Reverse discrimination

[ckam]

Well, if the competitors had almost the same exact qualities, then yes, go discriminate to create a more diverse workplace.

For this case, though, I don't believe you should have gotten the job. From what you say, the other guy seems to have more experience than you, which means that they've got a better quality than you. So... That's about it.

 

[The_Graff]

do you think it's acceptable to use gender or race to determine who will get a job between two persons roughly equal otherwise ?

honestly no, i dont. its nice to see one of the beneficiaries of it getting annoyed though.

 

[sivlin]

Ah yes... These kinda stories are what fuel the "male whites are the new minority" way of thinking for some.

I'm not sure how widespread this is but some companies do indeed factor in gender and ethnicity when looking for a new employee,it just makes the company look good and allows them to publish all sorts of statistics to prove the company is awesome.

I know not whether it is correct, all I know is OP has nothing to feel bad about, not your fault the company adopted this pc mentality and you had no impact on the decision.

To be honest, we are the new minority. We are VERY heavily discriminated against in all facets of life.

Personally, I think we need to drop all of this affirmative action bullshit and stop having special programs/scholarships and such for ANYONE. If we want to end discrimination completely - everyone truly needs to be equal. Having anything for one subset of people and not for the other should be completely done away with. Here's looking at you racial scholarships.

 

[Something Amyss]

Do you think it's acceptable to use gender or race to determine who will get a job between two persons roughly equal otherwise ?

Between equal candidates? I see little problem. It sounds like you were not an equal candidate, so I'm not sure how much this really applies to your circumstances.

Traditionally, and to some extent still, race, gender, sexuality, and religion have been grounds for rejecting someone from a job. The tendency to do the opposite is a natural shift to correct things. Sure, it's swung the other way, but we do not go from one extreme to equilibrium so easily as people might like.

 

[Something Amyss]

Ah yes... These kinda stories are what fuel the "male whites are the new minority" way of thinking for some.

Of course, these folks need little provocation. In nearby Keene New Hampshire, a guy lit himself on fire in protest of unfair treatment. He's become a folk hero now, with the internet Men's Rights Activists championing how the poor bastard was unfairly denied custody of his little girl because he was a MAN!

...Of course, it's because the sick little prick hit his wife and child. And his child, til she BLED.

If a man who actually injures little kids can be a folk hero, I have little concern for this notion that some will dishonestly use this sort of thing as a "whites are the new minority" deal.

There's still a ton of white privelege out there. What really gets them worried is they're feeling what it's like to not be protected by that privelege anymore. The guarantee that they would get the job, for example.

Even if there are missteps on the other side, they do not outweight the inherent bias in society.

 

[illas]

I know what you mean about hygiene in the men's bathrooms... I hate using public toilets for that very reason. I once accidently used the female bathrooms (accidently, I swear... I wasn't concentrating and didn't register which door I was going onto) and it was so clean! Fortunately no females came into the bathroom until I got out, so there weren't any awkward trips to the police station

Haha, you're right! I had the same experience a few years ago. Everything was gleaming white, it was a revelation!

 

[DVTK00p]

Chalk one up for politically correct affirmative action. Hippy fucking pansy-assed liberal policy makers.

 

[Treblaine]

Call it what you want, disabled parking is discrimination.

Yes, it is.

The problem is the inverse, how people inappropriately assuming ALL discrimination in every way is bad.

Employing a woman under-qualified for a job just as a "trophy" is deceiving and unfair. It does not promote excellence or ease sexist/racist prejudices - it inflames them. Unreasonable barriers should be removed, like stipulations that applicant must be young-white-male under the assumption only they can do the job when really the criteria should simply be what the demands for the job are.

Set the criteria clearly, don't make prejudices based on race or gender like "women can't understand computers" or "black people can't understand computers", THAT would be sexist/racist.

Simply set the standards and if they meet them, even if it's an middle aged black woman then unless something else comes up then she can take the job.

But giving her the job just to give the ILLUSION that you have no barriers, that will piss everyone off.

But part of the problem is activist organisation will do the:

"well you don't have a single black person on you staff"
"But it just so happens so few apply and those who do didn't fit the standards"
"WHRAAAAGHGHWTFBBQ DID YOU SAY!"

Disabled parking is a reasonable accommodation, as if you don't designate spaces with a side to climb out then no disabled people have even the OPPORTUNITY to use said facilities as they can park their car but very likely either cannot get out or cannot get back in their car. But something like giving disabled free parking is NOT about accommodation, disabled aren't necessarily too poor to afford parking. Unless the ticket machine is at the top of a flight of stairs there is no reason they can't get a ticket themselves.

 

[boyvirgo666]

Be thankful, I'm a white male with a mexican family. So when i get any kind of benefit like this its called white supremacy...also for some reason i was told i was the rich kid at school...because im white...not sure how that got started.

 

[honestdiscussioner]

You're not a bad person, it wasn't your decision.

It does suck that in reality, the other one deserved the job. Many women before you though have been in the reverse position. It doesn't make it right of course, but it is still reality.

Anyway, all you have to do is prove yourself as a good tech, work hard, do your job, and no one will remember this fact in a few months.

Edit: And if you really want to be awesome, find that guy's info and offer him a job whenever you're in the position to give one.

 

[FreakSheet]

True equality would be to hire who is best qualified. End of story.

 

[BRex21]

Any sentiment i want to say has already been said, but that won't stop me from talking. I have a couple stories to tell.
First, when i was just out of college i tried to land a job with Manitoba Hydro. My buddy, who owed me a favor, went to get forms for us. About 3 days after handing in the forms i got the call for an interview, I nailed it the guy wanted to hire me but... Since my buddy had a aboriginal relative 5 generations prior (IE as white as I am) he had gotten me forms for a minority. He got hired, I got put in a queue. now the added diversity had an unintentional side effect, one the interviewer found out I wasn't aboriginal he went off on a tangent about how much he hates the rules and aboriginal people using the words scum of the earth and the like. You see it seems hiring white people based on their qualifications and aboriginal people in order to fill arbitrary quotas had left him with a bad impression. I have no reason to doubt you can do the job, but you now have to prove yourself more than any male candidate would in order to earn respect.
I currently hold a good management position in the biotech field, I got my job when in an entry level position my boss and her boss quit. When everyone was standing around trying to figure out where to go, I started doing the job. I did it well and they gave me the job. To date I have gotten a plaque a cash bonus worth more than my , admittedly terrible, car and a free trip to Missouri to discuss the efficiency of my program. Still because we want more female managers and female biotech employees are plentiful this is the area that they want to do it. My skill has nothing to do with my skin or reproductive hardware and everything to do with my experience and personality, yet people want to replace me because i have an X chromeazome.
you have this job and you need to show your co-workers and your boss that you can do this job as good as anyone regardless of gender or race. You have to prove that a woman can do this job because your company has just come out and said you can't without their help.

 

[Icehearted]

Reverse discrimination is not discriminating... I think.....

 

[Evill_Bob]

It's the ever classic discriminate so you don't look like your discriminating. The token member of a group. Most free nations have some sort of system to encourage this, non-free nations either actively discriminate against certain groups or are simply don't give a shit as long as you do your job and kindly fuck off when they don't need you.

 

[Housebroken Lunatic]

Do you think it's acceptable to use gender or race to determine who will get a job between two persons roughly equal otherwise ?

No it isn't.

And as your very own experience should tell you, even if you're on the recipient end of "reverse discrimination" (just thought I'd point out that it's just as much "discrimination" to give someone arbitrary benefits as it is to dish out arbitrary punishment) it doesn't really further your cause or acknowledge your skills, it just makes you look like someone who got an unfair advantage and pretty much everyone you interact with will think you did (which you can't really blame them for).

So what's happening is basically that the people who discriminate by giving unfair advantages to some based on gender, race, ethnicity etc. are doing something severely detrimental to these people's efforts and achievements.

 

[Flare Phoenix]

Call it what you want, disabled parking is discrimination.

Disabled parking is a reasonable accommodation, as if you don't designate spaces with a side to climb out then no disabled people have even the OPPORTUNITY to use said facilities as they can park their car but very likely either cannot get out or cannot get back in their car. But something like giving disabled free parking is NOT about accommodation, disabled aren't necessarily too poor to afford parking. Unless the ticket machine is at the top of a flight of stairs there is no reason they can't get a ticket themselves.

As I said before, I was no way suggesting disabled parking was bad and needed to be removed. In fact, at a shopping centre I go to down here, they changed some of the disabled parking into pram parking and I thought that was just wrong (not sure whether a disabled person can park in a pram parking).

My point was believing all discrimination to be bad is wrong. Think about it: if every disabled person turned around and said "you know what? I don't like the fact we have special parking. It's discrimination!" soon enough everyone would think it was discrimination and future generations would look back at us and go "what were those people thinking".

 

[aldt]

'Reverse discrimination' is a nonsensical phrase. If you're discriminated against for being female, that's discrimination. If you're discriminated against for being male, that's discrimination. If you reverse the discrimination involved in a situation, you still end up with discrimination.

 

[cathou]

This feels like a setup to me.

I can't help but think the OP is laughing at the other end of a screen at his/her successful Troll.

I highly doubt the boss would admit to it when questioned. And I'm not a grammar nazi, by any stretch of the imagination. But you seem to substitute words the same way someone who isn't a native English speaker would. And I'm assuming this job would involve a lot of typing.

But hypothetically, this is the kind of situation that sours me on this 'hire for quotas' policy that seems to have spread throughout the world. True 'equal opportunities' would simply take the best person for the job and completely disregard gender/race. There is not such thing as 'reverse' or the even more alarmingly named 'positive' discrimination. There's just discrimination.

i wont try to defend myself, since i dont really care that you believe me or not, but i just want to point out that, yes i am not a native english speaker, french is my first language. But also, i work in a french speaking company, in a city that is mostly french speaking, and our clients are 90% french speaking. my knowledge of the english language is totally irrelevant. as long as i can read english documentation, i'm good.

But how far are your prepared to go? Will you report your employer for discriminating against you colleage? Will you ask to have the decision reversed? Though of course I think the first thing you need to do is meet with your employer and be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN of the situation, whether they employed you in guidance with company policy and discrimination laws but also public expectation.

You should honestly not be talking here, but talking to your employer and/or your union or whatever trade body would be appropriate.

we dont have any union or anything that defend employes right in our company. The owner of the company run this place like it was a 5 employe business. we have over 125 employes and the guy is still the only one who approve pay raise (often based on if he like you or not) and still approve every thing the company buys, even if it's just to choose what stapler we will get...

Anyway from what my boss told me, and by the way he's not my boss anymore since he's the direcotor of the sales department and he told me that in a private conversation while we were on lunch, at the end, they made the choice because i'm a girl, but it's not the only reason. they were hesitating between us already. that other guy dont have 10 years more experience than me, only a little more, but they think i'm more skilled that he his. if i were a guy, they might have choose him, but it's not 100% sure.

still, now i feel i got more the prove for deserving the job....

 

[DarkTenka]

Its discrimination .. but who cares? You got the job right?

If you really want to stop discrimination, your best bet (and every other in the same minority group) is to abuse the shit out of anyone willing to give you special treatment. Take everything they give you and dont give anything back, if the system is broken exploit it until it gets fixed. God knows trying to do the "right" thing will get you nowhere, thats life.

 

[Kinguendo]

Well, you are a woman... theres nothing you can do about it. Should you remain unemployed? Should people who dont have experience not be given a chance?

He only had experience because he was given a chance back when he had no experience, why should you not be given the same chance he has obviously already received?