Poll: Your Spore stance

[ElArabDeMagnifico]

Wheres this option?

"I am not bitching, but rather enjoying something that was meant to entertain"

So if someone raped you - would you just go "oh whatever, it was supposed to feel good right?"

We're "bitching" because when you "*****" it sends the message that the DRM is bullshit - we're not renting the game we are buying it - so why does the game "kill itself" after 3 installs?

As for the DRM, yeah, it sucks, but what can be done about it?

Refuse to buy the game and let it tank in sales to drive home the message that people who spend their money on things don't enjoy being treated like effing criminals?

Off the top of my head, I cannot think of a single copy-protection scheme that has successfully managed to do anything besides annoy legitimate users.

 

[Epifols]

I voted

 

[meatloaf231]

Wheres this option?

"I am not bitching, but rather enjoying something that was meant to entertain"

So if someone raped you - would you just go "oh whatever, it was supposed to feel good right?"

We're "bitching" because when you "*****" it sends the message that the DRM is bullshit - we're not renting the game we are buying it - so why does the game "kill itself" after 3 installs?

Theres a difference between criticism and blatant one sided extreme denouncement.

What is comes down to is this, the only difference between you enjoying the game and you being pissed off at the company and not enjoying it is in your head. For the most part. If people want to like the game, they will. If they want to sit here and ***** (sorry for the vocab, writing out "blatant one sided extreme denouncement" is longer, ) thats what they will do.

Yes anti pirating software can be a real pain in the ass, I know that very well. But we can't just bash every game that has it. Thats counterproductive and will not do anything.

We can totally bash every game that has it. When people point their hate-rays at something for long enough, other people start noticing. If people don't protest DRM in every game, then it will seem like we are just looking for an excuse to hate a game we didn't like.

 

[Xalmar]

I'm indifferent to the game itself, I wasn't interested when it was being hyped and I'm still not interested now that it's out.

The DRM, on the other hand, is something I have an issue with. I'm really hoping that other game companies won't start to take EA's example on this one. If they do at least I can justify switching to console gaming full-time.

 

[DeadlyFred]

Yes anti pirating software can be a real pain in the ass, I know that very well. But we can't just bash every game that has it. Thats counterproductive and will not do anything.

Is it really? See no, that's the glory of free market economy. If you don't buy it, they don't make a sale, ergo they make no money, ergo they fail. There is nothing wrong with basic copy protection measures but in the end, those do just as little good as some elaborate crap like "3 installs, you're out!" -- someone, somewhere WILL hack it eventually. Then what good is it doing? None at all.

The only way products which are crap can be viable on the market is if people buy them. If enough people say "No, sorry, I'm just not buying this." Believe me, no only will that seller take the hint, others probably will as well.

Selling people software which expires, under the pretense that they very well intend to distribute it illegally, is not only a slight to the character of the person buying it, it is utterly unacceptable.

If you're happy eating that kind of crap then feel free to lay down and accept it, I will not.

 

[Epifols]

If you're happy eating that kind of crap then feel free to lay down and accept it, I will not.

I don't see any real implications of this. I highly doubt I will need to install this game a 4th time, so whats the point of my getting all enraged about the fact that I can't? And if I do, then I will worry about it at that time or just call up tech support.

Full rebellion is just as simple minded as full conformity.

 

[ElArabDeMagnifico]

Yeah, even if I get a game that has DRM, I have to crack the DRM...

Escapist's "Shamus Young" has cited 5 effective ways to fight piracy. [http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=1558]

Making Legit users buy the game multiple times doesn't fight piracy, it just pisses everyone off. Instead, you do what is in the URL.

Though the only companies I know that do all 5 is Valve and Stardock (and a few other companies that don't come to mind right now) who both have "launcher software" (but no DRM) so maybe Valve's Steam and Stardock's "Impulse" has a big effect on it.

 

[meatloaf231]

If you're happy eating that kind of crap then feel free to lay down and accept it, I will not.

I don't see any real implications of this. I highly doubt I will need to install this game a 4th time, so whats the point of my getting all enraged about the fact that I can't? And if I do, then I will worry about it at that time or just call up tech support.

Full rebellion is just as simple minded as full conformity.

It's not just the 3 install thing. It's the system eating legalized spyware that comes with the game. The problem people have is that they are treating their actual customers in a way that says "You are a pirate and we don't trust you." It doesn't even slow down the pirating.

Not only that, but this DRM is the first step towards a gloomy future of PC gaming and the like. Too much control over what you can do with the product that you just bought.

 

[SimuLord]

The fact that the game's really not that good is what kept me from buying, not the DRM, although if the game was good, I'd have pirated it.

The thing about SecuROM is that it's only as evil as how the developer uses it. I bought M2TW Kingdoms, installed it, and haven't had a word of complaint because Sega didn't go hog-wild with SecuROM's "features".

 

[ElArabDeMagnifico]

If you're happy eating that kind of crap then feel free to lay down and accept it, I will not.

I don't see any real implications of this. I highly doubt I will need to install this game a 4th time, so whats the point of my getting all enraged about the fact that I can't? And if I do, then I will worry about it at that time or just call up tech support.

Full rebellion is just as simple minded as full conformity.

A lot of people say this without realizing that they'll end up doing it more than they say they will. If you install a game on a computer thinking it's going to work, and then, worst case scenario, it doesn't - then you've wasted an install, and online activation is a pain in the ass because you have to always go online and activate a code, redeem a code after installing - etc.

Ever called EA's tech support?

It's not as easy as just calling them and saying "hey one more install please! My hard drive messed up!" - it's as easy and comfortable as getting a colonoscopy - so just say "to hell with it" and crack the game if you've gotta buy a game with DRM.

There are plenty of reasons why someone would have to install the game more than even 10 times, such as buying new computers, putting on an external drive, or you know...just having to uninstall the game due to space issues - etc.

The real intention of DRM is to stop people from being able to buy second hand, or lend to friends - piracy is the scapegoat. Sony was planning on putting DRM on consoles (mainly the PS3 of course, but other companies liked the idea) but give you the ability to install the game, the community lashed out and they trashed the idea. People know that games don't have as much lasting appeal as they want, and a lot get shelved after the first playthrough, so DRM could stop people from lending to their friends.

(by the way, have you ever taken a history class? An economics class maybe? Rebellion isn't as simple minded as you make it sound.)

The excuse given is that they need to combat piracy, but since pirates didn't buy the game in the first place, it's kind of hard to see how you could sell them a second copy. Apparently the EA solution to piracy is to make honest users buy it twice? It's a proposal so audacious that you sort of have to admire their ability to make it with a straight face.

From here - comes witha comic! Check the newest one as it also relates to DRM. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/comics/stolen-pixels/5137-Stolen-Pixels-12-The-Economics-Lesson]

 

[Epifols]

It's not just the 3 install thing. It's the system eating legalized spyware that comes with the game. The problem people have is that they are treating their actual customers in a way that says "You are a pirate and we don't trust you." It doesn't even slow down the pirating.

Not only that, but this DRM is the first step towards a gloomy future of PC gaming and the like. Too much control over what you can do with the product that you just bought.

Valid enough points, but I think there should be a differentiation between "Spore is a bad game" and "Spore is a bad way to deal with piracy"

 

[Epifols]

(by the way, have you ever taken a history class? An economics class maybe? Rebellion isn't as simple minded as you make it sound.)

Yes I've taken those. I think rebellion is one of the most simple minded things that can be done politically. Because it's simple minded on two sides. First off the the side of the oppressor, and then of the rebels. The people with the upper hand cannot realize that unless they change their ways they will be overthrown. Like brainless drones they try to resist the call for change. Instead of giving an honest compromise, they would rather loose it all. And then the side of the rebel. History has shown that the rebels themselves are not better than the ones they rebelled. After Castro overthrew the government, what did he become? He became what he destroyed. Fransisco Madero, same thing.

I advocate a more balanced approach. Don't burn down the old systems, but don't follow blindly either.

Which is saying, DRM sucks but you can still like Spore.

 

[crazy-j]

i think it looks amazing personally, i still have 2 get it though

 

[Boober the Pig]

EA is the poster boy for evil corporations in video games, although that should be Majesco for Black 9 and Psychonauts. Anyway Valve has a somewhat draconian DRM system as part of Steam and no one seems to rage against Valve. Do we hate DRM or do we hate EA?

 

[ElArabDeMagnifico]

(by the way, have you ever taken a history class? An economics class maybe? Rebellion isn't as simple minded as you make it sound.)

Yes I've taken those. I think rebellion is one of the most simple minded things that can be done politically. Because it's simple minded on two sides. First off the the side of the oppressor, and then of the rebels. The people with the upper hand cannot realize that unless they change their ways they will be overthrown. Like brainless drones they try to resist the call for change. Instead of giving an honest compromise, they would rather loose it all. And then the side of the rebel. History has shown that the rebels themselves are not better than the ones they rebelled. After Castro overthrew the government, what did he become? He became what he destroyed. Fransisco Madero, same thing.

I advocate a more balanced approach. Don't burn down the old systems, but don't follow blindly either.

Which is saying, DRM sucks but you can still like Spore.

Fair enough, since I forgot you said "Full" rebellion, though I still think it's a little too broad to say that it's always simple minded.

Anyway, has anyone here been saying Spore is a bad game because of the DRM? Aren't they just implying not to get spore because of it's DRM?

People are irrational, but they aren't also well spoken so I'd imagine just not to take everyone and everything literally.

A lot of people will acknowledge a game is good, but eventually if it's buggy and almost unplayable, most people will just say "Mass Effect sucks - it runs like crap on the 360, don't get it."

Clearly their gripe isn't with the game, but the performance.

 

[Saskwach]

Was never interested in Spore anyway, where's that option?

Oops, sorry.

 

[Grassfire]

Anyway Valve has a somewhat draconian DRM system as part of Steam and no one seems to rage against Valve. Do we hate DRM or do we hate EA?

There are a few major differences between Valve's DRM and the SecureROM DRM EA is using:
- Valve ties a game to an account, the account can be used on an infinate number of computers.
- Valve games run quite happily in 'offline' mode. (this was a problem early in the lifecycle of Steam, but has been fixed from about 2006 onwards)
- Valve does not secretly send data "home" (they do send data back, but they're open about exactly what it is they're collecting (and from memory you can opt-out?).
- Software using Valve DRM works!

 

[maxusy3k]

- Software using Valve DRM works!

My copy of Spore runs fine thanks.

 

[meatloaf231]

- Software using Valve DRM works!

My copy of Spore runs fine thanks.

I think he means it's better at preventing piracy.

 

[DeadlyFred]

If you're happy eating that kind of crap then feel free to lay down and accept it, I will not.

I don't see any real implications of this. I highly doubt I will need to install this game a 4th time, so whats the point of my getting all enraged about the fact that I can't? And if I do, then I will worry about it at that time or just call up tech support.

Full rebellion is just as simple minded as full conformity.

Its not full rebellion nor is it simple minded; it is a simple solution. I don't agree with their business practices, thus I am not buying their product. I feel others should consider the fact before they buy the product. It may not be a huge issue in literal reality (though I know I have quite a few games which have seen more than 3 installs), its the principle of the matter.

Legitimate, legal users of anything do not deserve to be subjected to invasive safeguards which will almost inevitably be undone by the people they are aimed against in the first place. If this sort of thing actually worked, it would be one matter but it doesn't. I do not know of many (or any, really) software copy protection schemes which have not been circumvented successfully to allow that product to be distributed over the internet for free.