Romans?

[RhombusHatesYou]

Romans? Stvpid cvnts, the lot of them.

 

[HerrBobo]

Actually there was such a thing as Italians; the Samnites were considered Italians, for instance. It's just that they were an inferior social category.

I don't agree with this.

You have to be very careful when looking at Roman history. You have to make sure that you are not just reading "the Roman" version of history. There was no such tribe as the "Samnites". That is a catch all name the Romans gave to the many tribes that lived in the Samnuim region of Italy. They were enthnicly related, yes. However, for most of their history they did not work as one unit or a one tribe. They certainly did not refer to themselves as "Samnites". It is a made up name that the Romans gave them.

The same can be said, though to a lesser extent, for Italians. The Romans called much of non-Roman Italy "Italians". The tribes of Italy did not call themselves this, and did not speak Italian.

 

[demoman_chaos]

The Empire didn't just happen.
A man named Romulus and his followers founded the town of Rome. Over time, the town expanded and so did its control. Eventually it took over most all of Europe and Northern Africa.
It is called the Roman Empire because it is the empire that the men from Rome created.The Romans had to defeat several other Italian powers early in its life.

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

The name of the empire was Rome, named after their capital city.

 

[Chris^^]

what have the romans ever done for us?

pizza

super mario

and other great things

oh you... you missed the point of that
and that was the Italians and Japanese respectively anyway
silly sausage

where did they get the idea hmm....

thats right Mario and Luigi were based off of two roman legionaries who ate magic mushrooms and gained super powers.

and pizza is a old roman recipe that was hidden in a sacred temple until the chosen one a descendant of a true roman found it and made the food of desire.

i believe you just got told good sir

lul wut?

and you still missed the point of my original comment..

 

[Maverick Siragusa]

what have the romans ever done for us?

pizza

super mario

and other great things

oh you... you missed the point of that
and that was the Italians and Japanese respectively anyway
silly sausage

where did they get the idea hmm....

thats right Mario and Luigi were based off of two roman legionaries who ate magic mushrooms and gained super powers.

and pizza is a old roman recipe that was hidden in a sacred temple until the chosen one a descendant of a true roman found it and made the food of desire.

i believe you just got told good sir

lul wut?

and you still missed the point of my original comment..

i never missed a point in my entire life (angry face)

 

[WINDOWCLEAN2]

The same reason we call Spartans, Spartans


Italy did not exist as a country.

Must. resist. 300. referance.

Well seen as the answers have blotted out the Sun of this Thread i think We will post in the Shade. (Sorry, Had to do it)

OT: What they all said, Rome was an independant state and expanded it Empire to make it a....bigger....state.

 

[Player 2]

what have the romans ever done for us?

pizza

super mario

and other great things

oh you... you missed the point of that
and that was the Italians and Japanese respectively anyway
silly sausage

where did they get the idea hmm....

thats right Mario and Luigi were based off of two roman legionaries who ate magic mushrooms and gained super powers.

and pizza is a old roman recipe that was hidden in a sacred temple until the chosen one a descendant of a true roman found it and made the food of desire.

i believe you just got told good sir

lul wut?

and you still missed the point of my original comment..

i never missed a point in my entire life (angry face)

 

[HerrBobo]

You're right, of course. We can get sloppy if we paint our strokes a little too broadly, and it's always a good idea to think critically about the received Roman political categories and terminology. On the other hand, revisionism can tempt us into over-correcting, as I think is happening here:


Whether or not "Samnite" was an autonym (and it may well not have been), the various tribes of Samnium did in fact work together politically for large stretches of what we know of their history. No doubt they weren't always unified. However, they signed treaties collectively with the Romans, founded political leagues operated from a capital city, worked together first in military opposition to Rome and later in multiple uprisings against Rome. In face of this, saying "there was no such thing as Samnites" would seem to me to be rather difficult to support. Even the question of whether they called themselves Samnites likely has no single answer; the political terminology of dominant groups like the Romans has a way of become reified over time, so that what was an artificial imposition in earlier generations becomes the accepted reality of later ones.

(EDIT: It occurs to me that part of the problem here is a confusion over the word "tribe." Whatever they were, the Samnites certainly weren't a "tribe," but that's not especially relevant. Neither were the Romans, after all, nor the Etruscans. The peninsula had plenty of supra-tribal political entities.)[/qoute]


Yes, the "Samnites" did work together for against Rome for long periods, they also went to war with each other for long periods. The issue I was bringing up is that Roman history is often see as the only history. Now, this is often a good thing, rich sources ect. However one must often consider the other versions of history.

The point I was making is that while the Romans referred to the people of Italy as Italians, the people of Italy themselves did not. If you will note my first post, I said "to a lesser extent", because, of course, we do now have Italian people. However it was a very gradual transformation, spanning many centuries.

You are right when you say "Italy didn't exist" is a load of rubbish. Of course it did! It was there, much the same as it is now. A nation of Italy did not exist, but the landmass did.

Many scholars, including myself, put the first unification of an Italian Italy in the early 1800's.

However, I think there is room for you point about dominant political terminology. By the middle of the third century BC there was only one law in Italy and that was Roman law. If the Romans said you were an Italian did that not make it so? Yes and no.

History many now have these, incorrect, catch all names like "Latians" "Samnites" and "Italians" but the Romans also used "Gauls" "Germans" and even "Barbarians". None of these people considered themselves so. Yet that is how, much, of history remembers them. Does that make it right?

 

[zehydra]

The empire AND the city were both called "Rome". When the empire fell, it was just the city left. And actually, the roman empire eventually became A LOT more than just italy.

 

[SultanP]

What is your favorite ancient civilisation, and why?

I think I'll have to go with Athens, considering it was pretty much the crib of democracy. Not a proper democracy, but a beginning... the beginning if I'm not mistaken. Good philosophers too.