R4 Cartridges Declared Illegal in the U.K.

[Woodsey]

Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

My main problem with it (apart from the fact that it was devised by Darth Mandelson) is that they'll get it wrong. It's been made up by people who likely have no clue that people are quite willing to sit outside someone's house in a car, connect to their wireless network and then download stuff through it without the owner knowing.

Not to mention that disabling someone's internet can cut off major ties in their social life and impact negatively on their work life.

 

[Om Nom Nom]

*boots up DS emulator* Mmm? What's an R4?

 

[Arcane Azmadi]

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Erm...No. Where'd you get that from?

What I'm saying is that on practical terms, outright banning said cartridges won't reduce their availability. They'll still be made illegally, and available as such. Same thing that happens when you ban pretty much anything, people find other ways to get it.

Oh wait, I get it now. You're saying that since laws are impotent and ineffective we shouldn't bother making them or attempting to enforce them.

You could be onto something here. Judging from the number of people robbed, raped or murdered every year worldwide, law does start to look like a failed experiment. If we can't even stop a man from dragging a woman into a dark alley, brutally anally raping her, slitting her throat and pocketing her purse, how can we expect to stop something as trivial as people using illegal piracy devices?

God, I just can't stop depressing myself every time I open my mouth.

 

[tmujir955]

Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

? n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

A handy guide.

 

[tmujir955]

Also, many people are bringing up a very good point: is the R4 the only banned flashcart?

 

[rembrandtqeinstein]

Rather, you should break all unjust laws

Eh...can't say as that's a great idea.

Bear in mind laws are created to uphold social values, just because you think something's ok doesn't mean society does.

Case in point: Uninsured drivers do so to avoid paying huge insurance fees, people hit by uninsured drivers are shit out of luck. Cannabis use isn't necessarily bad in and of itself, but look at smuggling (I come from a country where it's not native and won't grow in the wild even if introduced, not for more than four months or so anyway) and there are definitely victims of cannabis smugglers!

Your definition of 'unjust' isn't necessarily the same as everyone else's.

I'll be polite and just say you have no idea what you are talking about.

Since I'm an adult who actually pays for insurance I know about a little thing called "Uninsured Motorist Coverage". I pay a little extra every month and if someone without insurance is at fault in an accident my insurance company pays for my medical bills and repairs. In other words the existence of uninsured drivers only affects me in the amount I pay for my Uninsured Motorist rider.

Cannibis can be grown indoors anywhere you have electricity and climate control. I bet the the guys at Antarctic research stations have some really good shit, because what the hell else is there to do?

You talk about society this and society that but in reality society is nothing more than a thought construct, it doesn't exist any more than "intellectual property" exists. The "social values" you say laws uphold are really nothing more than conveniences for the few people with guns and power.

Take responsibility for your own opinions and stop trying to shift that responsibility to "society".

I don't give two squirts of piss what everyone else thinks is unjust. What really matters are my values and morals, not what some legislature decided is the "law" just to make themselves, their families, and their peer group richer.

 

[Moriarty70]

Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

? n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

Fine, piracy is not in itself theft. It is however stealing the value of the product. By bootlegging software that is still available for sale you're taking away from the developers, the publishers, the distributors and, if you buy in bricks and mortar, the retailer.

So, once you've downloaded this item, you have then deprived these organizations, that employ real flesh and blood humans just like you and me, of their rightfully deserved money.

Now if we're talking about Abandonware than that's a different issue since no one stands to make money on something not commercially available.

 

[Pipotchi]

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Erm...No. Where'd you get that from?

What I'm saying is that on practical terms, outright banning said cartridges won't reduce their availability. They'll still be made illegally, and available as such. Same thing that happens when you ban pretty much anything, people find other ways to get it.

Oh wait, I get it now. You're saying that since laws are impotent and ineffective we shouldn't bother making them or attempting to enforce them.

You could be onto something here. Judging from the number of people robbed, raped or murdered every year worldwide, law does start to look like a failed experiment. If we can't even stop a man from dragging a woman into a dark alley, brutally anally raping her, slitting her throat and pocketing her purse, how can we expect to stop something as trivial as people using illegal piracy devices?

God, I just can't stop depressing myself every time I open my mouth.

I would be depressed as well if I talked about woman getting anally raped, seems like an unneccessarily graphic example

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

So then it was because it had a legal use it was legal regardless and today because it has a illegal use its illegal regardless....ya..... I smell lobby money and government corruption.....

 

[oktalist]

IANAL, but...

    
    
    	    	(i) manufactures for sale or hire, imports, distributes, sells or lets for hire, offers or exposes for sale or hire, advertises for sale or hire or has in his possession for commercial purposes any means the sole intended purpose of which is to facilitate the unauthorised removal or circumvention of the technical device; or
    	    	(ii) publishes information intended to enable or assist persons to remove or circumvent the technical device.

[td colspan=3]§296 (1) This section applies where - [/td] [td colspan=2](a) a technical device has been applied to a computer program; and[/td] [td colspan=2](b) a person knowing or having reason to believe that it will be used to make infringing copies -[/td]

Possessing an R4 is not unlawful, provided you do not intend to use it for commercial purposes.

Personally importing an R4 as a private individual for personal use is not unlawful, provided you do not intend to use it for piracy.

Selling or gifting an R4 is not unlawful, provided it is to someone who you can reasonably trust not to use it for piracy, such as a trusted friend.

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

? n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

Fine, piracy is not in itself theft. It is however stealing the value of the product. By bootlegging software that is still available for sale you're taking away from the developers, the publishers, the distributors and, if you buy in bricks and mortar, the retailer.

So, once you've downloaded this item, you have then deprived these organizations, that employ real flesh and blood humans just like you and me, of their rightfully deserved money.

Now if we're talking about Abandonware than that's a different issue since no one stands to make money on something not commercially available.

What if you downloaded a game you would never buy otherwise? That deprives no one of nothing

That is the problem the pro IP/CP people can not figure out nor is the less rights and freedoms the public has the less money it has to spend on their frivolous crap the CP/IP shovel out....

 

[Moriarty70]

What if you downloaded a game you would never buy otherwise? That deprives no one of nothing

Then you're forced to ask yourself a few questions.

Why were you never going to buy it?
If you're planing on playing it why wouldn't you buy it/rent it?
If you're getting anything out of it, even if that's just killing time, aren't the people behind the creation of it entitled to the money you refused to spend?
What makes you special that you get to enjoy something without paying for it unlike everyone else?

I'm not perfect, I've done it before when I was a broke high-schooler, but now that I make a living I make a choice between what to spend my excess cash on.

 

[S_K]

There's a bit of a 2 sided coin here tbh I mean when I tried a friends r4 it gave me new understanding about how big a game physically actually was and how this actually had no relation with the price, but it also taught me how much game companies especially on the DS are ripping people off with garbage <.< I can understand why nintendo has tried so hard to fight this case, especially with how money hungry they are, but with the ratio of good to bad games on their system I almost feel it was partly justified too.

 

[midpipps]

Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (&#952;&#603;ft)

? n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

I think you should scroll down a little on that page and take a look at the legal definition

Legal Dictionary

Main Entry: theft
Function: noun
Etymology: Old English thiefth
: LARCENY; broadly : a criminal taking of the property or services of another without consent
NOTE: Theft commonly encompasses by statute a variety of forms of stealing formerly treated as distinct crimes.

you are taking their intellectual property without consent. therefore you are a thief.

I just don't understand why if you are not planning on buying said product what gives you the right to take it without paying for it. If you do not think it is worth your money then don't get it and don't play it. If you want it but cannot afford it save up for it. I am sorry there is no reason at all that if the game creators are asking for money for this game you should get it for free. Either buy it or don't play it that simple.

 

[Mr.Petey]

I think it's stupid to make this cartridge illegal, why is that piece of plastic illegal? It's not physically dangerous, it has perfectly legal uses.

Guns have a perfectly legal use, they are still outlawed in England.
On the flip side, the people who pirate the games get them from the internet. They should make that illegal too.

Excellent point. This excuse of people downloading games and such with the age old excuse of "It's too expensive!" needs to have the line drawn and if legality plays a role in infringing on the "right" to pirate games then so be it.

Yes there are expensive cartridges on the online/high street shops but there's no harm in waiting a few weeks for them to drop a few bucks in price after release date surely? Plastic cartridge games for the DS and such will always be a more expensive than the alternative disc format.

On a slightly different note, a spokesperson for ADV films (who distributed anime on VHS and then DVD) insisted with an accusing finger that downloads DO cripple the market for commercial endeavours because nobody is buying their product and instead finding it virtually "stolen" instead so they can enjoy the game/film without any of the money going back into manufacture.