Removing One's Rocks

IamLEAM1983

Neloth's got swag.
Aug 22, 2011
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vun said:
The Gentleman said:
For the record, that book (50 Shades of Gray, and yes, I know that the title is something else, but let's be honest as to what it's referring to) is terrible. Like the original work the fanfic was based on (Twilight), it teaches extremely dangerous practices in a D/s relationship to the point that a sizable part of the BDSM community has read it to teach newcomers what not to do that they may have in mind.

And, uhh, obligatory, I don't eat ice cream when I watch porn or a porn derivative (such as a proper visual novel). You need both hands free... to work the keyboard and mouse.

Classy...
Well now you've made me want to read the book just as a "what-not-to-do" manual. Still not going to read it, but now I want to.
Well, allow me to put it this way:

"Story of O" by Pauline Réage is a proper take on softcore BDSM literature. The character of O is selected to be part of a reclusive community that shacks at a French château about once a month. For a week, the women are required to wear nothing but a red cloak, while the initiates have to spend their first week wearing an especially designed buttplug (yes). Past that, you're given detailed descriptions of what's going on between O and her main partner of the week, but you get the sense that she VOLUNTEERED for this, and that outside of that one week per month, she's a well-rounded career woman. She's essentially someone who has enough money and self-confidence to slip into a wholly submissive role, in order to get her jollies.

In opposition to that, you've got Anastasia Steele. She's completely subsumed by Christian Gray, has no real sense of Self when he's around, and merely kowtows to his every wish because, hey, he's just *that* drop-dead gorgeous. Who needs mutual consent when actual forceful detention is so much hotter, right?

What started out as an awful Harry Potter fanfic became an awful Story of O rip-off, and it clearly shows that the author has no real concept of what a decent sub/dom relationship implies. Trust is a major thing, honestly, as is the participants' continued ability to play it safe. "Shades" does away with consent and safety, because outright peril is apparently kinky to some. Go fig.
 

Gordon_4_v1legacy

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Aug 22, 2010
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Solo-Wing said:
Ha I can't believe Erin reads that crap. Now excuse me while I go back to Katawa Shoujo. [sub][sub]I love my sweet Hanako~[sub]It's not the same shut up.[/sub][/sub][/sub]
hickwarrior said:
Solo-Wing said:
Ha I can't believe Erin reads that crap. Now excuse me while I go back to Katawa Shoujo. [sub][sub]I love my sweet Hanako~[sub]It's not the same shut up.[/sub][/sub][/sub]
I think I know how you feel there. [sub]Though I'd rather go with Lily myself. [sub] Don't look at me like that...[/sub][/sub]

Also, I think katawa shoujo is more of a romance novel than FSOG, but only based on what team four star has read out loud.
I preferred Shizune myself; must be the glasses or that she's kind of a dom.
 

Talaris

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Sep 6, 2010
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Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded. I actually didn't even know what a visual novel was before the Escapist recommendation, so I'm actually thankful and amused at the same time, because some visual novels are damn good, and I'll never forget Katawa Shoujo for introducing me to the medium.

I guess I felt rather sad that an ultimately boring book adapted from vampire fan fiction can actually reach mega popularity and acceptance in Western culture, whereas even the visual novels that are extremely well written, emotional and thought provoking still get lumped with the more 'extreme' examples [sub][sub] OK I admit it I really enjoyed playing through the School Days VN [/sub][/sub] and are labelled as outright pornographic. When it's OK for western films to have sex scenes and nudity, but VNs like Kanon are classed as pornographic for having a total roughly 18 sexual images, something just isn't right.
 

Gordon_4_v1legacy

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Aug 22, 2010
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Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded. I actually didn't even know what a visual novel was before the Escapist recommendation, so I'm actually thankful and amused at the same time, because some visual novels are damn good, and I'll never forget Katawa Shoujo for introducing me to the medium.

I guess I felt rather sad that an ultimately boring book adapted from vampire fan fiction can actually reach mega popularity and acceptance in Western culture, whereas even the visual novels that are extremely well written, emotional and thought provoking still get lumped with the more 'extreme' examples [sub][sub] OK I admit it I really enjoyed playing through the School Days VN [/sub][/sub] and are labelled as outright pornographic. When it's OK for western films to have sex scenes and nudity, but VNs like Kanon are classed as pornographic for having a total roughly 18 sexual images, something just isn't right.
Less ridicule, more like point out the hypocrisy of the general attitude. Yes, Katawa Shoujo is an excellent visual novel with a strong, singular narrative after have decided which of the romance options is most interesting. The art is wonderful, the music at times is incredible. Were you to adapt it into a series of 'What If' novels, I am certain it would blow shit like 50 Shades out of the water.

However, just as not all romance novels are 50 Shades, not all visual novels are Katawa Shoujo. For everyone where there is a deep and abiding romance, there are about ten or twenty that aren't and for many reasons just plain suck, have too much cultural nuance we won't understand or skirt the line into what by and large we feel to be unacceptable.

That said, I hope to see more VN's come out with the same calibre of actual adult romance (read: not just fucking) and less insane bullshit because Katawa Shoujo exists.

And Shizune FTW!
 

Entitled

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Aug 27, 2012
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Talaris said:
When it's OK for western films to have sex scenes and nudity, but VNs like Kanon are classed as pornographic for having a total roughly 18 sexual images, something just isn't right.
Well to be fair, VNs with sex scenes *ARE* pornographic.

Katawa Shoujo is pretty much the only one that tried to stay within the boundaries of tasteful erotica, but about everything else, no matter how great the story is, and how elaborate it's non-sex-related plot is, will feature some hardcore fucking with on-screen coitus, gallons of cum, and pages of moaning (usually with voice acting!), overall directly following the art styles of typical hentai manga.

Game of Thrones has it's sex scenes. G-senjou no Maou has it's porn scenes, even if it has half as many of them, with a lot less narrative emphasis.
 

The Wooster

King Snap
Jul 15, 2008
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Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
You do realize "The Escapist" is a collection of individuals, yes? Not one person.
 

hazabaza1

Want Skyrim. Want. Do want.
Nov 26, 2008
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Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
Big surprise, content creators aren't a giant hivemind with all agreeing opinions.

EDIT: Well shit, the guy who helped make this said the same thing to you. Whoops, didn't need to add to that.

My bad.
 

Paradoxrifts

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Jan 17, 2010
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Grey Carter said:
Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
You do realize "The Escapist" is a collection of individuals, yes? Not one person.
I don't believe it. Not until I see the autopsy results, and the autopsy results of the clinician that preformed them.

Just to be on the safe side.
 

BX3

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Mar 7, 2011
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Grey Carter said:
Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
You do realize "The Escapist" is a collection of individuals, yes? Not one person.
Bullshit. I am quite certain that "The Escapist" is a collection of letters, not people.
 

Talaris

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Sep 6, 2010
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Grey Carter said:
Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
You do realize "The Escapist" is a collection of individuals, yes? Not one person.
Do you realise I wasn't being serious with this bit in my post, right? As I mentioned in the next sentence, I simply find it amusing that within the same site that showed me how good the medium was, it can also poke fun at it.

Don't worry I know your strips are satirical, I have to admit I found myself laughing at your original Katawa Shoujo strip.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/comics/critical-miss/9372-Ani-Chan

Hell your little recommendation at the bottom even helped persuade me to play it.
 

Arakasi

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Jun 14, 2011
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BX3 said:
Grey Carter said:
Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
You do realize "The Escapist" is a collection of individuals, yes? Not one person.
Bullshit. I am quite certain that "The Escapist" is a collection of letters, not people.
I don't know if it's my addled state of mind, but that made me laugh.

Anyhow, speaking as someone who is incapable of a normal human relationship, 50 Shades of anything is not my cup of tea. Nor is anything like it.
 

The Wooster

King Snap
Jul 15, 2008
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Talaris said:
Grey Carter said:
Talaris said:
Oh Escapist, the same website who loves Katawa Shoujo so much they wrote three articles about how amazing it is and everyone should play it, now jokingly ridicule the same audience they once persuaded.
You do realize "The Escapist" is a collection of individuals, yes? Not one person.
Do you realise I wasn't being serious with this bit in my post, right? As I mentioned in the next sentence, I simply find it amusing that within the same site that showed me how good the medium was, it can also poke fun at it.

Don't worry I know your strips are satirical, I have to admit I found myself laughing at your original Katawa Shoujo strip.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/comics/critical-miss/9372-Ani-Chan

Hell your little recommendation at the bottom even helped persuade me to play it.
Ah. Sorry, my bad.