Sexuality in gaming, your stance?

[themistermanguy]

IMO, As long as it's not just tasteless teenage pandering such as Giant/Bouncy boobs, oversized asses, or any outfit that's exposing too much, I'm cool with it.

This is sexy:

Spoiler

This is trying too hard:

Spoiler

While I don't hate them, Boobs have honestly, always been my least favorite part of the female body. Legs, hair, and waists FTW!

 

[The Lunatic]

I think if you're trying to get a sexual sensation from video games, you should google the word "Porn".

 

[krazykidd]

You should put the picks in spoiler tags.

OT: i like all those pictures . Look , there is different kind of sexy. You got subtle sexy and blatant sexy. Both are valid and some people like both. And Both is the keyword. Too much of anything is bad, variety is what is necessary. For every Ivy(soul calibur) we need a Mitsuru( persona 3). For every Dante (DMC)we need a Nathan drake ( Uncharted). My stance, i like them all, i just wish we had more sexy plus sized girls in gaming.

 

[Yuuki]

Put all those big pictures in spoiler tags please, it's hard to read what you've written without people staring over my shoulder.

The definition of sexy (even when talking purely about ogling females) varies greatly from person to person, of course Ivy from Soul Calibre and the entire Queen's Blade anime exists purely for fanservice reasons. Neither have any real personality or identity.
There's little point in saying "this is trying too hard" when you know exactly why it exists, why it was created in the first place and who it is aimed at.

I think if you're trying to get a sexual sensation from video games, you should google the word "Porn".

That's a bit narrow-minded isn't it? Imagine if you went out to buy a videogame and the store attendant told you "you don't need games, how about a movie?". There are tons of categories of entertainment, different things to satisfy different people.

 

[Tom_green_day]

I don't care too much about sexuality in games but I think some, especially japanese artstyles, just try waaay too hard and it puts me off.

 

[Caiphus]

If it's immersion breaking or inconsistent, then it can tend to be a bit of a problem. See: Chainmail bikini.

Aside from that, I personally don't have an issue.

Them top two pictures are fine. Those last two are rather silly. So I guess I agree with the OP.

 

[The Lunatic]

I think if you're trying to get a sexual sensation from video games, you should google the word "Porn".

That's a bit narrow-minded isn't it? Imagine if you went out to buy a videogame and the store attendant told you "you don't need games, how about a movie?". There are tons of categories of entertainment, different things to satisfy different people.

That's hilarious.

Anyway.

Movies and games are two different things.

If I was looking for storyline in games, then, yeah, I guess a book would be better.

However, if I'm looking for gameplay and story, then I guess a game is the only option.

Likewise, if you're looking to get your kicks off at poorly portioned women, porn is a better option.

However, if you're looking to get your kicks off to terribly drawn characters, and gameplay, then, well, porn games are a thing.

I just don't really see why it needs to leak into other aspects of gaming.

 

[Shadowstar38]

Sexy is suppose to mean arousing right?

So heroic action poses and acting tsundre is sexy to you? I guess there's a niche for everything but the average male is going to tell you the "bad" examples are sexy. The first examples they'd call physically attractive but sexy would far from their mind.

 

[Muspelheim]

If it's immersion breaking or inconsistent, then it can tend to be a bit of a problem. See: Chainmail bikini.

Aside from that, I personally don't have an issue.

Them top two pictures are fine. Those last two are rather silly. So I guess I agree with the OP.

What Chaiphus said, basically. If chain mail bikinis is what everyone is wearing, man, woman and slugman, it's alright. If armour don't matter equally, it's perfectly fine.

If armour do matter in your setting, it's your job as a designer to bring that across, and let it inform your design decisions.

I am in agreement with the OP, though. The top pictures are just... Better. It's just too easy to undress a figure to achieve sexiness, and it usually just looks silly. Characters in just normal, sensible clothes can be ridiculously hot in their own right.

 

[Yuuki]

I think if you're trying to get a sexual sensation from video games, you should google the word "Porn".

That's a bit narrow-minded isn't it? Imagine if you went out to buy a videogame and the store attendant told you "you don't need games, how about a movie?". There are tons of categories of entertainment, different things to satisfy different people.

That's hilarious.

Anyway.

Movies and games are two different things.

If I was looking for storyline in games, then, yeah, I guess a book would be better.

However, if I'm looking for gameplay and story, then I guess a game is the only option.

Likewise, if you're looking to get your kicks off at poorly portioned women, porn is a better option.

However, if you're looking to get your kicks off to terribly drawn characters, and gameplay, then, well, porn games are a thing.

I just don't really see why it needs to leak into other aspects of gaming.

They're called visual novels (adult-oriented), a hugely popular thing in Japan with a large market. Just another form of entertainment.

To be honest, I find fantasy art/porn vastly more "sexy" than just flat out staring at real naked people fucking (what you're probably referring to as porn). I'm one of those people who feels that a female covered-up in certain kinds of clothing is far more sexy than just a female on her own. And I highly doubt I'm the only person like that

Anyway you're making too many generalizations about what kind of entertainment is to be found where and what people enjoy...there is plenty of middle-ground in everything, especially in people's tastes. For many it's all about the mix/combination.

More importantly, I think we ALL know why certain aspects of gaming tend to "leak" into others. It's because some crazy person tried it in the past and it turned out to be something that worked, something that the majority of consumers didn't mind at all.
I'm pretty sure Cammy from Street Fighter would be wearing very different clothing today if the Street Fighter demographic had openly rejected her design as "omg sexist!". But she was fairly well-received, along with Chun Li. Do I really need to explain why?

 

[The Lunatic]

They're called visual novels (adult-oriented), a hugely popular thing in Japan with a large market. Just another form of entertainment.

To be honest, I find fantasy art/porn vastly more "sexy" than just flat out staring at real naked people fucking (what you're probably referring to as porn). I'm one of those people who feels that a female covered-up in certain kinds of clothing is far more sexy than just a female on her own. And I highly doubt I'm the only person like that

Anyway you're making too many generalizations about what kind of entertainment is to be found where and what people enjoy...there is plenty of middle-ground in everything, especially in people's tastes. For many it's all about the mix/combination.

More importantly, I think we ALL know why certain aspects of gaming tend to "leak" into others. It's because some crazy person tried it in the past and it turned out to be something that worked, something that the majority of consumers didn't mind at all.
I'm pretty sure Cammy from Street Fighter would be wearing very different clothing today if the Street Fighter demographic had rejected her design as "omg sexist, and so impractical!". But she was fairly well-received, along with Chun Li. Do I really need to explain why?

Maybe in your cliques, not so much elsewhere.

Majority of people seem pretty fond of the idea of female characters actually being characters, not fashion models or designed in a way to be "Sexy" or anything like that.

 

[rumdumconundrum]

I dunno. If the fanservice has a purpose, say if it's a barbarian woman wearing furs or something, I'm willing to tolerate it if they handle with it well. (read: Don't constantly shove it in our faces). I mean, if it's used for humor's sake, I don't tend to have an issue with it. See Persona 3's Yukari Takeba, and her reaction to being given a chainmail bikini for armor, for example.

However, when games are basically doing the "Oh, look! BOOBS! BUY OUR GAME!" thing, it makes me more annoyed than aroused.

This was my biggest issue with Scarlet Blade. They couldn't just leave it be. No, they had to constantly have everything be sexualized:
Your character was REQUIRED to be dressed as a cyber-stripper, you had no other options. It served no function other than cheesecake.
The dialogue was just one double entendre after another.
I'm surprised the mounts weren't just giant pairs of breasts that your character hops on like one of those ball hopper toys.

So yeah, I don't tend to like how fanservice is used.

 

[Yuuki]

Maybe in your cliques, not so much elsewhere.

Majority of people seem pretty fond of the idea of female characters actually being characters, not fashion models or designed in a way to be "Sexy" or anything like that.

Not so much elsewhere...you mean like Wikipedia? [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cammy#Reception] Now that's what I call an overwhelmingly positive reception.

But please stop throwing around words like "the majority". There are many majorities, they are known as demographics and markets. It is foolish to talk about the "majority" as of it exists as one entity. Stop generalizing about audiences and their tastes, it's not helping your point.

The fact you haven't even considered that a female character can be both sexy AND well-written at the same time is more proof of narrow-mindedness.

As usual this isn't getting anywhere...like 99.9999% of sexism in gaming threads, surprise surprise.

 

[Caiphus]

Maybe in your cliques, not so much elsewhere.

Majority of people seem pretty fond of the idea of female characters actually being characters, not fashion models or designed in a way to be "Sexy" or anything like that.

I don't usually agree with Yuuki, but what are you actually arguing? That porn has sexuality covered, so it shouldn't possibly be found anywhere else? That doesn't seem like a sound argument.

You're actually being rather rude, to be honest.

And I would imagine the majority of people are perfectly happy with attractive/sexy people in games, or they wouldn't be so ubiquitous.

 

[EternallyBored]

If it's immersion breaking or inconsistent, then it can tend to be a bit of a problem. See: Chainmail bikini.

Aside from that, I personally don't have an issue.

Them top two pictures are fine. Those last two are rather silly. So I guess I agree with the OP.

What Chaiphus said, basically. If chain mail bikinis is what everyone is wearing, man, woman and slugman, it's alright. If armour don't matter equally, it's perfectly fine.

If armour do matter in your setting, it's your job as a designer to bring that across, and let it inform your design decisions.

I am in agreement with the OP, though. The top pictures are just... Better. It's just too easy to undress a figure to achieve sexiness, and it usually just looks silly. Characters in just normal, sensible clothes can be ridiculously hot in their own right.

Yeah, this is where I tend to be as well. Games like Bayonetta, or even the Dead or Alive series I'm fine with because they don't try to make excuses for what they are, they revel in their over the top sexualization.

I'll argue about sex appeal being overused in so many games, but I won't complain too much beyond an exasperated sigh and an eye roll that a specific game is sexualized to the extent that it is, but when the sexualization is bending my suspension of disbelief, it starts to annoy me.

The best example I can think of is the Mass Effect series. You started out the first game with everyone wearing sensible heavy armor that made sense, and provided believable protection from environments without breathable air or hostile conditions. Mass Effect 2 and 3 switched to a good chunk of its female characters apparently running around in belt bras and skintight catsuits with cleavage exposed, even when exposed to hard vacuum, apparently believable sci-fi armor got thrown out the window so we can get cleavage and skin tight ass shots in. I could forgive the game for having characters running around the Normandy dressed like that, this is the game that gave us promiscuous blue stripper space women after all, but having them do it in battle was annoying the hell out of me. When the game got to 3 and did the same thing to Ashley (at least in 2 she was in some good body armor, even if it does have the stupid boob plate that crops up in so many female armor designs) by apparently giving her plastic surgery and borrowing Miranda's wardrobe, that annoyed the hell out of me. I honestly couldn't even tell that the character model was supposed to be the same Ashley from Mass Effect 1 until someone told me. The redesign for her just felt so damn pointless, Shepard is swamped in supermodel supersoldiers making up his/her team, did the consummate professional soldier really need to look like a Miranda rip off just because she was no longer a teammate in the third one.

That's one of the few cases where sexualization actually hurt my enjoyment of a game.

 

[Phrozenflame500]

The 13-year old version of sexy (i.e. BOOBS BOOBS BOOBS ASS ASS BOOBS sex? eww) is bad.

"Adult" sexy is fine as long as it's classy and not too overused.

 

[rumdumconundrum]

I don't see why a female character needs to be sexy in the first place. I mean, I'm not against it as a character trait, but, seriously, we're at like, 80% "Female characters need to be sexy" right now. Bit excessive.

I have to agree with this, sadly. When's the last time we got to have an average looking woman (or even a freakish/ugly one) in a video game? Painwheel, I guess? In fact, why don't we have more games where you can play as a woman in general?

 

[rumdumconundrum]

The best example I can think of is the Mass Effect series. You started out the first game with everyone wearing sensible heavy armor that made sense, and provided believable protection from environments without breathable air or hostile conditions. Mass Effect 2 and 3 switched to a good chunk of its female characters apparently running around in belt bras and skintight catsuits with cleavage exposed, even when exposed to hard vacuum, apparently believable sci-fi armor got thrown out the window so we can get cleavage and skin tight ass shots in. I could forgive the game for having characters running around the Normandy dressed like that, this is the game that gave us promiscuous blue stripper space women after all, but having them do it in battle was annoying the hell out of me. When the game got to 3 and did the same thing to Ashley (at least in 2 she was in some good body armor, even if it does have the stupid boob plate that crops up in so many female armor designs) by apparently giving her plastic surgery and borrowing Miranda's wardrobe, that annoyed the hell out of me. I honestly couldn't even tell that the character model was supposed to be the same Ashley from Mass Effect 1 until someone told me. The redesign for her just felt so damn pointless, Shepard is swamped in supermodel supersoldiers making up his/her team, did the consummate professional soldier really need to look like a Miranda rip off just because she was no longer a teammate in the third one.

That's one of the few cases where sexualization actually hurt my enjoyment of a game.

What, you didn't notice all of the

Spoiler

character development and DIGNITY that Miranda was presented with? All of the work and camera angles Bioware used to make her seem

Spoiler

believable and well rounded?

Yeah, neither did I.

 

[Phrozenflame500]

What, you didn't notice all of the

Spoiler

character development and DIGNITY that Miranda was presented with? All of the work and camera angles Bioware used to make her seem

Spoiler

believable and well rounded?

Perhaps well-rounded, but certainly not believable.

But yeah, Miranda's the perfect example of a character that they slap giant boobs/ass on and then uncomfortably stick them front and center on in every frame.

It wouldn't be so annoying if they made her sexualization a noted part of her character, but it's how they're so passive about it that bugs me.

 

[Yuuki]

I have to agree with this, sadly. When's the last time we got to have an average looking woman (or even a freakish/ugly one) in a video game? Painwheel, I guess? In fact, why don't we have more games where you can play as a woman in general?

Back to basics I guess: because of cold/calculated market trends, historical events, cultural attitudes, market demographics, target consumers, consumer feedback (direct/indirect), state of the AAA industry, the list goes on and on and on.
How many times does this need to be explained? There's no 1 single reason, it's a culmination of many MANY factors.

Uhh, okay, if you think so.

But, you're being kinda dumb if you think surveys within the community reflect the opinion of those outside of it.

I mean, if you took a picture of Cammy to a high-street and asked what the average person shopping thought of her.

I imagine you'd get a lot of people mistaking her for a hooker.

And most companies don't give two shits about people outside their audience. This is exactly my point, people on high-street will see Cammy as a hooker but then those people aren't the ones who are buying/playing Street Fighter. Their opinion about Cammy is irrelevant, because the fighting game community absolutely loves her. That's what matters.
That's why I said there are many majorities, each majority representing it's respective demographic, market or community which is supporting said developers (and inversely whom developers cater to). Not all developers do this mind you, a lot try to branch-out to various demographics and a wider audience. Try to see the big picture.

FYI Cammy is 1 out of 40 SSFIV characters, the overwhelming majority of whom look fine.

And please stop with the "uh if you think so" as if I'm stating my opinions, these aren't opinions. They're facts. I'm yet to state my opinion in this thread lol.