Potentially beneficial results from the xbone going down in flames.
- Thread starter siomasm
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Honestly I think if there is one good thing that could come from this its the message it would send:
"Dear AAA gaming industry,
we, the gamers, are done getting screwed over. You can no longer cram as much bullshit, thats bad and inconvinient for us and good and convenient for you, as you want in your products. We will just stop buying them, even big name things like the XBox.
Additionally its time to realise that there are a few consumer demographics your marketing teams just made up, for example the guys that will buy the Xbox1 mainly because it lets you use your TV with its voice command and gameing as an afterthought.
Love, the gaming communtity"
"Dear AAA gaming industry,
we, the gamers, are done getting screwed over. You can no longer cram as much bullshit, thats bad and inconvinient for us and good and convenient for you, as you want in your products. We will just stop buying them, even big name things like the XBox.
Additionally its time to realise that there are a few consumer demographics your marketing teams just made up, for example the guys that will buy the Xbox1 mainly because it lets you use your TV with its voice command and gameing as an afterthought.
Love, the gaming communtity"
Tell that to the Android games that have 200+million downloads and 90+ million active players.Terminate421 said:VanQ said:
I don't think you really get it. We NEED consoles to INTRODUCE people to gaming on PC. Dear god.
And insulting me does not help your argument.
Financially, no, consoles are not important, what I meant was on a social aspect. I have worked at a goddamn Fry's store, I know people buy PC games and for gaming. I know this. But not as many as you think, PC's for gaming do not sell nearly as much as consoles, whether you like it or not.
It's not even about sales, more about knowledge. There is a huge percentage of people who think all games are made for consoles only.
This is simple social science.
I don't care what steam's or origin's numbers are: Consoles. Are. Important. To. The. Industry. For. Getting. More. People. Into. It.
Tell that to the 70 million copies of Diablo that were sold.
Tell that to the 130 million copies of star craft 2 that have been sold.
Tell that to the MMORPGs that boast profits that Microsoft and Sony can't even dream about collecting, along with their 2+ billion players worldwide.
Not to mention the fact that there are more Android and iOS phones (of either OS) than all of every generation console combined.
Consoles aren't needed to bring eooke into video games, and you can not base that kind of assumption on the fact that you see fewer people buying PC games from stores, especially considering that something like 97% of PC games aren't sold in physical stores with physical copies being available.
This is simple supply and demand combined with social science combined with availability with some cost concerns thrown in.
Let me ask you thus. If you already have. $200-400 phones that boasts equal processing power to these new 400-500$ consoles, and start comparing the prices of games (free to $20 compared to the $60+ for consoles) along side the ability to play those games ANYWHERE you damn well please instead of only in 1 location... which ones is drawing in more people to play games ¿
I know for a fact that there are people who do not own, or have never owned a console, who regularly okay games on their phones and PCs.
Consoles are a thing if the past, and its about time that people come to grips with it. And they seriously and definitely are NOT a requirement to bring in more gamers.
This one.Akalabeth said:
Go check Amazon. The Top 100 Games.
The XBox One is currently number two. However, the PS4 had to be broken up into two different versions. The Launch edition and the standard edition. The Launch edition will be at your home on launch day. The standard will be as close to launch day as they can get it. Both were in the Top 10. And Launch Edition seems to be sold out now, causing it to drop to #12. In the Top 10 there are currently 4 different PS4 items. 3 of them are bundles. There's a sixth PS4 bundle in the Top 50. There are no other Xbox One preorders in the entire Top 100. And that includes some older games like Tomb Raider (PS3 version at #43) and Borderlands 2 (360 version at #99).
Further proof? PS4 Destiny sits at #16. Xbox One version at #77. I think that says a lot.
Amazon even took a poll asking which one people preferred. It was taken down with a 94% to 95% preference for the PS4.
http://www.latintimes.com/articles/5349/20130618/ps4-vs-xbox-one-amazon-poll-taken.htm
http://gengame.net/2013/06/amazon-prematurely-ends-ps4-vs-xbox-one-poll-when-ps4-takes-95-of-the-vote/
http://www.psu.com/a019884/PS4-vs-Xbox-One--Amazon-ends-poll-due-to-overwhelming-Sony-victory
Just talk to people. You'll find overwhelming support for PS4. When I preordered my console, the salesperson was actively advising against Xbox One, and from what I hear, the preorders are not good on all accounts.
And Sony has even stated that the demand may outstrip the supply.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/125091-Sony-Increasing-PS4-Sales-Projections-After-E3
Haven't heard anything from Microsoft...
So, taking all that into account, yes, I don't think things look good for the Xbox One.
Other current and future console developers realize that focusing on profits at the expense of the consumer results in less profits than if you were to focus on providing consumers a satisfying product. While I'm in crazy-land, I also want a Unicorn, a never-ending White Russian glass and Scooby Doo as a friend.
It might sound petty and vindicative, forgive me, but I would LOVE to go back to a dual console manufacturer situation. Similar to the ps1+64/ps2+gamecube era, back when microsoft was either nonexistant or just irrelevant.
Because nevertheless, both parties (sony and nintendo) had a really good thing going, sharing the market pretty evenly (I know sony technically held more at the time, but I remember that from my younger self perspective, it didnt' make much of a difference as both consoles, at least in the ps1 era, had worthwhile titles out the arse). I mostly remember just the amount of AMAZING games that we were getting, simply because not only did it cost less at the time but devs were less pressured to make specific genre titles, since the consoles covered basically every taste and people were fine with that.
Also, before calling me out as a nintendo fan, i'm rather on the sony side at the moment.
I hate what the 360 did to the console landscape, and ultimately the gaming landscape in general. It didn't bring anything new, it just burst in the market, bought a shitload of studios previously working with ninty/sony, started shelling out the same stuff and narrow the market to some mushy blurry mess where everything looked the same, forcing sony to adapt to the situation by doing the same and forcing ninty to go into full reclusion mode
Because nevertheless, both parties (sony and nintendo) had a really good thing going, sharing the market pretty evenly (I know sony technically held more at the time, but I remember that from my younger self perspective, it didnt' make much of a difference as both consoles, at least in the ps1 era, had worthwhile titles out the arse). I mostly remember just the amount of AMAZING games that we were getting, simply because not only did it cost less at the time but devs were less pressured to make specific genre titles, since the consoles covered basically every taste and people were fine with that.
Also, before calling me out as a nintendo fan, i'm rather on the sony side at the moment.
I hate what the 360 did to the console landscape, and ultimately the gaming landscape in general. It didn't bring anything new, it just burst in the market, bought a shitload of studios previously working with ninty/sony, started shelling out the same stuff and narrow the market to some mushy blurry mess where everything looked the same, forcing sony to adapt to the situation by doing the same and forcing ninty to go into full reclusion mode
Ahahahahhahahahahahahhhahahahahahahhahaa
Oh my god, you're serious
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The ignorance hurts so bad.
Answer: No. They did not start "on the pc". Quite the opposite. My gosh.
I actually doubt that the Xbox will turn a profit. Yes, the laymen doesn't really know or care about much more than "OMgawd foosball 2013 and Call of doody!" but it's still stirring up too much controversy to be ignored, despite the cringe worthy attempts at making it appear accepted by the community at large.Busard said:
While the number of gamers participating on forums, watching E3 or actually paying attention to much of anything outside of commercials is likely a relative minority, it's still probably a good chunk of potential customers they've driven off, and will likewise advise their friends against it.
In the long run, unless drastic changes are made, I could see them having some serious issues but likely surviving if only as a mere shadow of what Xbox was in its hayday.
i think a great result would be it not selling even moderately well, a firmware update gets rid of all the anti consumer nonsence, then MS can get back in the game (competion is good for gaming)
Can I get a gaming PC, that will be current for the next 6 years, for under £300?
No. No I can't.
No. No I can't.
Well, what sort of ports are you talking about anyway? Titanfall is the ( in my opinion ) the shiniest gem in the offering of the Xbone, but its coming out for PC too anywaysiomasm said:
RYZE SAN AHF ROME is definitely Xbone exclusive, it seems pretty interesting ( kinda like total war rome in third person ). But other than that, the rest of the Xbone exclusives are more or less pretty lack-luster.
Below is an indie game and is probably under the Xbone equivalent of xbawkz live arcade.
Sunset Overdrive seems astonishingly generic
Quantum Break , eh, its not really my thing to be honest and I haven't seen any concrete gameplay yet
Another Halo game, excuse me while I soil my trousers in excitement at this creatively thought out game idea.
I'm not seeing any particularly good exclusives in the future either. Cyberpunk 2077 is one too watch but its not exclusive either.
A lot of the best exclusive franchises have either been wrapped up ( Gears of war ) or crashed and burned horribly ( The fable series? I'm not very sure, the reviews seemed ok but I don't think it sold that well, feel free to correct me ) Some of the best franchises ( Borderlands 2 ,Dragon Age, Dead Space to an extent and the Fallout series ) are not exclusives. I'm not really seeing your concern here.
I think you are confused about who is the worst type of gamer ever, a mirror will help you find one.Terminate421 said:
It's OK to lash out and be scared friend, your world is crumbling around you. Microsoft is floundering, about to bury itself, turning on the developers now won't help them, Sony had to do nothing to get applause, really? A sad state indeed. Don't worry though, take my hand I have been through a crash before, it's not so bad. Trust me I was still playing games in 1984, just not on a console.
You find a way to help the terminally ill patient that is the AAA gaming industry. More power to you, buy yet another Halo, Gears of War and Call of Duty, that will show them the kinds of games you want, help Microsoft destroy creativity and end the indie developer. Then when drivel is all there is left to play in the console world and it is a barren wasteland of generic samey bland (isn't it this already?)you can have no one left but yourself to blame.
I haven't, but keep in mind this is my limited experience. I'm not the heaviest of PC gamers. Up until this generation, I have heavily favoured consoles for their simplicity and the fact that I hate K+M combos for many games. My PC library has been growing, though. Other than game updates, which are now a factor of console gaming, I haven't had much in the way of issues. I'm not saying my experience is all-encompassing, however. Just saying they've streamlined it a lot.rob_simple said:
Pffft. PS4 has facebook connectivity. I defy you to do THAT on a PC!Abomination said:
>.>
But seriously, I remember having to do all that back in the day. I'ma have nightmares tonight.
Hi there!Terminate421 said:
The main flaw with your "bridge" analogy is that most everyone already has a PC with a growing backlog of things they can play on it...
Terminate421 said:
BOTH of you are the worst kind of gamer: Patronizing and passive-aggressive snarkers who cannot see anything in moderates, only extremes.Strelok said:
Implying all he plays is "Shit indie game
Have the utter gall to say that AAA is going to "Destroy creativity and end the indie developer"?
Grow up, get a sense of perspective, and try again.
Well I started out on PC when I was a kid. I don't know how many other people began like that but I think it's a considerable amount, really. I don't care much for consoles either. You can do whatever you want with them, but I'm sticking to what I know.Terminate421 said:Strelok said:
Consoles aren't doing their best. We get it. But the world you're talking about is literally a canyon of gaming. PC and Mobile only would be more harmful to this industry than anything I could imagine. Consoles are needed, whether one likes it or not, they are the bridge which holds everything together.
How do we introduce people into this industry? Consoles. I have never met an individual who went form owning an ipad or DS and then immediately jumping ship onto the PC crowd. Consoles are what bring people to PC gaming in the first place.
PC is VERY helpful and is VERY good, I know, I have one, I use it all the time for games. But even I know that consoles are needed. And it stays at an "if" because people aren't exactly buying consoles right now so they can move onto the PS4 or Xbone if they were kicked in the head by a horse.
With the two AAA consoles already moving to X86 architecture, I think we've moved into a new golden age of legitimate ports between all three systems. By standardizing those things you'll see the porting costs in development cycles be drastically reduced. Perhaps to the point where it'd make no sense not to port to pc, XBO, or PS4, regardless of the relative success of the machine in question.
That being said, consumer data on pc gamers isn't doing all that well. I mean, Steam has significantly helped reduce outright theft by actually providing a legitimate platform for the pc. So had the consoles not been x86 then we may not have been looking at getting better ports to the pc if one did better. Thankfully that's not the case.
The advantage we have in Microsoft failing is to scare the living hell out of companies who may even try to repeat these actions. Even ones who probably would actually succeed may be scared by this.
The best case scenario here is that Microsoft learns from this mistake and then still does well this generation but Sony sees significant market share advantages for having sided with consumers. Looking at the Amazon numbers, all five versions of the PS4 are pacing alongside the one version of the XBO. I wouldn't want MS blown out of the water. They're a fantastic company if they just remember that customers' wants don't always align with their vision and that the customer is always right slogan does apply when there are ready alternatives.
That being said, consumer data on pc gamers isn't doing all that well. I mean, Steam has significantly helped reduce outright theft by actually providing a legitimate platform for the pc. So had the consoles not been x86 then we may not have been looking at getting better ports to the pc if one did better. Thankfully that's not the case.
The advantage we have in Microsoft failing is to scare the living hell out of companies who may even try to repeat these actions. Even ones who probably would actually succeed may be scared by this.
The best case scenario here is that Microsoft learns from this mistake and then still does well this generation but Sony sees significant market share advantages for having sided with consumers. Looking at the Amazon numbers, all five versions of the PS4 are pacing alongside the one version of the XBO. I wouldn't want MS blown out of the water. They're a fantastic company if they just remember that customers' wants don't always align with their vision and that the customer is always right slogan does apply when there are ready alternatives.
True, that would be a stretch, but you could take all the money you save on those $60 AAA titles during things like the Steam summer sale and your yearly multiplayer subscription fee's, and use those savings to build a very nice PC.Andy Farren said:
As far as this goes, as much as I oppose the Xbone 180 with all that microsoft has done, it would be very bad not just for the industry, but for the gamers if it outright died. Lots of people like to say "There are lots of options though, get a PS4" but just because its an option for you, doesn't mean its an option for them.
I'll clarify my position right now by stating I have an excellent Gaming PC (ALL HAIL THE GLORIOUS PC MASTER RACE), I've had an Xbox 360 since launch day of the console (The nicest feeling controller I've ever handled, hands down) And a PlayStation 3 for the last year (Soo many awesome exclusives. Don't even start me on the last of us) so I've been around most of the hardware. Not mobile devices though, I'm too spoiled on most modern games to derive a lot of amusement from handhelds.
So far as I see it, the PC is still the "Hardcore" Gaming machine. These things take time, money, and usually a good bit of tech knowledge to keep running at their peak, and reward you with the best graphics and more flexibility. But they are fickle beasts, and prone to failure if you don't know how to maintain them. I might find it incredibly natural to dig through my games files and alter the config before launching it to fix a render issue that's keeping me from seeing stuff right (I'll admit that's only even been a problem in indie titles though) but a less skilled PC user would just call that a write off and get frustrated trying to fix it. Does that make PC gamers better than others though? God no. PC gamers are good at PC gaming. You give me a PSP and throw me into a title and I'm flopping about like a mad idiot because I have no clue what I'm doing and its weird for me to have my screen between my controls, its throwing me off (Personal experience here XD) and I'll usually rage and blame it on "Awkward control schemes" Yet the person who owns the console never struggles with any of it, its just natural to them. Apples and Oranges here
The Consoles are the low maintenance version of gaming. Not necessarily "casual" as titles like dark souls can attest too, but they give you the assurances of "You put a game in, you play it". I say low maintenance because they are all now asking for account registrations and subscription fee's, but that's not a major hurdle for anybody. Most people are used to the idea of paying for a service and registering information with it. With my consoles, I can buy whatever Dudebro shooter mess there is on the market right now, and go online with my friends, and know that we can all play it together. And that is comforting. Consoles are consistant with there behavior. If I need an update to play Broshooter: Reloaded then the console just says so and starts downloading it.
But when we start to rip pieces out of this balance, some might think "Well then those gamers will just come and bask in the joy of (Insert preference here)!" And some will, that is true, but its the people who don't have that option that would be left in the dark. Maybe their hands are too big for mobile gaming, maybe they find the PlayStation controller incredibly awkward and can't get over that hurdle (Yes, third party controllers, but lots of people don't even know those exist, to be honest) and will end up just deciding that gaming isn't worth the hassle, no matter how much they enjoy it.
Gaming is a recreational activity. That is what its always been, and that is what it will always be. And when we start removing peoples preferred way to enjoy such a hobby, some will just walk away. And that will hurt the industry much, much more than the console itself collapsing. Ecosystems can rearrange and bring in new challengers and competitions. But if the consumer itself is forced away, then there is no market yearning for something new. And then the stagnation sets in.
Just because you think your solution is the best of the solutions, doesn't mean its the best for somebody else. Food for thought.