Remaking games

[akibawall95]

Why do game companies not do this more often? It seems like a good marketing idea to me for example hardcore fans would buy the game while it can introduce newer gamers to the series and people who jumped in half way though and enjoyed the game would but do not want to play the outdated original. I mean I started playing Half Life in Half Life 2 and I do not feel like playing a 10+ year old game (I also do not even know where to find it). Of course they would have to implement elements from the sequel to satisfy the newer gamers but I think this would be a great idea to do more often and I do not mean resent games but older games like the original Metal Gears, Half Life, Fallout 1+2 and any others you can think of (give me some ideas).

 

[BenzSmoke]

Well if it's just extremely old games that fans of the current games in that series never got to play, then I don't see a problem with remaking them. I wouldn't mind seeing Fallout 1 & 2 being remade, as long as their art style, difficulty, and gameplay elements are intact.

 

[SnootyEnglishman]

IF someone really wants to play an older game they will make the quest to find it.

 

[gallaetha_matt]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no! No - just... just no.

This is the same pandora's box that the film and music industries opened up years ago. It leads down some very dark roads.

You end up giving a free pass to video game developers; "This version of Wet might have sucked, but we're doing another remake, we'll get it right this time I swear!"

Stifling the creativity of the independant types "This costume themed RPG sounds interesting Mr. Schafer, but first - make a gritty reboot of Psychonauts . Yes, I know you made one last year - but there are 12 - 16 year old boys that were too young to ride the last wave."

Or just plain old pulling the crap that the music industry has been doing for years "Guys! We're doing Baldur's Gate again! In 3D this time! Plus all the voices have been auto-tuned! This is truly the greatest day in gaming history!"

Because that's what they'll do. I know, I'd like to see a fully rendered FF7 as much as anybody. But at what cost, escapists? AT WHAT COST!!!?

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

IF someone really wants to play an older game they will make the quest to find it.

Agreed. There is enough replication in this industry as it is, we don't need to step up even more.

By constantly moving to new ideas, we get new game concepts. Maybe after 20 years a remake can be justified. We don't need remakes of games done 8 years ago IMO.

 

[Netrigan]

I'm not dead set against remaking an old game. There's a few series where a quick update for a new console is just what the doctor ordered. Serious Sam 3 is in development and what better way to promote it (and maybe make a bit of extra money) then re-release the original game in HD. Likewise God Of War. I think we're getting to a point where keeping older games in print is becoming the norm and putting a fresh coat of paint on them for HD systems makes sense.

Remaking older games for a premium release... then I think it needs to be different enough that it's pretty much a new game with the same story, otherwise I don't think it can justify its price tag. But I'm not exactly wild about this.

 

[Chimpzy_v1legacy]

I guess it depends on whether the original game was good enough to stand the test of time.

Take Earthworm Jim HD. They hardly changed anything, maybe even nothing except a graphical update and some extra difficulty modes. But it still plays great, a testament to just how solid its gameplay was way back in the day.

On the other side of the spectrum is something like Turtles in Time: Reshelled. The original was good for its time, but now it stands revealed for what it is: a repetitive button-masher whose only grace is the TMNT name.

I do like what the dev of Lufia: Curse of the Sinistrals is doing. Actually changing the combat is risky as it could turn of fans of the series, even though the original turn-based system is admittedly outdated. Then again, it might work out great.

I'm not dead set against remaking an old game. There's a few series where a quick update for a new console is just what the doctor ordered. Serious Sam 3 is in development and what better way to promote it (and maybe make a bit of extra money) then re-release the original game in HD. Likewise God Of War. I think we're getting to a point where keeping older games in print is becoming the norm and putting a fresh coat of paint on them for HD systems makes sense.

They already did a HD remake: Serious Sam HD: The First Encounter [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serious_Sam#Serious_Sam_HD:_The_First_Encounter]

 

[Lyx]

Why do game companies not do this more often? It seems like a good marketing idea to me for example hardcore fans would buy the game while it can introduce newer gamers to the series and people who jumped in half way though and enjoyed the game would but do not want to play the outdated original. I mean I started playing Half Life in Half Life 2 and I do not feel like playing a 10+ year old game (I also do not even know where to find it). Of course they would have to implement elements from the sequel to satisfy the newer gamers but I think this would be a great idea to do more often and I do not mean resent games but older games like the original Metal Gears, Half Life, Fallout 1+2 and any others you can think of (give me some ideas).

You're not talking about remakes. You're talking about sequels/successors - the only thing you keep is the story.

Remaking something to me means to stay near 100% faithful to the original, both regarding gameplay, as well as art aesthetics. So, just updating a game to have better controls, be playable on current platforms, perhaps add multiplayer capabilities, reduce graphics aliasing without changing the style (so, in short, not "better/more detailed graphics" but instead just doing the same as the original with current techstandards), etc. - thus, basically just "porting" gameplay and content from an older techlevel to a newer one, without changing it significantly (except of perhaps for aspects that were problematic in the original).

As for me: I'm very happy that this isn't done often, because in 99% of all cases whenever something was "modernized" by a big studio, they did not do a remake as i described above. Heck, not even remakes from "indiedevs" manage to do this often (which is why i consider most indie remakes inferior to the original).

 

[akibawall95]

I do not mean just improving the graphics but whole new same game lol.

 

[Lyx]

Doesn't change what i said: If you change everything except of perhaps the story, then its basically like a sequel but with the old story. How many cases can you name, where this went well? I can only think about two cases: Pirates, and Another World. Aaaaand: By coincidence in both cases, the funadmental aspects of the original were NOT changed.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

No, generally I think this is a bad idea. Although some remakes have managed to turn out well, overall I'm against it. If These games are really good enough, their age should be irrelevant and true fans should want to play them regardless and anyone who's new to it should be sucked in regardless. If it fails on either count, it shouldn't even be considered for a remake; and if succeeds on either one or both counts, it doesn't need a remake.

 

[gallaetha_matt]

Because that's what they'll do. I know, I'd like to see a fully rendered FF7 as much as anybody. But at what cost, escapists? AT WHAT COST!!!?

Really? This is one of the things that horrifies me about game remakes.

OT; ...Its very tricky; say yes and you open the floodgates for a lot of bullcrap marketing, even more shovelware and the chance that we will end up like Hollywood is now. But say no and games like Fallout 1 and 2 end up passed by.

Don't get me wrong - a fully rendered FF7 remake has a very high chance of sucking hard enough to satisfy a longhaul sailor. But I thought that FF7 was a game that was quite limited by it's blocky, polygonal character models.

It was an epic, sweeping storyline that deserved FF8 quality graphics at the very least.

That, that right there. That's the nerdiest sentance I've ever written.

*sigh* I'm already looking for pocket protectors on eBay...

Graphics, to me are the least important part of the gameplay experience (I bring up Baldur's Gate in every thread, it's actually starting to get rather worrying). But that doesn't mean that FF7 didn't deserve more than it got.

 

[Netrigan]

I guess it depends on whether the original game was good enough to stand the test of time.

Take Earthworm Jim HD. They hardly changed anything, maybe even nothing except a graphical update and some extra difficulty modes. But it still plays great, a testament to just how solid its gameplay was way back in the day.

On the other side of the spectrum is something like Turtles in Time: Reshelled. The original was good for its time, but now it stands revealed for what it is: a repetitive button-masher whose only grace is the TMNT name.

I do like what the dev of Lufia: Curse of the Sinistrals is doing. Actually changing the combat is risky as it could turn of fans of the series, even though the original turn-based system is admittedly outdated. Then again, it might work out great.

I'm not dead set against remaking an old game. There's a few series where a quick update for a new console is just what the doctor ordered. Serious Sam 3 is in development and what better way to promote it (and maybe make a bit of extra money) then re-release the original game in HD. Likewise God Of War. I think we're getting to a point where keeping older games in print is becoming the norm and putting a fresh coat of paint on them for HD systems makes sense.

They already did a HD remake: Serious Sam HD: The First Encounter [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serious_Sam#Serious_Sam_HD:_The_First_Encounter]

And the second encounter as well, which is why I used it as an example. It's a good game with out-of-date graphics and all it needed was a fresh coat of paint to sell it to a (hopefully) new audience. Valve could probably do the same with the original Half-Life. Really, any polygon based game of quality that hasn't graphically aged well could find new life as an Xbox Live Arcade download.

 

[akibawall95]

It would have the same level design and same basic gameplay. Ok not a whole new game just not only improved graphics and a couple of new features.

 

[BlumiereBleck]

Because remaking games is the greatest sin in gaming

 

[Lyx]

Graphics, to me are the least important part of the gameplay experience (I bring up Baldur's Gate in every thread, it's actually starting to get rather worrying).

The "graphics" of baldurs gate, when viewed from the intended (static) perspective look better than most 3D games - just the technology is "lower". I discussed this yesterday with a buddy... in many many cases, when previous 2D franchises went 3D, they looked WORSE - not just regarding detail and aesthetics, but also regarding usability: It is much easier to make items/beings/whatever clearly distinguishable and indentifyable in 2D, than in 3D - in 3D, everything can quickly turn into a muddy mess. For many games, the only thing that really is gained via 3D, is free perspective and satisfying a stupid "3D == better == future"-mindset of certain players.

 

[Netrigan]

Graphics, to me are the least important part of the gameplay experience (I bring up Baldur's Gate in every thread, it's actually starting to get rather worrying). But that doesn't mean that FF7 didn't deserve more than it got.

The "graphics" of baldurs gate, when viewed from the intended (static) perspective look better than most 3D games - just the technology is "lower". I discussed this yesterday with a buddy... in many many cases, when previous 2D franchises went 3D, they looked WORSE - not just regarding detail and aesthetics, but also regarding usability: It is much easier to make items/beings/whatever clearly distinguishable and indentifyable in 2D, than in 3D - in 3D, everything can quickly turn into a muddy mess. For many games, the only thing that really is gained via 3D, is free perspective and satisfying a stupid "3D == better == future"-mindset of certain players.

Sprite-based games... just need to up the resolutions and they're good to go, because they look like they look. The Windows Doom port from years back doubled the resolution of the game and it looks so much better than the original release.

But those early polygon games... egads, they just look awful. Porting those things over to a new game engine with HD graphics is the way to go on most of them. I was actually surprised how awful the original Serious Sam looked, because the new HD version looked the way I remembered it. The memory just lies its ass off sometimes. And as long as they do it as a budget game, I'm cool with it. I would love to see Dark Knight II: Jedi Knight ported over to a game engine that didn't look like ten types of ass.

 

[gallaetha_matt]

It got far more than any other FF7 game; a prequel or two, a sequel film in Advent Children, and a side-story in Dirge of Cerberus. I wish people would let the remake wishing die; not only will Square cock it up-like they tend to do with game sequels- but its akin to pouring a gallon of petrol on a bonfire. I'll give you credit that it was limited by its graphical limits though.

I'd rather they remade FF6 or FF4 instead. And not for the handheld consoles.

Yeah, it did get a fair amount of attention. It's unfortunate that a lot of that stuff was awful in comparison.

Advent Children I remember being really excited for this for years. Then when it came out, I tried really hard to like it, I did. I even bought (and currently own) a copy on DVD. But I found it was just such an exercise in futility. It seemed like so much cheap cashing in on the franchise.

It's the type of thing we'd get if FF7 got remade, of course. But that doesn't mean I don't have a sense of morbid curiosity about what it would be like. I'm worried that I might be a masochist, I asked the woman who spanks me every Friday night and she said not to worry about it...

The "graphics" of baldurs gate, when viewed from the intended (static) perspective look better than most 3D games - just the technology is "lower". I discussed this yesterday with a buddy... in many many cases, when previous 2D franchises went 3D, they looked WORSE - not just regarding detail and aesthetics, but also regarding usability: It is much easier to make items/beings/whatever clearly distinguishable and indentifyable in 2D, than in 3D - in 3D, everything can quickly turn into a muddy mess. For many games, the only thing that really is gained via 3D, is free perspective and satisfying a stupid "3D == better == future"-mindset of certain players.

I'm in agreement with you here. I actually played the original Baldur's Gate on the static 2D setting because I didn't have a video card powerful enough to run it in full 3D (and I still don't for that matter). I thought it looked damn cool, myself - and at a time I had a playstation and some shiny, pretty games, I was piloting my half-elven thief through the sword coast battering gnolls.

No, no - that right there. That was the nerdiest sentance I've ever written.

But there are people out there (I've met them, and it sounds like you have too) who thought that Baldur's Gate looked bad, and therefore it must've been bad too. These are the sort of people who are right now rushing out to buy 3D televisions.

Graphics aren't the be all and end all. As long as you can see where you're going (j'acuse Gears Of War! ) it's all good by me.

 

[Lyx]

But there are people out there (I've met them, and it sounds like you have too) who thought that Baldur's Gate looked bad, and therefore it must've been bad too. These are the sort of people who are right now rushing out to buy 3D televisions.

*shrugs* well, i guess they cannot be helped. When i'm looking at baldurs gate, or planetscape torment, the only visual improvements i can think of are:

- May need upping the resolution and allow zooming
- environment looks too static (can be fixed via animated tiles, or perhaps even dynamically via "shader zones")

 

[Imperioratorex Caprae]

Here's an example of a bad reboot:

X-Com.

A friggin RTS turned into an FPS? With little to nothing to do with the original game?
WTF!