"[Ryval] Wants To Gamify Suing People Using Crypto Tokens" - Vice

[Dirty Hipsters]

I mean that's the stock market in general. Bets on how much a stock might be worth at some future date, and its as intangible, obtuse and reeks of money laundering and scams as any crypto or NFT.

The stock market, in its present state is just a scam by the rich to take from everyone else. The hedgefunds win, the retail investors lose. The hedgefunds scam billions by destroying functioning companies, put people out of work and are massively rewarded for it. Hedgefunds illegally short sell stocks that they don't own and the SEC doesn't bother to try to do anything about it, and even when they do they're basically toothless because all they can really do is levy fines and the fines are always less than what the hedges make in profit from their illegal trades.

The government is complicit in this, the banks are complicit in this, and the whole system is propped up because if it collapses the entire economy goes down the drain with it. "Too big to fail" means that these entities are allowed to do whatever they want and get away with it because they're basically keeping the world economy hostage.

Crypto and NFTs are just another get rich quick scam that promises those in the lower classes a chance at being the wealthy if they just get in on the scam early enough and dump enough money into it, but it's really just moving money out of the hands of the middle class into the hands of the rich. Crypto and NFTs are worse though, because in the most critical time to fight against global warming they're doing the opposite and making global warming and energy production into even more of a crisis than it was a decade ago on the promise of free money if you just destroy the planet a little faster.

The faster countries start banning crypto like India and China have done the better. Russia is next, but I really don't have much hope in the US following suit. I suspect more than a few senators have already diversified their investments into crypto and aren't going to be willing to give up those profits.

 

[Agema]

The faster countries start banning crypto like India and China have done the better. Russia is next, but I really don't have much hope in the US following suit. I suspect more than a few senators have already diversified their investments into crypto and aren't going to be willing to give up those profits.

There is also the point made that crypto threatens national currency, and even potentially the ability of the government to levy taxes. Some have theorised that was even the intent. A libertarian's wet dream no doubt - a technological means to force small government.

 

[Silvanus]

I read an article quite recently, somewhere, from a guy who thought the US stock market is a massive bubble: and not just the stock market, but quite a few other parts of the US economy.

Reading that the Nasdaq increased over 50% from end 2019 to end 2020... that seems extreme. One might expect as a basic concept that value increases with productivity - so if the economy grows at 3%, the stock market should grow at a rate somewhat similar. A stock market might of course grow faster, because component companies that make up a particular stock market might grow faster than the general economy, or represent an area with particular growth. One can make the argument re. Nasdaq that Covid may have opened opportunities (e.g. home working) to tech that made it even more valuable.

However, the Dow Jones has gone up nearly 20% in the same two year period; it's doubled since 2017. I don't think we've seen a boom to justify this. Although of course I wonder if covid didn't cause a lot of people (the wealthier end) to increase saving, because lockdowns and general anxiety meant they spent less. I suppose they may well have splurged a lot of that into investment.

(Here's an article, albeit not the one I originally read)

Market ‘Superbubble’ Could Lead To 50% Plunge, Says Grantham

The U.S. is in a "superbubble", similar to the stock markets in 1929 and 2000, and could fall as much as 50%, said Jeremy Grantham, the co-founder of Grantham, Mayo, & van Otterloo, which correctly predicted the popping of the dot.com bubble in 2000 and the Fiscal Crisis of 2008.

www.forbes.com

To quote Yahtzee: "let's all laugh at an industry that never learns anything, tee hee hee".

 

[Cheetodust]

The stock market, in its present state is just a scam by the rich to take from everyone else. The hedgefunds win, the retail investors lose. The hedgefunds scam billions by destroying functioning companies, put people out of work put people out of work and are massively rewarded for it. Hedgefunds illegally short sell stocks that they don't own and the SEC doesn't bother to try to do anything about it, and even when they do they're basically toothless because all they can really do is levy fines and the fines are always less than what the hedges make in profit from their illegal trades.

The government is complicit in this, the banks are complicit in this, and the whole system is propped up because if it collapses the entire economy goes down the drain with it. "Too big to fail" means that these entities are allowed to do whatever they want and get away with it because they're basically keeping the world economy hostage.

Crypto and NFTs are just another get rich quick scam that promises those in the lower classes a chance at being the wealthy if they just get in on the scam early enough and dump enough money into it, but it's really just moving money out of the hands of the middle class into the hands of the rich. Crypto and NFTs are worse though, because in the most critical time to fight against global warming they're doing the opposite and making global warming and energy production into even more of a crisis than it was a decade ago on the promise of free money if you just destroy the planet a little faster.

The faster countries start banning crypto like India and China have done the better. Russia is next, but I really don't have much hope in the US following suit. I suspect more than a few senators have already diversified their investments into crypto and aren't going to be willing to give up those profits.

How we can go through the gamestop fiasco and people still think the stock market is a functional, dependable way to run an economy? You either have to be filthy fucking rich or a goddamned idiot.

A lot of my Instagram algorithm is for some reason finance bro, grind culture bullshit and its all so plainly idiotic I don't understand how people cna fall for it.

 

[Agema]

A lot of my Instagram algorithm is for some reason finance bro, grind culture bullshit and its all so plainly idiotic I don't understand how people cna fall for it.

I'm quite annoyed by all the YouTube ads for tools trying to flog stock trading apps and selling you their "wisdom".

There is plentiful evidence that the best way to play the stock market is to spread your money very evenly across a large basket of major companies. If all those big funds boast they outperform the market, that necessarily means someone is underperforming, and those people are all the general public amateurs being sold the dream that they can make it big. To be fair, a few will. But then some people also win at roulette, too.

 

[Seanchaidh]

There is also the point made that crypto threatens national currency, and even potentially the ability of the government to levy taxes. Some have theorised that was even the intent. A libertarian's wet dream no doubt - a technological means to force small government.

i don't think digital gambling assets threaten national currency in any real sense. they just don't meet the definition of a currency. hapless workers and consumers might be threatened in cases where an economic elite wants to require the use of crypto, though.

 

[Cheetodust]

i don't think digital gambling assets threaten national currency in any real sense. they just don't meet the definition of a currency. hapless workers and consumers might be threatened in cases where an economic elite wants to require the use of crypto, though.

How many people actually care about crypto as a replacement for money anyway? Largely seems to be traded as an investment based on it's dollar value. It's just a somehow less productive version of the stock market because it doesn't even pretend to be tied to anything value producing. It is literally just a meaningless asset that you hope someone will buy off you for more than you paid for it and that you' re not the sucker left holding the bag when everything collapses.

 

[Agema]

‘Huge mess of theft and fraud:’ artists sound alarm as NFT crime proliferates

The digital marketplace for NFTs grew to an estimated $22bn last year but companies face challenges monitoring stolen art

www.theguardian.com

 

[Kwak]

 

[Cheetodust]

I was honestly about to post this. It is fascinating, horrifying and very informative. The concept of forks really stood out to me.

 

[SilentPony]

OH! Crypto is just a way for anti-Semitics to remove "The Jews" from banking and keep their "wealth" "clean". That makes a ton of sense. I get it now, its the equivalent of a fallout shelter stocked with jarred peaches, but instead of nuclear war, they're afraid of
"The Jews"

 

[Seanchaidh]

How many people actually care about crypto as a replacement for money anyway? Largely seems to be traded as an investment based on it's dollar value. It's just a somehow less productive version of the stock market because it doesn't even pretend to be tied to anything value producing. It is literally just a meaningless asset that you hope someone will buy off you for more than you paid for it and that you' re not the sucker left holding the bag when everything collapses.

I'd say that NFTs and crypto are what Karl Marx called 'fictitious capital', but they are barely even or arguably not even that substantial. But 'fictitious capital' does sound like it aptly describes them.

 

[Trunkage]

I'm quite annoyed by all the YouTube ads for tools trying to flog stock trading apps and selling you their "wisdom".

There is plentiful evidence that the best way to play the stock market is to spread your money very evenly across a large basket of major companies. If all those big funds boast they outperform the market, that necessarily means someone is underperforming, and those people are all the general public amateurs being sold the dream that they can make it big. To be fair, a few will. But then some people also win at roulette, too.

The easiest way to make money is to tell OTHER people how to make money. See also: any pyramid scheme

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

There is also the point made that crypto threatens national currency, and even potentially the ability of the government to levy taxes. Some have theorised that was even the intent. A libertarian's wet dream no doubt - a technological means to force small government.

We've already seen that those working in the government don't care about a working government. They're able to shut down the government, stop paying government employees, under-fund government services and so long as they themselves get paid they're completely happy.

Remember, those sitting in the house and senate are usually wealthy enough that their government salary doesn't mean anything to them. They make more money from book deals and speaking engagements, special interest lobbying and their illegal insider trading than they do from actually doing their jobs after all.

 

[Agema]

We've already seen that those working in the government don't care about a working government. They're able to shut down the government, stop paying government employees, under-fund government services and so long as they themselves get paid they're completely happy.

Remember, those sitting in the house and senate are usually wealthy enough that their government salary doesn't mean anything to them. They make more money from book deals and speaking engagements, special interest lobbying and their illegal insider trading than they do from actually doing their jobs after all.

In a way. But governments also generally need to do stuff. The libertarian view of government is to cripple it - outside some core functions such as law/justice and military (/intelligence), it should do almost nothing. However, it's one thing to have a somewhat dysfunctional government that allows them to hand pork (or occasionally real services) to their voters and another to have a stripped down nightwatchman state that in a way colossally devalues them because they have so little influence and control to be worth flattering with lobbying and perks.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

In a way. But governments also generally need to do stuff. The libertarian view of government is to cripple it - outside some core functions such as law/justice and military (/intelligence), it should do almost nothing. However, it's one thing to have a somewhat dysfunctional government that allows them to hand pork (or occasionally real services) to their voters and another to have a stripped down nightwatchman state that in a way colossally devalues them because they have so little influence and control to be worth flattering with lobbying and perks.

You're assuming they think that far ahead.

 

[Gergar12]

I am of the opinion that NFTs suck and most crypto sucks. But that blockchain as a technology is innovative if it uses proof of stake, and becomes more centralized.

Proof of work crypto like Bitcoin is too inefficient.

 

[Worgen]

NFTs are a great way to sell someone something without them actually getting something.

 

[SilentPony]

Brings up some good points, but also pisses me off a little bit. Jim complains about people using their likeness to sell NFTs without their permission. Okay. Good. Great.
Jim sells unlicensed Pokemon merchandise on their webstore. Kinda hard to stand on both those hills Jim. Is taking someone else's content and selling it only bad when Jim doesn't get a cut of the profits? At long last is Jim just a "Fuck you, got mine" capitalist?

Also the fashion. No Jim, bad! No more dressing up like the old secretary from Monsters Inc.!

 

[Worgen]

Brings up some good points, but also pisses me off a little bit. Jim complains about people using their likeness to sell NFTs without their permission. Okay. Good. Great.
Jim sells unlicensed Pokemon merchandise on their webstore. Kinda hard to stand on both those hills Jim. Is taking someone else's content and selling it only bad when Jim doesn't get a cut of the profits? At long last is Jim just a "Fuck you, got mine" capitalist?

Also the fashion. No Jim, bad! No more dressing up like the old secretary from Monsters Inc.!

Ehh, a few stickers and buttons hardly seems like the same thing.