If a story is written with a main character who is a character, instead of a blank slate for the player to place themselves in that roll, gender shouldn't be changed or even matter. But a game like skyrim, its designed for blank slates for us to shape how we like, thats where such options should be.
I don't understand what the point of these threads are its a game who cares if your male or female if it helps the narrative then fuck the gender
In this modern age, diversity, gender, and representation are all that matter now.Veldie said:
Welcome to this brave new era in gaming.
Depends on the game.
Female Link - "Yeah, I'm down to clown"
Female Kratos - "Man, I don't know."
Male Faith (Mirror's Edge) - "Hell yeah, hardcore parkour"
Male Shantea - "*confused squint*"
Ultimately, I'll say what a lot of people in the thread have probably already said (haven't read it, I'm kinda scared) in that the game's quality is what will get me to eventually buy it, but what draws me to it is who the characters are, why they are and their character design. Gender swapping can be really easy or really hard depending on how the character functions, and there's just some characters where you'd have to change a fair bit about them to make 'em work. Conventionally, anyway.
There's just some swaps I'd probably think are silly. It wouldn't completely deter me from buying it, but for me as a consumer, the first thing I eye up are the characters. If I do sometime in the future see a Nintendo game with a lady Mario on the cover, my first thought would probably be "lol" before walking to the next aisle to buy Uncharted 36: The Chartening ["They came for her charts. She gave them bullets"].
Female Link - "Yeah, I'm down to clown"
Female Kratos - "Man, I don't know."
Male Faith (Mirror's Edge) - "Hell yeah, hardcore parkour"
Male Shantea - "*confused squint*"
Ultimately, I'll say what a lot of people in the thread have probably already said (haven't read it, I'm kinda scared) in that the game's quality is what will get me to eventually buy it, but what draws me to it is who the characters are, why they are and their character design. Gender swapping can be really easy or really hard depending on how the character functions, and there's just some characters where you'd have to change a fair bit about them to make 'em work. Conventionally, anyway.
There's just some swaps I'd probably think are silly. It wouldn't completely deter me from buying it, but for me as a consumer, the first thing I eye up are the characters. If I do sometime in the future see a Nintendo game with a lady Mario on the cover, my first thought would probably be "lol" before walking to the next aisle to buy Uncharted 36: The Chartening ["They came for her charts. She gave them bullets"].
I mean if the game is still good I'll still buy it, i do find the practice irritating overall, but I'm not gonna let it ruin an otherwise good game for me. Also context matters a bit here, if it makes sense for the character to be gender-swapped, or there's a point beyond pandering, I'm more inclined to enjoy it.
To be honest though, a lot, perhaps even most, of characters' genders barely matter. Link is already androgynous as anything, a character that wears a bodysuit all the time like Doom guy or Samus you'd never even notice 99% of the time, and characters like kirby it seems bizarre to even attempt apply our mortal genders too.
Some games though it wouldn't make sense at all, especially in narrative-driven games where characterization is key. It would be pretty jarring for instance for them to have changed lee's gender in the walking dead between episodes, and the more you've developed the character, the less wiggle room there is i think.
To be honest though, a lot, perhaps even most, of characters' genders barely matter. Link is already androgynous as anything, a character that wears a bodysuit all the time like Doom guy or Samus you'd never even notice 99% of the time, and characters like kirby it seems bizarre to even attempt apply our mortal genders too.
Some games though it wouldn't make sense at all, especially in narrative-driven games where characterization is key. It would be pretty jarring for instance for them to have changed lee's gender in the walking dead between episodes, and the more you've developed the character, the less wiggle room there is i think.
I think if you want to gender swap a character you do it like with Uncharted, Nathan Drake is basically gender swapped Lara Croft, but he's his own character too.
I would rather see a new character with simmer traits and game play then just changing an existing character for the sake of adding more female game characters.
In short more female characters not change existing ones.
I would rather see a new character with simmer traits and game play then just changing an existing character for the sake of adding more female game characters.
In short more female characters not change existing ones.
It doesn't really matter. The gender of the protagonist is usually irrelevant.
What would really change if Link was female or Lara Croft was male? Nothing because their gender is at large irrelevant to the story or gameplay and it doesn't really say anything about our society anymore as well.
And this is true for the majority of video game protagonists.
Samus in the first Metroid worked because it was the 80ies. She was portrayed in a male gender role while her real sex was obscured by armour. The reveal therefore played with the gender role expectations of the audience which was mostly male.
But we are way past that.
Gender swap is a lame concept.
On one hand you can argue well if doesn't matter then why not do it and on the hand if it doesn't matter then why mess with it?
Ultimately I think established character should be left alone. New characters are the way to go for me.
Therefore, a gender swapped game will receive criticism from me for being unoriginal and I will be wary of it because it apparently felt the need to emphasis an utterly unimportant aspect.
In general I don't pick my games because of the genitals of the protagonist.
I had fun with Nathan Drake as much as with Lara Croft. What mostly matter is that the game is actually any good.
What would really change if Link was female or Lara Croft was male? Nothing because their gender is at large irrelevant to the story or gameplay and it doesn't really say anything about our society anymore as well.
And this is true for the majority of video game protagonists.
Samus in the first Metroid worked because it was the 80ies. She was portrayed in a male gender role while her real sex was obscured by armour. The reveal therefore played with the gender role expectations of the audience which was mostly male.
But we are way past that.
Gender swap is a lame concept.
On one hand you can argue well if doesn't matter then why not do it and on the hand if it doesn't matter then why mess with it?
Ultimately I think established character should be left alone. New characters are the way to go for me.
Therefore, a gender swapped game will receive criticism from me for being unoriginal and I will be wary of it because it apparently felt the need to emphasis an utterly unimportant aspect.
In general I don't pick my games because of the genitals of the protagonist.
I had fun with Nathan Drake as much as with Lara Croft. What mostly matter is that the game is actually any good.
Depends really. If we would be talking about a game like Zelda, were the main character is another person in every game any way, who's just another "chosen one", then I wouldn't really care about the gender-swap.
If, say, CDPR did a Witcher 4 game and turned the established Character of Geralt into a female, then no I wouldn't buy the game. Not because I don't want to play a female character, I would be totally on board with a game about Ciri for example, but rather because genderbending established character shows that the writers don't really have much respect for the materiel they are working with and I would not trust even CDPR to make a good story with an attitude like that.
This isn't just about genderbending, it's mostly in generell about writers disrespecting the materiel they work with. I don't like that. If you want to have a female character so bad, just make a new character or use one of the allready availible female characters. Don't change a character that's allready well established in a way that doesn't make sense.
In generell I don't really care about the gender/race or anything of the character I am playing as long as they are good characters. If it's a self-insert character that doesn't really have an unique personality I like to play as a male because that makes it easier for me to project myself into the character. If the character does have a strong personality then I will just roleplay that person, no matter if they are male/female white/black/asien or purple for all I care.
If, say, CDPR did a Witcher 4 game and turned the established Character of Geralt into a female, then no I wouldn't buy the game. Not because I don't want to play a female character, I would be totally on board with a game about Ciri for example, but rather because genderbending established character shows that the writers don't really have much respect for the materiel they are working with and I would not trust even CDPR to make a good story with an attitude like that.
This isn't just about genderbending, it's mostly in generell about writers disrespecting the materiel they work with. I don't like that. If you want to have a female character so bad, just make a new character or use one of the allready availible female characters. Don't change a character that's allready well established in a way that doesn't make sense.
In generell I don't really care about the gender/race or anything of the character I am playing as long as they are good characters. If it's a self-insert character that doesn't really have an unique personality I like to play as a male because that makes it easier for me to project myself into the character. If the character does have a strong personality then I will just roleplay that person, no matter if they are male/female white/black/asien or purple for all I care.
No, because in an established series it just would be shameless pandering and games that do that are usually shite. That's basically it.
Not the conversation we're having right now, but nice job missing the point.inu-kun said:
The quality of the game already in existence does not change if you play it as a male or female. Skyrim is a finished game. Not one single reviewer gave it 2 different scores based on which gender they decided to play as. Same goes for every game with both genders as an option.
Did Miyamoto go around actually slaying creatures and rescuing princesses and defeating giant hulking evil men? I'm not demanding a change, I'm asking for one good solid reason as to why Link could not be female. Just one. If any franchise was ever perfectly capable of flipping the characters gender it's this one. You could not ask for a more perfect set up.
I don't care about your gender war. I saw someone somewhere say "what if Link was a girl" and I thought "that might be fun, and I see no reason why it couldn't happen, I'm all for it".
Depends on the game, and the character, and how its executed.
Imagine you're playing Mass Effect though, you save the game, and come back the next day. You load your save, and your character is completely different, and gender swapped. You wouldn't be impressed.
Same goes for any pre-established characters. Don't gender swap. Its lazy, its stupid, and it throws continuity errors in everywhere.
Say you've got a complete non-character like Doom-Guy though. No, even Master Cheif isn't a complete non-character. He's got a plot to him - as does Link [Not necessarily a plot 100% there for either of them not to change gender, sure the laws of the Zelda universe and the pattern of reincarnation could suddenly change from what's been going on the last few thousand years, and Master Cheif could just get a sex change 'cause reasons, but plot wise they are canonically male, and some form of a continuation of the same character. Throw in a new character, or use an already existing one. Don't just gender swap for EZs]. Complete non-characters... Who gives a fuck.
Honestly, though, I don't want gender swapped characters in general. I want good, new female characters. I mean, I want more games like the old Rare classics today. I don't demand Call fo Duty turns into a Rare classic styled game, and I wouldn't buy it if it did 'cause that'd just be insulting and stupid to the people who love CoD. Likewise, I don't take changing characters that are already established all that well. Its lazy, stupid, and trying to pander to another audience at the expense of existing fans. Get a new character, and make them a female, and make them good. Its more respectful to everyone, and better for everyone.
Imagine you're playing Mass Effect though, you save the game, and come back the next day. You load your save, and your character is completely different, and gender swapped. You wouldn't be impressed.
Same goes for any pre-established characters. Don't gender swap. Its lazy, its stupid, and it throws continuity errors in everywhere.
Say you've got a complete non-character like Doom-Guy though. No, even Master Cheif isn't a complete non-character. He's got a plot to him - as does Link [Not necessarily a plot 100% there for either of them not to change gender, sure the laws of the Zelda universe and the pattern of reincarnation could suddenly change from what's been going on the last few thousand years, and Master Cheif could just get a sex change 'cause reasons, but plot wise they are canonically male, and some form of a continuation of the same character. Throw in a new character, or use an already existing one. Don't just gender swap for EZs]. Complete non-characters... Who gives a fuck.
Honestly, though, I don't want gender swapped characters in general. I want good, new female characters. I mean, I want more games like the old Rare classics today. I don't demand Call fo Duty turns into a Rare classic styled game, and I wouldn't buy it if it did 'cause that'd just be insulting and stupid to the people who love CoD. Likewise, I don't take changing characters that are already established all that well. Its lazy, stupid, and trying to pander to another audience at the expense of existing fans. Get a new character, and make them a female, and make them good. Its more respectful to everyone, and better for everyone.
You have my attention.WinterWyvern said:Now also picture him up striking outrageous sexy poses.
Go on.
*Shrug*
it's just a character model and a voice so whatever. I'd be tempted to ask as I do in all gender flip discussions though...why? What is it with this trend of taking established characters and gender flipping them? Can it be about empowerment of the gender flipped to? Is it an attempt to gain more audience for the character? Are they running out of ideas for the character? None of these are terribly convincing arguments to do it. The first could just as easily be done with a new character the second and third reasons are either laziness or desperation.
A lot of the time these days it looks like it's trying to profit off of the outrage machine of the internet. If so, bravo. Doesn't really do much for the medium though.
it's just a character model and a voice so whatever. I'd be tempted to ask as I do in all gender flip discussions though...why? What is it with this trend of taking established characters and gender flipping them? Can it be about empowerment of the gender flipped to? Is it an attempt to gain more audience for the character? Are they running out of ideas for the character? None of these are terribly convincing arguments to do it. The first could just as easily be done with a new character the second and third reasons are either laziness or desperation.
A lot of the time these days it looks like it's trying to profit off of the outrage machine of the internet. If so, bravo. Doesn't really do much for the medium though.