Psst he is in the friend zone

[zelda2fanboy]

Well maybe it just seems that way since you love acting as if you are throwing overweight people a bone by being interested in them. Yes, some overweight people like to play the victim in the exact same way some skinny people like to play the victim.

So you've gone from "this girl pulled away when I told her she was beautiful" to "this girl believes she is sexy and posts racy photos of herself on Facebook". Sorry, but I am going to have to call lying here.

What is unacceptable though is suggesting people should lower their standards and give those overweight people pity sex.

Hey, people are complex and those suggestive photos came long after we had been done dating. When did I suggest anything about pity sex? Or sex at all? Ever? This conversation is really really tiring. Here's how the original exchange went down.

Random Dude: I'm ugly and girls only like handsome guys.
Me (and what I intended to say): Maybe, but the majority of people in this world aren't what you might currently consider to be attractive. Give them a shot because you might, like me, discover that your perceived standards were initially inaccurate. Attractive people don't have to date only attractive people.

Egads. I guess I feel the need to share even more personal details of my life to a cruel stranger who only reads what he wants to read. Based off of a band I like and some shirtless photos of me on the internet, this girl contacted me first when I was too dumb to message her. Then after about three AIM conversations and a movie, she crosses over the couch to me and kisses me and I'm so stunned to react that it takes about 10 seconds for me to realize OMG A GIRL IS KISSING ME FOR THE FIRST TIME. Over the course of the next three hours, I had to figure out how the actual mechanics of making out work, while she kindly provided helpful tips during smoke breaks. It was her who had to take my hand and put it on her breast because I didn't even think to do that. Then it was her who took my hand and stuck it under her bra. And it was her who said "you want to see them?" Tell me again how that is a skinny person throwing her a bone and how I used her.

 

[MasochisticAvenger]

Well maybe it just seems that way since you love acting as if you are throwing overweight people a bone by being interested in them. Yes, some overweight people like to play the victim in the exact same way some skinny people like to play the victim.

So you've gone from "this girl pulled away when I told her she was beautiful" to "this girl believes she is sexy and posts racy photos of herself on Facebook". Sorry, but I am going to have to call lying here.

What is unacceptable though is suggesting people should lower their standards and give those overweight people pity sex.

Hey, people are complex and those suggestive photos came long after we had been done dating. When did I suggest anything about pity sex? Or sex at all? Ever? This conversation is really really tiring. Here's how the original exchange went down.

Random Dude: I'm ugly and girls only like handsome guys.
Me (and what I intended to say): Maybe, but the majority of people in this world aren't what you might currently consider to be attractive. Give them a shot because you might, like me, discover that your perceived standards were initially inaccurate. Attractive people don't have to date only attractive people.

Egads. I guess I feel the need to share even more personal details of my life to a cruel stranger who only reads what he wants to read. Based off of a band I like and some shirtless photos of me on the internet, this girl contacted me first when I was too dumb to message her. Then after about three AIM conversations and a movie, she crosses over the couch to me and kisses me and I'm so stunned to react that it takes about 10 seconds for me to realize OMG A GIRL IS KISSING ME FOR THE FIRST TIME. Over the course of the next three hours, I had to figure out how the actual mechanics of making out work, while she kindly provided helpful tips during smoke breaks. It was her who had to take my hand and put it on her breast because I didn't even think to do that. Then it was her who took my hand and stuck it under her bra. And it was her who said "you want to see them?" Tell me again how that is a skinny person throwing her a bone and how I used her.

Well you let her make out with you, and then you went on to brag about it to a bunch of random people on the internet. You've used her quite extensively in this thread in an attempt to try and make yourself look good.

Also, pro-tip, attractiveness is subjective. A lot of guys will say they're attracted to blondes, but honestly they don't really do it for me. Some people are attracted to overweight people, and there is nothing wrong with that. What I have a problem with is you acting like someone who is overweight cannot get a date unless someone lowers their standards.

 

[Sebass]

Me thinks there's some projection going on up in this thread.

 

[zelda2fanboy]

Well you let her make out with you, and then you went on to brag about it to a bunch of random people on the internet. You've used her quite extensively in this thread in an attempt to try and make yourself look good.

Also, pro-tip, attractiveness is subjective. A lot of guys will say they're attracted to blondes, but honestly they don't really do it for me. Some people are attracted to overweight people, and there is nothing wrong with that. What I have a problem with is you acting like someone who is overweight cannot get a date unless someone lowers their standards.

Whoa now. I "let her make out with me?" I was so not used to physical affection that when we started I was shaking. And I was "bragging?" Yeah, getting to make out with a girl once before being ignored by her forever is really worth boasting about to "the guys" who honestly probably wouldn't be interested in her at all. Seriously, you are projecting now. I'm done being baited into sharing just so you can tear me down. But if I had started this post by saying that I was fat and I found out fat girls were attractive (to me), then none of this would have been a point of dispute. Because I admitted that how I look wasn't the usual physical pairing and is honestly uncommon in this world, you jumped all over me saying that I was acting like I was doing her a favor. Sure, maybe I have some sour grapes that it didn't work out, but I'm allowed to feel however the fuck I want to.

She was making out with me just as much as I was making out with her. Kissing is nice and is a mutual give/take interaction. I can't believe I have to explain that.

 

[MasochisticAvenger]

Well you let her make out with you, and then you went on to brag about it to a bunch of random people on the internet. You've used her quite extensively in this thread in an attempt to try and make yourself look good.

Also, pro-tip, attractiveness is subjective. A lot of guys will say they're attracted to blondes, but honestly they don't really do it for me. Some people are attracted to overweight people, and there is nothing wrong with that. What I have a problem with is you acting like someone who is overweight cannot get a date unless someone lowers their standards.

Whoa now. I "let her make out with me?" I was so not used to physical affection that when we started I was shaking. And I was "bragging?" Yeah, getting to make out with a girl once before being ignored by her forever is really worth boasting about to "the guys" who honestly probably wouldn't be interested in her at all. Seriously, you are projecting now. I'm done being baited into sharing just so you can tear me down. But if I had started this post by saying that I was fat and I found out fat girls were attractive (to me), then none of this would have been a point of dispute. Because I admitted that how I look wasn't the usual physical pairing and is honestly uncommon in this world, you jumped all over me saying that I was acting like I was doing her a favor. Sure, maybe I have some sour grapes that it didn't work out, but I'm allowed to feel however the fuck I want to.

She was making out with me just as much as I was making out with her. Kissing is nice and is a mutual give/take interaction. I can't believe I have to explain that.

No, I'm saying you're acting like you're doing her a favor because you said she could never possibly form a relationship with anyone better than you. And yes, you let her; she may have started it, but you didn't stop it. Also, no I don't believe anything you've said is brag worthy, but you chose to brag about it anyway.

I think you're just sore over the fact she didn't want you, so you're trying to convince yourself the problem is with her. It's her fault she isn't attracted to you, and she will never be able to do any better than when she was with you, right? Surely, the problem cannot be with you, right? She just doesn't know what she is missing out on.

Sure, make up all the scenarios you wish to try and make me look like the bad guy. It's easy enough to make up all kinds of hypothetical situations. The reality is you, a skinny person, made a big deal over the fact you made out with an overweight person.

But tell me, what am I supposed to be projecting, exactly?

 

[zelda2fanboy]

No, I'm saying you're acting like you're doing her a favor because you said she could never possibly form a relationship with anyone better than you. And yes, you let her; she may have started it, but you didn't stop it. Also, no I don't believe anything you've said is brag worthy, but you chose to brag about it anyway.

I think you're just sore over the fact she didn't want you, so you're trying to convince yourself the problem is with her. It's her fault she isn't attracted to you, and she will never be able to do any better than when she was with you, right? Surely, the problem cannot be with you, right? She just doesn't know what she is missing out on.

Sure, make up all the scenarios you wish to try and make me look like the bad guy. It's easy enough to make up all kinds of hypothetical situations. The reality is you, a skinny person, made a big deal over the fact you made out with an overweight person.

But tell me, what am I supposed to be projecting, exactly?

See the two previous sentences before you ask how you are projecting. Those ones. Right there. I never said that and I never acted like that. You did. And second of all, she is missing out. I guess I could continue to feel shitty and bad about myself and useless and unlikable. There was something about me that made her want to be with me, at least for a little bit. Not you or anyone else. Me. Be it physical or my personality or anything. She liked me and while she doesn't date me anymore, she still seems to like me on a friend level. So if I'm as big a douchebag as you paint me to be, why would she have ever wanted anything to do with me and why hasn't she blocked me out of her life entirely?

You know how I feel about her being unable to form a relationship with anyone better? I feel that way about every woman on the planet. And you should, too. No woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's worthless because then by proxy it makes her feel worthless. I'm teh awesome sauce and it's unfortunate she couldn't see that. Or I could say "I'm a pathetic useless chunk of flesh and I should kill myself. You look like you want to hang out with me." Two ways of looking at it. Having a positive opinion of yourself does not make you a bad person.

 

[Eamar]

You know how I feel about her being unable to form a relationship with anyone better? I feel that way about every woman on the planet. And you should, too. No woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's worthless because then by proxy it makes her feel worthless. I'm teh awesome sauce and it's unfortunate she couldn't see that. Or I could say "I'm a pathetic useless chunk of flesh and I should kill myself. You look like you want to hang out with me." Two ways of looking at it. Having a positive opinion of yourself does not make you a bad person.

Moderation, dude. Seriously.

True, no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's worthless, but equally no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's god's gift.

There's a whole world of possibilities between suicidally low self-esteem and pure, mind-numbing arrogance. I've seen you exhibit both on these forums over the last few months, but you won't get anywhere until you find the middle ground. Harsh but true.

 

[zelda2fanboy]

Moderation, dude. Seriously.

True, no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's worthless, but equally no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's god's gift.

There's a whole world of possibilities between suicidally low self-esteem and pure, mind-numbing arrogance. I've seen you exhibit both on these forums over the last few months, but you won't get anywhere until you find the middle ground. Harsh but true.

I know it's of no importance, but I'm not what I'm like on these forums in real life. There's not much of a barrier between what's going on in my brain and what my fingers type on here. There's also a moderate degree of anonymity, so I can say whatever pops into my mind and it's of little consequence. Face-to-face however, there's about 25 years of learning how to act like a normal human being hiding that stuff.

You see, if I had never said these things out loud to strangers, it would have gone uncontested in my brain and just sat there. Then eventually it would have slipped out in one form or another, and suddenly I actually am the Biggest Douche in the Universe and not just on the internet.

 

[MasochisticAvenger]

There was something about me that made her want to be with me, at least for a little bit. Not you or anyone else. Me. Be it physical or my personality or anything. She liked me and while she doesn't date me anymore, she still seems to like me on a friend level. So if I'm as big a douchebag as you paint me to be, why would she have ever wanted anything to do with me and why hasn't she blocked me out of her life.

Yeah, you went out on two dates and then she started ignoring you; that's not exactly something to brag about. It doesn't matter if she chose you, clearly something about you turned her off. Also, she seems to like you on a friend level? So you don't know for sure? Didn't you say before she had so many friends that she didn't need you. Yeah, that's a load of crap; I'm guessing she decided she did not want to be your friend, and you're just trying to make excuses for it.

Moderation, dude. Seriously.

True, no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's worthless, but equally no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's god's gift.

There's a whole world of possibilities between suicidally low self-esteem and pure, mind-numbing arrogance. I've seen you exhibit both on these forums over the last few months, but you won't get anywhere until you find the middle ground. Harsh but true.

Thank you, you said exactly what I was going to say on that. There is a huge difference between comfidence and arrogance; something z2f will need to learn.

 

[zelda2fanboy]

There was something about me that made her want to be with me, at least for a little bit. Not you or anyone else. Me. Be it physical or my personality or anything. She liked me and while she doesn't date me anymore, she still seems to like me on a friend level. So if I'm as big a douchebag as you paint me to be, why would she have ever wanted anything to do with me and why hasn't she blocked me out of her life.

Yeah, you went out on two dates and then she started ignoring you; that's not exactly something to brag about. It doesn't matter if she chose you, clearly something about you turned her off. Also, she seems to like you on a friend level? So you don't know for sure? Didn't you say before she had so many friends that she didn't need you. Yeah, that's a load of crap; I'm guessing she decided she did not want to be your friend, and you're just trying to make excuses for it.

I wasn't bragging, I was just talking. And when I say on a friend level, I mean she hasn't facebook blocked me, she occasionally writes nice things on my wall, and she doesn't delete my dumb comments on hers. Why you gotta be so mean? Actually forget I asked that. I'm tired of writing to you.

 

[Eamar]

I know it's of no importance, but I'm not what I'm like on these forums in real life. There's not much of a barrier between what's going on in my brain and what my fingers type on here. There's also a moderate degree of anonymity, so I can say whatever pops into my mind and it's of little consequence. Face-to-face however, there's about 25 years of learning how to act like a normal human being hiding that stuff.

You see, if I had never said these things out loud to strangers, it would have gone uncontested in my brain and just sat there. Then eventually it would have slipped out in one form or another, and suddenly I actually am the Biggest Douche in the Universe and not just on the internet.

I appreciate that people are more honest on the internet but... you don't think that if you ended up in a real relationship these things wouldn't come out? You can't hide these things from a serious partner.

Thank you, you said exactly what I was going to say on that. There is a huge difference between comfidence and arrogance; something z2f will need to learn.

Unfortunately confusion between the two is surprisingly common. It works both ways too- I bet most of the so-called "douchebags" people claim their female friends are dating are not actually douches at all, just confident. Some people seem unable to distinguish the two concepts.

 

[MasochisticAvenger]

I know it's of no importance, but I'm not what I'm like on these forums in real life. There's not much of a barrier between what's going on in my brain and what my fingers type on here. There's also a moderate degree of anonymity, so I can say whatever pops into my mind and it's of little consequence. Face-to-face however, there's about 25 years of learning how to act like a normal human being hiding that stuff.

You see, if I had never said these things out loud to strangers, it would have gone uncontested in my brain and just sat there. Then eventually it would have slipped out in one form or another, and suddenly I actually am the Biggest Douche in the Universe and not just on the internet.

I appreciate that people are more honest on the internet but... you don't think that if you ended up in a real relationship these things wouldn't come out? You can't hide these things from a serious partner.

Thank you, you said exactly what I was going to say on that. There is a huge difference between comfidence and arrogance; something z2f will need to learn.

Unfortunately confusion between the two is surprisingly common. It works both ways too- I bet most of the so-called "douchebags" people claim their female friends are dating are not actually douches at all, just confident. Some people seem unable to distinguish the two concepts.

See, I am a big believer of how you act all the time makes up what kind of person you are. You cannot simply say "how I act in real life is different to how I act on the Internet" and expect it to excuse everything you do.

That's true, but part of the whole douchebsg thing comes from the fact the "nice guy" often believes no other guy is good enough for the girl he likes.

 

[zelda2fanboy]

I know it's of no importance, but I'm not what I'm like on these forums in real life. There's not much of a barrier between what's going on in my brain and what my fingers type on here. There's also a moderate degree of anonymity, so I can say whatever pops into my mind and it's of little consequence. Face-to-face however, there's about 25 years of learning how to act like a normal human being hiding that stuff.

You see, if I had never said these things out loud to strangers, it would have gone uncontested in my brain and just sat there. Then eventually it would have slipped out in one form or another, and suddenly I actually am the Biggest Douche in the Universe and not just on the internet.

I appreciate that people are more honest on the internet but... you don't think that if you ended up in a real relationship these things wouldn't come out? You can't hide these things from a serious partner.

Yeah, that's why I say them here. Being isolated for a really long time grows a lot of wrongheaded shit into one's brain. So when people call me an asshole in a thread, it's not going to actually destroy real life relationships, it's just going to force me to reshape my viewpoint. I really don't know what is the middle ground between "I'm a worthless sod" and "She's missing out."

Have you ever been really outright rejected repeatedly? It's painful as fuck. While I didn't go on any real life "dates" after the girl in question, I did meet a girl for a conversation at a bookstore (who correctly realized it wasn't a match and she wanted someone taller anyways) and I met a girl online and who I fell deeply in love with (I lost my virginity to her and she won't talk to me anymore). I still can't cognitively reframe the latter incident in my mind that doesn't automatically force projectile tears out of my eye sockets. I should take up acting.

But if I can make some failed relationship from months and months ago not hurt anymore by simply stating the simple fact (and it is) that she doesn't know what she turned away, where's the harm? I really don't know how she isn't missing out when I think about it. There are benefits to being my girlfriend (I imagine).

 

[Loonyyy]

"Don't get me wrong, I know you're only being good./But that's what's wrong, I guess I just misunderstood."-Want you Bad-The Offspring.

I think that sums it up.

For some of us, it's easy to mistake people treating us nicely, and being kind, for flirtation or attraction. Much of the time, it isn't. At which point, you haven't been "Friend Zoned", you're just not what she's after. And it might be because she likes badboys, or handsome guys or whatever. She could be entirely shallow, and you know what? There's nothing wrong with that. People can be however they like and have no need to conform to your standards, and at the end of the day, you do not meet their criterion, and that's all, and since they've already dealt with it, all that's left is to deal with it yourself.

 

[5ilver]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prHeeC0GAc8
Related song.

 

[Snowbell]

Ok, let's get this straight. The friendzone DOES exist - but only in the cases of really horrid girls who are so vain and self-worshipping that no decent guy should be interested in them anyway because by 'decent' I mean they see deeper than 'pretty girl, nice body, want to bang'.

However, there is the 'not interested' zone. This is where women put guys they're not interested in - FOR LEGITIMATE REASONS. These can include looks, personality, financial problems, emotional problems or just NOT BEING ATTRACTED TO THAT PERSON.

We women don't have to date any guy who comes our way, we're usually looking for something specific that not every guy can provide, and it makes me really mad that people think girls should have low enough standards to just go out with anyone who wants to get in their pants.

I have 'friendzoned' guys when I didn't find them attractive but wanted to be their friend still, is that so bad?

Guys have frienzoned me, and I don't blame them, I don't expect everyone to find me attractive just as I don't find everyone I meet attractive.

TL;DR: If you define 'friendzoning' as teasing a guy you've just rejected with your body/statements such as 'I wish I could find a guy like you!' then yes, it's real, but only really horrible women do it.
If you define it as mentally defining someone as not being attractive to you personally then we ALL do it.

Just don't ever lump all us women as being manipulative bitches.

 

[Johann610]

I should have written that as "...some men cannot be friends with women...", but I let the point stand.

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

Moderation, dude. Seriously.

True, no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's worthless, but equally no woman wants to date a guy who thinks he's god's gift.

There's a whole world of possibilities between suicidally low self-esteem and pure, mind-numbing arrogance. I've seen you exhibit both on these forums over the last few months, but you won't get anywhere until you find the middle ground. Harsh but true.

Yeah, pretty much this.

Ok, let's get this straight. The friendzone DOES exist - but only in the cases of really horrid girls who are so vain and self-worshipping that no decent guy should be interested in them anyway because by 'decent' I mean they see deeper than 'pretty girl, nice body, want to bang'.

However, there is the 'not interested' zone. This is where women put guys they're not interested in - FOR LEGITIMATE REASONS. These can include looks, personality, financial problems, emotional problems or just NOT BEING ATTRACTED TO THAT PERSON.

We women don't have to date any guy who comes our way, we're usually looking for something specific that not every guy can provide, and it makes me really mad that people think girls should have low enough standards to just go out with anyone who wants to get in their pants.

I have 'friendzoned' guys when I didn't find them attractive but wanted to be their friend still, is that so bad?

Guys have frienzoned me, and I don't blame them, I don't expect everyone to find me attractive just as I don't find everyone I meet attractive.

TL;DR: If you define 'friendzoning' as teasing a guy you've just rejected with your body/statements such as 'I wish I could find a guy like you!' then yes, it's real, but only really horrible women do it.
If you define it as mentally defining someone as not being attractive to you personally then we ALL do it.

Just don't ever lump all us women as being manipulative bitches.

This is all true.

However! I still think that there's a small but vocal population of guys who seem to define it as "teasing" if a woman they're attracted to is willing to associate with them at all, but doesn't "put out." (And often enough, these are the same individuals who aren't above being emotionally manipulative themselves.)

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

SNIP

You have ANY friends you dont want to fuck? Are they nice to you? Then you should want to fuck them. Its the only logical conclusion.

When a girl says she wants a "nice guy" she isnt saying she wants a guy whose ONLY trait is "nice". What she means is that she wants someone who has all the traits she wants. A "Nice cake" isnt a cake thats friendly. Its a good cake. See how its a different adjective?

Generally, I think being "nice" to attract a mate is overrated. "Nice" is great if you're a Disney Princess, but come on, everyone should be nice to each other. That's just standard practice for living in polite society. And just because people often aren't nice to each other doesn't mean that when you are, it somehow makes you more distinctive or desirable. I mean, it's like flossing. You really want to hang your hat on the fact that you floss, and other people don't? I mean, sure, you'll have nice teeth. But... what else?

A woman who tells her friends that, "well, he was nice" is damning you with faint praise, because it means she can't think of anything else to remember you by.

So don't settle for being "nice". Strive for "amazing", or "unforgettable", or "the greatest man I've ever met".

Yes, be respectful, generous and kind. Be nice. But also: Do the things you do well. Don't apologize when you win. Tell jokes in a crowd. Take the mic in Rock Band. Be the DM. See the world. Laugh loudly. Dance badly. Try the things that scare you. Wear a stupid hat. Share your opinions freely. Share your kindnesses even more freely. Love yourself first, and without restraint. Just burn, burn like a flame that can't go out; burn brighter and hotter than even the sun.

Fuck being a nice guy. Be a supernova instead.

Quoted for absolute truth.

 

[Snowbell]

However! I still think that there's a small but vocal population of guys who seem to define it as "teasing" if a woman they're attracted to is willing to associate with them at all, but doesn't "put out." (And often enough, these are the same individuals who aren't above being emotionally manipulative themselves.)

This is very true, so just like it's only horrid girls who do the friendzoning, it's only horrid guys who complain about it and propogate it's existance.

Speaking of emotional manipulation, allow me to share my story;
I recently put a guy into the friend-only zone after I told him of my desire to have a relationship with him, at which point he decided to have sex with our mutual friend and then try to win me back the next day. Ever since he has been trying to guilt-trip me into dating him, despite what he had done having been a deal breaker for me.

I don't tease him at all, but I can imagine some idiots saying I friendzone him just because I won't go out with him, which is apparently enough to count.