Should there be another console generation?

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Beautiful End

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AndyFromMonday said:
No. I believe graphics get in the way of creative freedom. Until there's a significant upgrade in graphics there's absolutely no reason to move on to another generation.
This. To be honest, the one thing I hate about new gen. consoles is that they're trying to be everything: A PC, a TV, a movie player, a mp3, a browser, a microwave, your dad, etc. I mean, yeah, I got a PS3 and yeah, I love online playing but that's it. Other than that, I think it's dumb to pay 600 bucks for a console that plays blu ray movies, could act as a pseudo-PC and plays games, online and offline (I'm talking about the original PS3 price). All I want is to play games! If I wanted a PC, I would buy a laptop for half the price. If I wanted a blu-ray/DVD player, well, I wouldn't buy it; I already have a DVD player. I have a MP3, I have friends and all that. Like I said, yes, those extra features are nice, but I don't wanna pay more for stuff that I don't really need/ ask for. I just want to play my game! So really, do people buy Xboxs and PS3s and Wiis because they can be used to watch movies? Or maybe because you can browse the web? Or because they could pass as a computer? No, you buy it to play games mostly. So just gimme a console that plays games! The rest is just gravy. Most of us are used to them so there's no going back now.

Also, graphics are not as important as a good plot, I'm afraid. If you buy games merely based on how pwetty the game looks, then I'm afraid to say that's not a very powerful reason and you might as well buy coloring books or something. Again, yes, I love how Killzone looks. Yes, I'm a FF fan and I love the realism. And I know that graphics are just as important as the gameplay or music or whatever. But that's not all there is to a game. Look at the Scott Pilgrim game; it went retro and used only 8 bit graphics and music. And yet, that's probably one of the best games I've ever played. So simple, no voice acting, no overcomplicated plot or graphics, challenging but not frustrating or repetitive. So there's that.

But like I said, there's no going back now. I'm just gonna sit and watch as the next gen. consoles turn into PCs or something and they charge us like 1000 bucks for them. At least, I'm hoping that developers realize that not all gamers are as wealthy as they think we are.
 

sylekage

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It's gonna happen either way, but personally I'd like to see what a new system would be like. Would it be an act of God? Or a company killing failure?
 

aeroz

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there is another option, like post-DS gameboys or Atari 5200, that a new console is made and people just stick with the old one. Especially if Microsoft and Sony keep the trend of increasing the cost of their systems with each generation because there is no freakin way I'm shelling out nearly a grand for a console any time soon
 

Dirty Hipsters

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aeroz said:
you are correct, I forgot about draw distance. Mostly as its been awhile since its personally been an issue for me. Doesn't surprise me there are times it still comes up though. As for leasing, you contradict yourself. Leasing them would raise development cost because well, they are leasing them. Leasing complex software is not cheap.
Of course it isn't cheap to lease software, but it is much more cost efficient than spending resources making your own. That's why you see so many developers using the Unreal engine, because it's faster and cheaper to lease and modify it for their game than it is to spend years making their own.
 

Zaik

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If they could swing it some way that prevented increased graphics performance from doubling development costs, I'd be all for it.

That'll never actually happen though.
 

Roxor

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Another generation of consoles like those currently available? No.

I think we should shift towards making the only difference between console and PC gaming being what input device you use. Nothing more. Under the hood, the hardware and OS would be identical.
 

Stavros Dimou

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aeroz said:
This is an idea I've been kicking around after reading a few articles on the escapist. First off I am not talking about console gaming ending, I am talking about the need for new consoles. Already there is talk that things like fidelity are at a peak, games can process hundreds of characters on screen at a time, with massive forking dialogue, and alot of the "improvement" in technical end of console gaming is more to do with developers learning how to better use what they have.

A new generation would mean having to buy new machines on consumer end and on development end the unspoken rule that games must now meet the new standard of higher definition, more things being rendered, more complex games, all of which push development up and making it an increasingly risky endeavor.

Main complaint of many consumers is lack of innovation in their games and the high cost is the main driving reason. Another console generation will just make this issue worse, and entirely possible it will be the killing blow instead of the saving grace.

Yeah today developers have found how to use most of the console's powers,but these powers are limited,and I can see many improvements coming with new consoles.

1)First of all it's graphics.
Yeah graphics aren't the most imporant thing in a game,but play a huge role as bad graphics would cause a worse opinion for any game.
And graphics can get far better than what consoles have now.
The Geomerics video Dexter111 showed is just a piece of what modern technology can give on graphics.
Check this video too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2fS9covXBs
At the first watch you might think it's a real scorpion recorded with with a real camera but it's not, it's graphics that modern hardware can render.
Watch this now:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuR1wBCw_FU
Pay attention to the detail.
The Master of Ceremonies is zooming on the scorpion's skin.
Even from such a close distance,the texture seems good and you don't spot pixels.
Also notice the hair on the scorpions tail,and pay attention to the light that is mirroring on the glass surface.
That was with 2008's pc hardware.
Today,3 years later far better processors and graphics cards have come out.

2)Second is sound
The compositions of music that we listen when we play games might be good quality from an artistic viewpoint,but technically most games have really low-res sound.
Sound as graphics have a way of quality measurement,and not only one but many.
The higher the definition,the more close to the natural sound the digital sound,sounds,which means more like the real natural sound.
The Standard Definition on sound is the definition all audio cds have which is 16bit/44.1Khz which is equal to 320kbps.
The audio files you will find in most games are mp3s from 128 to 192kbps MAX.
A big amount of clarity and "color" is getting lost.
Which means games have less quality sound than standard cds.
While a sound chip that can produce 16bit/44.1khz sound is so cheap it's even in 30$ mp3 players.
At the same time with a good sound card you can have HD sound on your PC with definitions like 24bit/192khz,which is equal to thousands of kbps.
To record SD or HD sound isn't expensive or hard,actually all proffesional recording studios do that,and developers DO record at SD and then they artificially worsen the quality in order to save space on the disc.
New consoles could come using discs with larger space,so we can actually upgrade sound for once.

3)Third is everything else that demands more RAM.
Yeah Crysis 2 can run on consoles,but even if its graphics look good for consoles,there is an important change that happened between Crysis and Crysis 2.
Crysis except graphics had huge levels.
You could walk for more than half an hour to get from one point of a level to the other,and that's without having all the firefights.
Its level design made someone remember Oblivion regarding the expansive large areas it featured.That's why the developers placed lots of vehicles and gave you the "maximum speed" power.
To move around faster.
But levels of Crysis 2 are something like 1/10 of the levels of Crysis and Crysis Warhead.
The reason is that the larger the level,the more RAM is needed,and consoles doesn't have enough RAM.
I was only able to run Crysis at very high when I my pc had 4gb RAM,and that would be with occasional frame rate drops and lag.
Right now because a RAM cartidge I had had a failure I have only 2gbs of Ram.
And guess what ? I can run Crysis 2 at "hardcore" without drops on the frame rate.
Levels had to be shrunk to fit in the 512mb standard of the consoles.
Low RAM limits the amount of content that can be loaded simultaneously making the developers to decide between good graphics or large/complex levels.
A new generation of consoles could wipe out this limitation and allow developers to built large levels with good graphics.
We see that the hardware of modern consoles doesn't only have an impact on graphics,but also level design.
And that's only a single thing that is limited by the small amount of RAM.

After clearing some things that could be improved/solved with a new console generation,I will answer to the not so technical of your arguments.

1)The reason games lack innovation isn't because new tech would limit innovation.
Innovation is limited because developers are afraid to stop being using the same cliches again and again.They just keep their old formulas that they know are succesful and they don't risk new things not because they are expensive,but because nobody tried them before.
After Doom came out and had explosive barrels,all FPSs added them,because Doom was succesful.
After Halo came out and had health regeneration,all shooters added health regeneration,because Halo was succesful.
Developers either lack imagination or courage to materialise their ideas and they end up copying each other.
The creation of the health regeneration or the medkits mechanics weren't that more expensive than other mechanics.
The reason there are very few innovative games,is because developers know that if they will sell the exact same thing they already did before,people will buy it.
Princess Peach is getting kidnapped by Boweser and Mario has to save her for the last 25 years,but people still play Mario games.
Why change something that sells ?
Tech has nothing to do with that.

2)Yeah a new console generation would mean that people will have to pay to get them.
But I don't think that people are unwilling to buy new consoles.
Actually look what is happening with 3ds.
It has the highest all time record of pre-sales.
There is no other new console around and gamers seem to want a new console.
So they all buy Nintendo 3ds,a handheld,even if it cost more than xbox360 or wii and even if its lunch games are bad, because it's something fresh.
Besides the 3ds,most gamers now have 2 or 3 platforms that they play on.
Other have xbox360 and ps3,others xbox360 and PC,and others PC,and Wii.
Never ever the number of gamers with more than 1 platform was so big.
Gamers seem to have much money to spare.
 

aeroz

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ok I see alot of people are countering my point with, "yes so we can have nicer graphics, bigger levels, better whatever" but all those things take money and time, while you can substitute one for the other fact is it makes funding these games more of a risk and investors hate risk.

The more a game costs the less innovation there will be as fewer publishers are willing to risk the new venture. Another console generation will mean even more companies playing it safe, more what has worked and less what might work. This is not good for the industry, its already gotten bloated enough without shoving even more demanding hardware down its throat.