Scientific and mathematical inaccuracies, misconceptions and errors that get under your skin

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TwiZtah

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Vivi22 said:
TwiZtah said:
Is there any other way to change your body mass? If i eat more calories than what I use in a day, I will gain weight, if I eat less, I will lose weight. Are you contradicting this?
Yes, I am absolutely saying that that is, if not totally incorrect, only a very small and not very important part of the process.

Fat storage is largely hormone driven. The hormone that largely drives this process is insulin. Insulin is what signals the muscle tissue to burn glucose, and it will store any excess as fat if glucose is too high for us to burn effectively since high blood glucose is dangerous and we don't burn it very fast.

So what actually happens for most people when they store fat is that they eat something which greatly spikes blood glucose like sugar or wheat, or to a lesser extent, starches, forces the pancreas to produce more insulin. The insulin directs the muscle tissue to burn the glucose, but since it doesn't burn it very quickly, if blood glucose went through a large spike, excess needs to be stored as fat to get it out of the blood stream. Making matters worse, if these glucose spikes happen frequently over long periods of time, the tissues of the body become resistant to insulin, meaning even more needs to be produced to burn any, and more will be stored as fat instead.

If you want to get the body to stop storing fat, you need to remove the foods which cause the fat storage in the first place so that the body isn't constantly storing glucose as fat. Keeping glucose levels managed also let's the body actually tap into those fat stores better when it actually needs the energy.

Moreover, calories in minus calories out is usually bad because when you cut back on calories and increase activity, the body will frequently respond by slowing it's metabolism, meaning that you burn even less than usual. The fact that calories in minus calories out doesn't work bears itself out frequently in clinical studies. There's a reason that any time calories are held constant among test subjects but people on low carb diets invariably lose more weight than people on low fat diets (which are necessarily high in carbs and thereby have a greater impact on blood glucose). And often people in these studies who are put on low carb diets lose more than the calories in minus calories out formula says they would, while the people on higher carb diets frequently fall below predicted weight loss.

If the formula had any real value it wouldn't be vastly different from the actual results a lot of the time, and a lot more people who try to lose weight wouldn't fail miserably following the advice of people who push this idea.

I understand why that formula has become popular: it seems logical and it's based on the common knowledge idea of how people get fat, ie: they eat too much and they're lazy. And I won't say that eating a lot of food won't make it difficult to lose weight. Even protein, despite having less of an impact on glucose than carbs, will have a negative impact on body weight in high enough quantities. And eating too much food too often means the body doesn't need to tap it's stored fat for energy. But for most people, it's not a simple matter of eating too much that causes weight gain. Glucose control is the actual driver of everything. Hell, glucose spikes also heavily drive appetite as anytime someone has a large spike, they'll almost inevitably have their blood sugar crash two hours later when the insulin has done it's job and then they're hungry all over again. That kind of blood sugar crash does not happen if someone eats a diet which keeps glucose levels at steady and reasonable levels.
Nothing contradicts calories in calories out, if I eat 10000 calories and don't do shit, I burn maybe 2000 calories, that's an excess of 8000, that doesn't just magically disappear and WILL be turned into fat. I agree with you about controlling your insulin, but you just cannot throw calories out of the calculation when people eat fourteen double big macs a day with supersize, they WILL get fat, and they will get fat because of the excess calories. The insulin spikes are a driving factor for how the body processes food and is only one process of many.
 

Vivi22

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TwiZtah said:
Nothing contradicts calories in calories out, if I eat 10000 calories and don't do shit, I burn maybe 2000 calories, that's an excess of 8000, that doesn't just magically disappear and WILL be turned into fat. I agree with you about controlling your insulin, but you just cannot throw calories out of the calculation when people eat fourteen double big macs a day with supersize, they WILL get fat, and they will get fat because of the excess calories. The insulin spikes are a driving factor for how the body processes food and is only one process of many.
Go back and read my post. I didn't say calories don't play a role, nor did I say eating excessively doesn't either. But they aren't the single largest driver in fat storage. Nor does the formula accurately predict weight gain or loss which further proves that it isn't driving fat storage. The reality is that for most people, food composition has a much larger impact on weight gain than quantity because the entire process is hormonally driven, and what we eat affects those hormones.

It's entirely possible to gain weight while working out more than the average person would simply by changing food composition and keeping total calories consumed and burned constant. It's also possible to cut calories, exercise more and lose little to no weight. People fail to achieve desired weight loss frequently on calorie restricted diets because they don't change diet composition sufficiently. Arguing for such a simplistic view of a complex biological system when it's proven unreliable at best is silly.

Humans don't burn all of the food we eat. We don't process it all the same way. Treating a calorie as a calorie regardless of the source is flat out stupid.
 

TwiZtah

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Vivi22 said:
TwiZtah said:
Nothing contradicts calories in calories out, if I eat 10000 calories and don't do shit, I burn maybe 2000 calories, that's an excess of 8000, that doesn't just magically disappear and WILL be turned into fat. I agree with you about controlling your insulin, but you just cannot throw calories out of the calculation when people eat fourteen double big macs a day with supersize, they WILL get fat, and they will get fat because of the excess calories. The insulin spikes are a driving factor for how the body processes food and is only one process of many.
Go back and read my post. I didn't say calories don't play a role, nor did I say eating excessively doesn't either. But they aren't the single largest driver in fat storage. Nor does the formula accurately predict weight gain or loss which further proves that it isn't driving fat storage. The reality is that for most people, food composition has a much larger impact on weight gain than quantity because the entire process is hormonally driven, and what we eat affects those hormones.

It's entirely possible to gain weight while working out more than the average person would simply by changing food composition and keeping total calories consumed and burned constant. It's also possible to cut calories, exercise more and lose little to no weight. People fail to achieve desired weight loss frequently on calorie restricted diets because they don't change diet composition sufficiently. Arguing for such a simplistic view of a complex biological system when it's proven unreliable at best is silly.

Humans don't burn all of the food we eat. We don't process it all the same way. Treating a calorie as a calorie regardless of the source is flat out stupid.
Yes, now you're bringing up points. Of course it's important where you get your calories from, sugar is bad, more complex carbs are better. There's a slew of hormones going around doing shit, you lift heavy weights, your metabolism will speed up to promote muscle growth. Doing anything at all will speed up your metabolism. So we can agree that calories in/out isn't the only driving factor, hormones and stuff do alot, but to completely disqualify calories from the debate is silly too.
 

Subscriptism

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MeChaNiZ3D said:
The misconception that the act of turning a lightbulb on or off causes such a spike in energy as to render it more wasteful than leaving it on for intervals of about 10 minutes. It makes genuine environmentally minded people seem like idiots when they suggest it to someone who knows otherwise, and compromises their own principles every other time.

But for the record, centrifugal force exists. In a physics setting, no, I do not think it should be used. But every other time, ffs, people know what it is and what it means.
Mythbusters did this, unless you are going to be back in 0.3 seconds or something it is more efficient to turn it off. (The energy used by the bulb in 0.3 seconds is equivalent to the energy spike when turned on)

Rogue 09 said:
This post reminded me of one that really bugs me.

The belief that blood is blue when it is inside a vein and only becomes red when it touches the oxygen outside of your body drives me batty.

The fact that they try to justify it with you after you stare at them like a moron makes it kinda worse...

"No, see, 'cause if you look at the vein... it's blue!"

Yep... you just used science.
THIS ONE, when I was in high school my friend had a full blown argument with his dumbshit PE teacher about this. She genuinely believed this and was teaching the whole class that this was true. He gave her conclusive evidence and she fucking kicked him out of the class.
 

Boba Frag

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SciMal said:
Boba Frag said:
SciMal said:
11) "Ancient" or natural cures for anything (especially herbal supplements). Yeah, sometimes people stumbled upon stuff. That's how we discovered aspirin. However, our ancestors also drank Mercury and shit on the walls of their buildings.
An entire thread devoted to inaccuracies, broad, sweeping generalisations, myths, misconceptions and general ignorance....

And you post that.

Cue me disregarding an otherwise decent argument.

Drinking Mercury generally precludes people from having descendants, as does poor personal hygiene.
No offense, but you're wrong.

Mercury isn't safe, and can cause sterility, but it's not instantly deadly. Hatters were, in part, driven mad because of chronic Mercury exposure in their craft and helped coin the term "Mad as a Hatter". Chinese women sometimes drank it as an abortifact. This is also assuming that the person didn't start drinking after they had kids.

And poor personal hygiene doesn't prevent you from having kids. It does, however, severely reduce your life expectancy. If it outright resulted in death and the preclusion of the next generation, all of the graffitti we've found in Pompeii where people marked where they shit on the walls was apparently a suicide note.
'No offense, but' is a big red flag for a douchey post, so I nearly didn't respond to that.

Are you completely unaware of irony?

OF COURSE Mercury is poisonous! It's a heavy metal! Even if you don't die, you soon will, of course I know that! Christ.

What I took issue with was your assertion that our ancestors drank it like Coke.
YOU are wrong in that. From your off hand dismissal of 'our ancestors' it seemed like it was time to start fighting back against what I perceived to be a gross misrepresentation of the past.

Your post didn't qualify the above historical examples, which fair play, sound reasonable, though I would like you to post your sources on that.
There's a LOT of graffitti in Pompeii- most of giving valuable insights into the Roman city's underbelly.

Anyway, I've made my point that you misunderstood my post completely, it happens.
 

SciMal

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Boba Frag said:
'No offense, but' is a big red flag for a douchey post, so I nearly didn't respond to that.
Most of the time, yes, but that wasn't one of those times. :) It was just a case of misinformation, and I honestly meant no offense since the issue could be summed up with the introduction of easily verifiable facts.

Are you completely unaware of irony?
The use of words for something other than their literal intention. Now THAT is irony! ;-)

OF COURSE Mercury is poisonous! It's a heavy metal! Even if you don't die, you soon will, of course I know that! Christ.

What I took issue with was your assertion that our ancestors drank it like Coke.
Ah, but I didn't. I implied they took it to cure or treat something, like herbal supplements and homeopathic "medicine" are used today.

From your off hand dismissal of 'our ancestors' it seemed like it was time to start fighting back against what I perceived to be a gross misrepresentation of the past. Your post didn't qualify the above historical examples, which fair play, sound reasonable, though I would like you to post your sources on that.
There's a LOT of graffitti in Pompeii- most of giving valuable insights into the Roman city's underbelly.
Etymology of the phrase "Mad as a Hatter" is easy enough to look up, as is the abortefact use ("quicksilver" was even included in recipes for Chinese "Divine Elixirs": http://www.goldenelixir.com/jindan/texts_taiqing_methods.html ). While there is a lot of graffitti in Pompeii (most of it hilariously similar to modern graffitti), a portion of it is pretty much "I took a dump on this wall" and "Curse anyone who takes a dump on this wall."

Anyway, I've made my point that you misunderstood my post completely, it happens.
Actually, I think you misunderstood my post. As you said though, no worries - it happens. :)
 

Boba Frag

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SciMal said:
Boba Frag said:
'No offense, but' is a big red flag for a douchey post, so I nearly didn't respond to that.
Most of the time, yes, but that wasn't one of those times. :) It was just a case of misinformation, and I honestly meant no offense since the issue could be summed up with the introduction of easily verifiable facts.

Are you completely unaware of irony?
The use of words for something other than their literal intention. Now THAT is irony! ;-)

OF COURSE Mercury is poisonous! It's a heavy metal! Even if you don't die, you soon will, of course I know that! Christ.

What I took issue with was your assertion that our ancestors drank it like Coke.
Ah, but I didn't. I implied they took it to cure or treat something, like herbal supplements and homeopathic "medicine" are used today.

From your off hand dismissal of 'our ancestors' it seemed like it was time to start fighting back against what I perceived to be a gross misrepresentation of the past. Your post didn't qualify the above historical examples, which fair play, sound reasonable, though I would like you to post your sources on that.
There's a LOT of graffitti in Pompeii- most of giving valuable insights into the Roman city's underbelly.
Etymology of the phrase "Mad as a Hatter" is easy enough to look up, as is the abortefact use ("quicksilver" was even included in recipes for Chinese "Divine Elixirs": http://www.goldenelixir.com/jindan/texts_taiqing_methods.html ). While there is a lot of graffitti in Pompeii (most of it hilariously similar to modern graffitti), a portion of it is pretty much "I took a dump on this wall" and "Curse anyone who takes a dump on this wall."

Anyway, I've made my point that you misunderstood my post completely, it happens.
Actually, I think you misunderstood my post. As you said though, no worries - it happens. :)
Well, that was far more fun than I was expecting.
I'm sort of crazy when it comes to history-- hence my less than measured and more than a little grouchy (antibiotics are great!) response.
My apologies.

Referencing Futurama!! Hats off to you. You had me at the bit with the monocle.

Pompeii is fantastic- I wasn't saying that the graffitti wasn't hilariously rude, though most of it certainly is, such the nature of graffitti!
My personal favourite is 'Philibius spado' = Philibius is a eunach!!

I actually chuckled out loud when I saw that you'd flung in a few links. Fair play to you- we must cross swords again! :)
 

Legion

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Shanicus said:
Global Warming is completely man made and IS KILLING THE ENVIRONMENT AND WE ARE ALL HORRIBLE PEOPLE FOR PRODUCING CARBON DIOXIDE AND SUFFOCATING MOTHER EARTH!

Except Global Warming is a natural process that's been going on for millions of years (it's actually a cycle - Ice Age, global warming melts the ice, Earth begins to warm, Earth get's too hot from global warming, Ice caps melt dumping cold water into the Undersea Currents, Earth begins to cooldown, Ice Age, Global warming melts ice, etc, etc...)
YuberNeclord said:
"Human beings only use 10% of their brains."

This one really bugs the crap out of me. I usually hear it said by 'experts' on late night tv who are trying to sell books to expand our memory or unlock our psychic potential or some such rubbish.

Human beings don't only use 10% of our brains, we only use 10% of our brains at any one time. The parts of our brains that are active while we are for instance, reading a book, are inactive or less active when we are listening to someone talk, singing a song, playing jump rope, etc.
These two annoy me greatly.

Oh, and another one:

People who use modern statistics to say X, Y or Z has increased/decreased in the last however many years, despite the fact that there are no accurate statistics to compare them to in the past.

Like how people assume that there more crimes of a particular nature in more recent years where there are countless other things that could contribute to the statistics such as people being more willing to come forward with certain crimes, better technology to record said crimes, higher levels of media to report said crimes, and so on.

Obviously in some cases, it is still possible to be accurate, but I am referring to the cases where there are clearly other factors that could contribute to the current statistics.
 

FEichinger

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I don't have a "favorite" on this topic ... I do however realize those faults quite often when they pop up in television most notably ... A raised eyebrow and a "what the ...?" is my only reaction, though.

Jay444111 said:
You mean this one? :D

Gunnery Chief: [as the character enters the Citadel] This, recruits, is a 20-kilo ferris slug, feel the weight. Every five seconds, the main gun of an everest class dreadnought accelerates one to 1.3% of light-speed. It impacts with the force of a 38-kiloton bomb. That is three times the yield of the city-buster dropped on Hiroshima back on Earth. That means- Sir Issac Newton is the deadliest son-of-a-***** in space. Now! Serviceman Burnside! What is Newton's first law?
Serviceman Burnside: Sir! An object in motion stays in motion, sir!
Gunnery Chief: No credit for partial answers, maggot!
Serviceman Burnside: Sir! Unless acted on by an outside force, sir!
Gunnery Chief: Damn straight! I dare to assume you ignorant jackasses know that space is empty. Once you fire this hunk of metal, it keeps going til it hits something. That can be a ship. Or the planet behind that ship. It might go off into deep space and hit somebody else in ten thousand years. If you pull the trigger on this, you are ruining someones day, somewhere and sometime. That is why you check your targets. That is why you wait for the computer to give you a damn firing solution. That is why, Serviceman Chung, we do not "eyeball it". This is a weapon of mass destruction. You are not a cowboy shooting from the hip!
Serviceman Chung: Sir, yes sir!
Yes indeed, Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a ***** in space!
Also: Captcha "we go forwards" Yes, yes we do.
 

Jonluw

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Shanicus said:
Global Warming is completely man made and IS KILLING THE ENVIRONMENT AND WE ARE ALL HORRIBLE PEOPLE FOR PRODUCING CARBON DIOXIDE AND SUFFOCATING MOTHER EARTH!

Except Global Warming is a natural process that's been going on for millions of years (it's actually a cycle - Ice Age, global warming melts the ice, Earth begins to warm, Earth get's too hot from global warming, Ice caps melt dumping cold water into the Undersea Currents, Earth begins to cooldown, Ice Age, Global warming melts ice, etc, etc...); yes, humans are adding to Global Warming with the bi-product of our industries, but we'll probably only end up making the next Ice Age occur 50ish years quicker then normal (remember, these things are 50,000+ years between one another). Human Contribution to global warming is... piss all, really.
Thought I should mention that the industrial era is the last hundred or so years, not 1000.

Also: You'd probably do good to watch this:

Human contribution to climate change is very much cause for concern.
 

Naeras

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First and foremost I get ticked off by people that don't understand the difference between a theory and a scientific theory. I want to punch them for not being capable of attaining basic middle school knowledge.

Then there's people who don't understand basic numbers, be it statistics or otherwise. Also middle school knowledge that everyone should have. I want to punch them as well.

Also...
RustlessPotato said:
Being a Biomedical sciences student the thing that grinds me the most are insane "diet" claims by nutritionists. Gillian McKeith with her "eat loads of green plants, the chlorophyll in the plants will oxygenate your blood through photosynthesis ".
..I want to punch this lady.
In the face.
Because she's dumb.
 

Johnny Impact

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sonofliber said:
a few points in the last 2, 1st long live the metric system its so easy to use just add or take away 0.
on the other one, really 17 in 4913? i understand if you complain about people not knowing the
1 to 9 tables, or what e and pi means, but really? 17 in 4913? really? i mean really?
A number of people were upset by this one. I can't decide whether to be pleased or disgusted.

Guess what? It's basic long division, bub. Elementary school math. Stuff every child of twelve is expected to understand -- or was expected to understand when I was twelve. Judging by the number of "WTF why do I need to know that math are hard" responses, there has been a rather sharp dropoff in standards.

Also, most people seem to have assumed I meant doing it in your head. I never said you couldn't use pencil and paper if you had to. I can't divide 17 into 4913 in my head (well actually I can, but it takes a minute or two). Yes, I know every cell phone has a calculator function. Are you willing to be totally, embarrassingly helpless if your battery dies?

I don't expect everyone to be civil engineers, but anyone who cannot balance his own checkbook, calculate the fuel efficiency of his car, figure out a 15% tip at a restaurant, or perform other basic math tasks without electronic aid is a person the world doesn't need. Everyone needs a basic grasp of mathematics. Anyone who doesn't have such a grasp upon reaching adulthood should be ashamed of himself. It's equivalent to being illiterate.

I stand by what I said.
 

Ken Sapp

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Apr 1, 2010
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Shinsei-J said:
Dangit2019 said:
higgs boson discovery:

1. Ha! Finally! Science proved/disproved God!
I had to slap so many people over that.

Most of my hates have been said already but I'll say this one again.
"Evolution's a theory"...
I kill people who say this.
Well it is a Theory. The problem is that most people using that argument don't understand the scientific method and what a "Theory" actually is in that context.

They think that a theory is equivalent to an idea as opposed to an observation which has already endured rigorous testing and so far proven to be accurate.
 

Johnny Impact

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triggrhappy94 said:
It's really annoying to hear people say that it's impossible to divide by zero.
It's entirely possible, it just opens up rifts in the space-time--similar to black holes. Some astronomers and scientists hypothesize that many of the universes black holes are the result of alien civilizations mass acceptance of the possibility of division by zero.
You, sir, win the thread.
 

Naeras

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Oh, and I forgot one thing in my last post.

Radiation hysterics. God damn they're annoying.

I know radioactivity is some scary shit after we saw what nuclear physics was capable of in 1945, and the years before that also officially established that it's a bad idea to drink radium. So being careful with radioactive stuff is obviously not a bad idea. However, there's so many misconceptions around this topic that I want to cry.

How bad is the hysteria? Well, let's just say that even the accidents at Chernobyl and Fukushima are blown ridiculously out of proportions in terms of how much damage these accidents caused(especially Fukushima. Chernobyl was definitely pretty bad, but not for the reasons people think). If anyone want me to elaborate on this, tell me, there are some myths that need to be killed.
 

A3sir

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I don't know if it has been said, but the amount of people that don't understand the simple order of operations dumbfounds me.
 

Frission

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May 16, 2011
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For me it's "Climate Change" is just a theory.

They don't even understand what's the scientific method.
 

Frission

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May 16, 2011
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Shanicus said:
Global Warming is completely man made and IS KILLING THE ENVIRONMENT AND WE ARE ALL HORRIBLE PEOPLE FOR PRODUCING CARBON DIOXIDE AND SUFFOCATING MOTHER EARTH!

Except Global Warming is a natural process that's been going on for millions of years (it's actually a cycle - Ice Age, global warming melts the ice, Earth begins to warm, Earth get's too hot from global warming, Ice caps melt dumping cold water into the Undersea Currents, Earth begins to cooldown, Ice Age, Global warming melts ice, etc, etc...); yes, humans are adding to Global Warming with the bi-product of our industries, but we'll probably only end up making the next Ice Age occur 50ish years quicker then normal (remember, these things are 50,000+ years between one another). Human Contribution to global warming is... piss all, really.

Another thing is that 'Humans are killing the world' - no. Even if we did our best (short of burning off the atmosphere - as in ALL OF IT -, Destroying the magnetic field or stopping the planet from spinning/orbiting) to kill the planet, the tough mother-fucker will just bounce back. This is a planet that turns into a giant fucking ice-cube on occasion, people! A little pollution means jack shit to it! IT'S A BIG PLANET, IT CAN HANDLE ITSELF (hell, the biggest worry about Radioactive waste isn't if it'll harm the environment, but how we can label it correctly so that future generations don't think it's filled with liquid gold or angel farts or some bullshit).

There's also another retarded theory I heard about how the tectonic plates were moving... up and down. And not just at the edges either - like literally lifting up and down, the entire plate moving as a single, solid object instead of the uneven 'up/down' sections can occasionally have (I think it's called 'crumpling' or something - kinda how you get hills and mountains in areas without any contact zones). The geologist within me cried a horrible, broken cry after hearing that theory. WHY CAN'T PEOPLE LEARN HOW THE FUCKING EARTH WORKS BEFORE THEY START SAYING SHIT ABOUT IT???? WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY??????????????????
As someone who actually knows about earth sciences and geology, because it's my field the correct term is climate change, and um yes we are having an effect. The amount is debatable, but there is an effect.

I mean have you heard about CFC's? Chlorofluorocarbon's and it's effect on O3?
What about the dangers of irresponsible mining on ground water? Or the longterm consequences of our actions. Here's a good example
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minamata_disease
I think if everyone read about Minamata, they wouldn't be so apathetic about pollutants.

Even if it's a tough planet, we could have detrimental effects on the environment. Besides the worry is not we will completely destroy the lithosphere, hydrosphere or atmosphere, but whether we will completely destroy the biosphere.

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2011/03/age-of-man/kolbert-text
Heck I think we just named the Anthropocene, to talk about our effect on the environment.

Where did you get your geology degree?
EDIT: Unless you're saying the earth will get along without us. In which case you're right, but it's not good for us human beings.
 

Maeta

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Jun 8, 2011
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C. Cain said:
2) The notion that the second law of thermodynamics somehow conflicts with evolution. It only shows that the person stating said argument is misinterpreting both thermodynamics and evolution. They are also unable to define order and entropy properly. I usually point out what happens when you try to mix oil and water and then ask them how the seemingly perceived increase in order is even possible according to their simplistic definitions.
Dave Gorman did something about that in Googlewhack Adventure...

OT: The basic model of the atom and how it looks like a lot of little things orbitting a big thing in a perfectly regular circular arrangement, homeopathy and everything in that, some of the stuff to do with time-travel (then again, that's more in how nobody agrees with how it works in FICTION and dear god I shouldn't have brought it up), a lot of these horseshit diet myths, and anyone who makes basic chemistry mistakes. One dude said to me that I couldn't make salt in the lab, I had to get it from the sea...
Oh, and why the fuck do those laser thingies in movies like laser cannons or whatever travel slower than a bullet, and make noises to go with it?

There are probably many more... Just can't think right now...