i had a teacher have a blog on how much she hated the students in my class. she almost got fired for giving student names in it.
Should high school students be punished for making an anti-teacher group on facebook?
- Thread starter Ravenseeker
- Start date
Ok, haven't logged in for quite some time but reading this thread I had to jump into the fray. I'm 27 and just started teaching here in Brooklyn NY. What most students don't realize is that teachers actually get in trouble for things very, very easily. I teach eighth literacy and science in a public junior high. Our school population has many, many students with I.E.P's (individual education programs) mainly due to behavioral issues. When I say "behavioral issues" they usually mean "has stabbed someone" "has done jail time" or "has had three abortions by the time she was 12." each of these describes a student on my grade. Most of these students find it to be a type of sport to try and get a teacher in trouble or even fired.
When a complaint is lodged by a student against a teacher many things happen. 1: usually a formal investigation by our administration into what has happened.
2: parents are summoned in. Usually parents come with the attitude of "my child is perfect, your school is obviously the problem." We had a mother called recently because her daughter pulled a knife on someone in the lunchroom. When the dean called the mother to inform her that the girl would be suspended and sent to a renaissance center, the mother reacted with "How dare you do this to my daughter, it obviously was not her fault, I'm going to come up there and take care of you." Mind you, take care of you is not a euphemism, we have had parents in the building assault deans and assistant principals.
3: Even if the complaint is unfounded, a write up is usually put in the teachers file. This effectively impacts how many years the teacher has to work toward job security. A writeup could pretty much erase a years worth of work when it comes to pension or tenure.
As far as when you guys go to administration, the reason principals and AP's tell you things like "there is nothing we can do" is because it is not your business how this teacher get's reprimanded. Do you really think a principal is going to turn to a student and say "oh, ok, I'm going to make sure this teacher gets canned."
As someone who is living check to check and working very, very hard as a teacher, I can realize that yes, there are some teachers who are just plain bad. Happens in every field. Problem is, nine times out of ten, students gun for a teacher because of some personal slight they imagine the teacher has against them. Every day mine and my wife's livelihood hang on a very thin thread that can vanish because a student doesn't like me or thinks I'm too harsh because I raise my voice or give too much homework.
Getting to the topic: these kids should be punished. Court cases have been filed over the same exact types of things happening between peers, so no one should be exempt from that. Oh, and to those who say teachers shouldn't have a facebook account: I much preferred facebook when it first launched and you needed to have a college email address to set up an account. It was initially a networking and dating site for those in college, looking for people of a similar academic bent.
Oh, and TenthRegeneration: Get off the drugs. The only thing worse than someone who thinks he knows everything is someone who talks like a pompous ass.
When a complaint is lodged by a student against a teacher many things happen. 1: usually a formal investigation by our administration into what has happened.
2: parents are summoned in. Usually parents come with the attitude of "my child is perfect, your school is obviously the problem." We had a mother called recently because her daughter pulled a knife on someone in the lunchroom. When the dean called the mother to inform her that the girl would be suspended and sent to a renaissance center, the mother reacted with "How dare you do this to my daughter, it obviously was not her fault, I'm going to come up there and take care of you." Mind you, take care of you is not a euphemism, we have had parents in the building assault deans and assistant principals.
3: Even if the complaint is unfounded, a write up is usually put in the teachers file. This effectively impacts how many years the teacher has to work toward job security. A writeup could pretty much erase a years worth of work when it comes to pension or tenure.
As far as when you guys go to administration, the reason principals and AP's tell you things like "there is nothing we can do" is because it is not your business how this teacher get's reprimanded. Do you really think a principal is going to turn to a student and say "oh, ok, I'm going to make sure this teacher gets canned."
As someone who is living check to check and working very, very hard as a teacher, I can realize that yes, there are some teachers who are just plain bad. Happens in every field. Problem is, nine times out of ten, students gun for a teacher because of some personal slight they imagine the teacher has against them. Every day mine and my wife's livelihood hang on a very thin thread that can vanish because a student doesn't like me or thinks I'm too harsh because I raise my voice or give too much homework.
Getting to the topic: these kids should be punished. Court cases have been filed over the same exact types of things happening between peers, so no one should be exempt from that. Oh, and to those who say teachers shouldn't have a facebook account: I much preferred facebook when it first launched and you needed to have a college email address to set up an account. It was initially a networking and dating site for those in college, looking for people of a similar academic bent.
Oh, and TenthRegeneration: Get off the drugs. The only thing worse than someone who thinks he knows everything is someone who talks like a pompous ass.
Badmouthing a teacher outside of school? Even if its on the internet, there is no way for the school to punish them except maybe claim slander. School rules don't apply here, so its the law the school would have to deal with, and I don't think the school would want to bother with litigation. Besides these kids are protected by the 1st amendment.
If kids can't tell their parents that their teacher is horrible and deserves to be fired, something is terribly wrong with the parent/child relationship. This isn't a topic where a kid gets into trouble for speaking about it. This is about the quality of a child's education; it's pretty important.MaxTheReaper said:
Anyway, I'm preaching to the choir here... hopefully. ;-)
ok nice you can try and use big words, however you are clearly MISinformed, now i am rather informed on the ways of liable and slanderTenthRegeneration said:
however on the subject of emo kids and the fact that they are a whiny bunch of losers, yes i'm rather well informed on that too.
most emo kids are middle to upper middle class children, ie soccer mom type families, which also means they are NOT poor and their parents get them a lot of stuff. as they have plenty of clothes, plenty of toys/gadgets, food on their table and parents that give a damn about them, ie NOT being beat or sexually molested, and being grounded for lipping off or doing something they weren't supposed to doesn't fall under mistreated either.
so when they fall under all those categories, they are a bunch of whiny little pukes that need to grow a pair and frankly shut the bloody hell up.
maybe if they grew up in a house where they had to decide to pay the bills or put food on the table or they got beat on a regular basis and by beat i mean you walk in and say hi and get smacked for just doing that, then they'd have something to actually complain about
as for the group, well as i said it's liable and slander at the the very least. there is no first amendment rights as it is a PRIVATE forum and that's been tested in court several times and they said "no rights being violated as it is private"
also first amendment rights don't extend to liable and slander, i couldn't go and write an article in a newspaper saying how someone from The Escapist staff was doing morally reprehensible things if i didn't have solid proof of that as i could get my ass sued for that. if i stand on the street corner and tell people that i can equally get sued for that, and there is no first amendment in that
They should have went as a group to the faculty and talked to the principal, or gone to the board and talked with them about it like adults to explain their problems.
Instead they acted like whining little kids, and now they're going to be disciplined for it.
Instead they acted like whining little kids, and now they're going to be disciplined for it.
Personally I think people should not draw too much from social networking sites, as mentioned they are mostly used to vent frustration which people can not vent in everyday life. I don't think the kids should have been punished, unless they filed a complaint in real life made from lies.
They have freedom of speech, personally, I think what they did was a stupid idea and it would get nowhere, but the students can say whatever the hell they want.Ravenseeker said:
You're right, most kids do not talk to their parents about things. I, however, actually do talk to my parents, and I'm a teenager. I guess that's because my parents are really cool with pretty much everything, except my grades, they flip out if I get anything lower than an A.MaxTheReaper said:
I really agree with cleverlymadeup. These kids are just a bunch of whiny, ungrateful little bastards. The teacher's reason for giving the students detention is dumb, but the fact that they made an anti group solely for this reason is even more dumb.
I think facebook (oop, didn't capitalize) is a waste of time and effort anyway, sites like that are filled with stupid spoiled whores and kids to naive to realize that the 12 year old just on the other side of town is 40 and horney as hell. Either way, the teacher could legally sue the students for defamation of character, so I don't see why this needs the school board involved when civil law can handle it.
Err just a note. Either they've edited that group in the last while or it was always like that, there's nothing of any real significance. Just a few lines on how they were given detention. Not even the comments have anything especially hateful.
Jeez, if you're going to imply of a hate group dripping with juicy juicy bile, at least deliver! This was waste...got ready to get all righteous and all /sigh.
Anyway, as for anti-person groups in general. No, as long as it's outside school hours and doesn't break any laws. Then no, no punishment.
Jeez, if you're going to imply of a hate group dripping with juicy juicy bile, at least deliver! This was waste...got ready to get all righteous and all /sigh.
Anyway, as for anti-person groups in general. No, as long as it's outside school hours and doesn't break any laws. Then no, no punishment.
Seconded!PumpItUp said:
If there truly was a problem with the teacher, they should have got a petition and brought it to the board of education or something. THAT would have been far more effective.
But, instead, they started a face-book group.
'Dur, I hate science class. It's all about science-y stuff. Let's make a face-book group because I don't like homework and the teacher told me to leave when I was setting things on fire and texting people at the same time. It's an outrage! I'm a victim!'
Seriously, 90% of all highschool kids I've met or heard about make me want to punch them all in the face with an 'ultimate punch' (Kudos to who gets the reference). I know there are some OK ones out there, and I've met a few. They are a breath of fresh air, believe me. To those I say: Stay strong and work hard. You'll be the CEO, the founders, the partners, and the leaders. And then you can laugh at the reunions.
These kids? At best, they are a fine example of why not to drink when pregnant.