Sigh... Bethesda is trying paid mods again...

[Saelune]

I dont use mods. I dont use microtransactions.

Maybe Bethesda is doing something wrong and will get worse with it, but uh...

We had how many years to not let this all be a thing but everyone did anyways?

Maybe if people didnt let microtransactions be PROFITABLE AS HELL, we wouldnt be here. But nope. People said "its just cosmetics" or some other excuse. And here we are.

If any of you complaining buy a single mod, or microtransaction, then its on you.

It's everybody who has ever touched a video game in their lives problem, it will eventually effect you and it's a problem caused by the people who are least effected by it. The people who know about, care about, and will boycott crap like this aren't the ones responsible for it, it's the people who don't know or don't care they are being screwed over no matter how blatant it is that are responsible for this. The people who don't care about their entertainment will always far far outnumber those who do care, and it's the former that these developers are catering to because they are easy to exploit.

When I say "not my problem" I say that as someone who has been intentionally NOT buying microtransactions. As someone who has ALWAYS condemned them and those who buy into them.

Ive been fighting this fight alot longer than many of the people who now are upset cause it got around to games they play too.

Hell, I havent even bought the new HITMAN game cause how it is cut up, which is a shame cause I really like Hitman.

So as I keep saying.

It would help if people stopped buying into this stuff.

 

[Mcgeezaks]

Paid mods won't work on PC, ever. Though they're bringing it to consoles and they will probably eat it up.

 

[gyrobot_v1legacy]

Sources? I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt, but this is the Internet.

They've been trying to bring it back for a while, but now they've actually implemented it.
http://www.pcgamer.com/the-fallout-4-creation-club-goes-live-with-3-horse-armor/#comment-jump

The idea is a sound one on the surface, mod creators notoriously get stiffed by the community when it comes to asking for donations or compensation for their work, so there is room for a system to come in and charge a fair price for substantial content and have the company working with the fans to encourage more complex and bigger mods.

Bethesda even looks like they are trying to address some some of this by stating that the mods they host will not be offered for free and not interfere with the current free mod making community.

That said, their current rollout of this plan is a clusterfuck, five dollars for reskins and armor mods that have equivalents or the same mod for free on the Nexus is the opposite of their proposal and prices things in a completely ridiculous manner. Given the initial attempt through Steam though, I suppose it's not that surprising.

Ideally, what Bethesda proposed could have worked, a contracting model where mod makers are essentially hired to make mini DLC with a vetting process to make sure mods aren't just being poached from the already existing free community. What we got was apparently a bunch of low effort cosmetic mods that are too expensive and in some cases already exist in free form.

There is no "right" way to do paid mods, the only "right" way is to hire the mod creators as official developers and pay them a full fee for their work as official DLC with all the same caveats. Mods and DLC are completely different things, modders are supposed to do it because the love the work and the game itself, not for money no matter the amount, and any modder who thinks otherwise shouldn't be modding the first place. Any developer who thinks paid mods in any way and any implementation are a good idea should close down their company and voluntarily have themselves committed because they are out of their freaking minds.

That was EA's unofficial policy towards the Sims modding scene. Now unlike other games on EA's library, the sims pioneered modding greed thanks to paysites. Yes, just like the company that would have the notorious rep for ruining everything the modders themselves have massively contributed to the cancer that is paid mods. This hasn't dissuaded free modders but through the sims 2 years it felt like nearly every "quality" content was from a paysite.

But there was a bunch problem for Free Modders, mod theft is a legitimate issue as notorious sites like PandoraSims will bundle up a bunch of mods and then sell it through subscription. Despite that, no legal action was ever taken and Pandora continues to commit mod theft to thsi day. The official response was to close any discussion on paysites and let them be knowing full well they contribute to the sims community and the German Sims community even sides with the paysites.

Eventually, thanks to youtube allowing videos of mod showcases to show how shoddy the content was certain sites like TSR stopped bothering getting people to pay for mods but the damage is done as modders grew disinterested and shifted to Tumblr. This effectively decentralized the modding community to the point that in Sims 4 there is barely any communication about mods and it is a hassle to find good mods with the click of a single button.

Ironically enough, a Creation Club for EA would help repair the bridge as Greed is Good in this case. Nothing motivate modders then being able to have a gathering place for their paid mods (which they already do through Patreon and Tumblr adspace) and personal support from EA themselves.

 

[Smithnikov_v1legacy]

Paid mods, always online DRM for Sonic...

But hey, at least we got those feminists under control, right Gatekeepers?

 

[Jerast]

lmao I love reading posts like this.

I for one couldn't play skyrim without mods, since it's such a dead environment

As someone who installed a ton of mods I fully sympathize with those who don't bother.

They don't really change much. As far as I'm aware there's no Actually Decent Combat mod or Make The Animation Stop Sucking mod.

The only genuinely worthwhile mod I found was the Make The GUI Less Shit mod. Although I'm pretty sure it wasn't called that.

Bruh, there's a lot of decent combat and animation mods.

You can literally mod every single animation to look great with the sole exception of weapon swinging. If you're a mage or ranger though, you can have fantastic looking animations.

I have like 230 mods installed in my skyrim at the moment ranging from weapons, quests, graphics ENB enhancements, quests, dialogue, companions, immersive changes, weather, realism and I cannot even imagine playing vanilla ever again.

 

[Zhukov]

lmao I love reading posts like this.

I for one couldn't play skyrim without mods, since it's such a dead environment

As someone who installed a ton of mods I fully sympathize with those who don't bother.

They don't really change much. As far as I'm aware there's no Actually Decent Combat mod or Make The Animation Stop Sucking mod.

The only genuinely worthwhile mod I found was the Make The GUI Less Shit mod. Although I'm pretty sure it wasn't called that.

Bruh, there's a lot of decent combat and animation mods.

Such as?

Link one of each.

 

[sXeth]

People are super spoiled if they think games like Skyrim and Neverwinter Nights, ya know...that game that is the best DnD simulator still to this day, are lackluster and broken and all that.

And look, Im not gonna say you cant complain they arent better games but...man, what do modders do for the other 95% of games that they CANT mod?

Whatever. I still play Morrowind unmodded.

Neverwinter Nights as a random utility to make your own stuff = Great. It certainly hasn't been surpassed as yet.

Neverwinter Nights Official Content that came with that utility = Terrible garbage. Buggy as hell. Generic. Bad fan fic level writing. First expansion was missing huge chunks and pushed out unfinished to hit deadline. Fan fic level writing even worse on the second expansion, which was so buggy and broken that it didn't even support the DM client, one of the main features of the game.


Back on the original thread. A well-curated shop for mods with logical pricing, that allowed mod makers to get recompense for their time. Its not a terrible thing. I probably would never use it, but I don't think its an issue for someone making quality mods to get some kickback off their time and effort if they choose to opt in.

Bethesda of course, has not met most of this criteria. Lets put aside their earned reputation of releasing broken messes that require the community to fix the base game content itself. There are still multiple problems with their rollout. The most glaring is they keep trying to put this system onto games that already have extensive communities and mods operating for free. So immediately you're jumping into a mess of "Which of the 18,000 variations of the Cyberdemon in Fallout do we legitimize as the paid mod version. There's a vague chance you could actually sort that mess out in a new game, you can't with the existing mod scene.

The secondary concern is quality and pricing and split of the revenue. There are wildly differing levels of skill and effort in mods. Ranging from running a tilt filter over an armor texture to adding new cities with voice acting and questlines. Besides the obvious fact that the former should be like, 10 cents or something, compared to the latter maybe hitting 20 dollars, there's probably no variance in "contracts" between modders. Even though the former is almost entirely Bethesda's work in terms of model/texture, and the latter could conceivably be hundreds or thousands of hours of work on original content that just happens to run on Bethesdas engine.

 

[CaitSeith]

Sources? I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt, but this is the Internet.

They've been trying to bring it back for a while, but now they've actually implemented it.
http://www.pcgamer.com/the-fallout-4-creation-club-goes-live-with-3-horse-armor/#comment-jump

Thanks. I don't hate on paid mods. But only if (and this is a big if) the results are much better than what you can get with free mods. So far, that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

[Baffle]

modders are supposed to do it because the love the work and the game itself, not for money no matter the amount, and any modder who thinks otherwise shouldn't be modding the first place.

Some people say the same about people who draw on commission - mostly people who want their stuff drawn but don't want to pay for it. I don't see the difference.

If modders want to charge for their mods and people are willing to pay for it, more power to them; if they want to release them for free, that's great too. Personally I wouldn't pay for mods, but I rarely mod games.

I'm more bothered by microtransactions as those are things deliberately built into (removed from) the game, not good/creative ideas someone has had after the fact that improves the experience.

 

[TrulyBritish]

*sits over here still pissed off at Bethesda over the whole "we don't want you to be informed customers at launch" deal*
I'd be outraged, but I wasn't going to buy their games anyway.

 

[Zykon TheLich_v1legacy]

Heard some theories that this is Bethesda's attempt to suck some more cash out of the PS4. PS4 won't allow mods, but creation club gets around that and earns Bethesda cash. Not sure how likely that is.

Certainly anyone on PC isn't going to give a flying fuck about the creation club. That said, since the update that put it in I've found a couple of my mods that used to play fine together now conflict, so I've had to turn one off, so despite not using it, it has impacted my game.

I prefer them free for purely selfish reasons, but generally I don't have problem with mod creators getting paid for mods, some of them are really good, Bethesda are just shit at overseeing it.

 

[Tanis]

"company have the skill and intelligence make such excellent video games"

Really?

Don't get me wrong, they make some solid games...but most of their games are made better by the community or by having someone else using their IPs (Fallout New Vegas was LOADS better than FO3).

 

[Chewster]

Ehh. I only have a few basic mods activated and already I've noticed a big drop in the framerate when in the wastes that wasn't there before. If they wanna try and charge people for PS4 mods, all the power to them but I'm not interested in making the game chug even harder.

Hell, the ones I'm using aren't even that fancy. They merely enable shit they should have put in the game to begin with such as making decorative stuff stay where you place it instead of falling through the floor and allowing you to delete dead creatures and the majority of the garbage seen around settlements. Fucking dead brahmin stinking up my house? No thank you.

Anyway, seems kind of counter-intuitive to charge people for mods that makes your buggy game less buggy but what do I know?

 

[Fijiman]

Paid mods won't work on PC, ever. Though they're bringing it to consoles and they will probably eat it up.

Maybe on the PS4 where they don't really have another option, but I highly doubt a lot of Xbox players are getting into this either since we've had mods for a while now as well.

The way they've handled this whole thing so far makes it really seem like the only thing they learned from both the horse armor and first paid mods fiascos was that their name comes up far more in search engines when the do shit like this. The biggest problem I'm seeing is that there isn't nearly enough content currently in the Creation Club, nor is there nearly enough value to what is there to justify the prices. Not helping at all is the fact that for almost every mod in the CC there is at least one free version that is either equal to or superior to Bethesda's version. Then there's the fact that they're trying to sell this small handful of content for a total of roughly $30 and pretend that any single piece of it could compare to anything from the other DLCs you could have bought/already have. Now if there was an interesting quest or two attached to the armors and weapons I could say that these might be worth it, but the only one with any sort of quest is the gauss rifle and the quest for that is literally "go here and kill random dude." It's even lazier that the radial quests that were already in the game. At least when you got the guass rifle in Fallout 3 you had to go through the Anchorage DLC in order to get it as well as other weapons and armor, which actually made it kind of worth it.

I will say that Bethesda has a chance to fix this and actually make it a worthwhile service, but they have to do it fast if they plan on recovering any goodwill from the community at large. Unfortunately, given this is Bethesda we're talking about, I don't see them doing what they need to to fix it nearly soon enough for it to matter in the long run.

 

[spartandude]

Just to make matters worse. If you have Fallout 4 or Skyrim SE installed, you automatically download the creation club as well as the BA2 files of every mod on there (just not the .exe, which is essentially what you buy). This means that as it updates and more stuff gets added you will gradually lose hard drive space.

 

[KoudelkaMorgan]

I made a thread about this but it got deleted with all the spambot crap I guess. My beef was to all the streamers/youtubers that are posting scathing reviews of it, yet feel the need to buy all the mods to show us why they are bad. A weird number of people are actually buying literally all the mods in the cc and then telling us why the cc is terrible.

I just want to scream "stop giving them money for things you know are garbage!" You aren't doing anyone a favor by handing them your money regardless of whether or not you approve of the Creation Club in its current state. And if you do approve, then you are part of the problem.

 

[gyrobot_v1legacy]

You pay, you have a say.

You dont pay, go away.

That is the only way you can have a balid opinion or just be another whining voice in the peanut gallery

 

[Jerast]

lmao I love reading posts like this.

I for one couldn't play skyrim without mods, since it's such a dead environment

As someone who installed a ton of mods I fully sympathize with those who don't bother.

They don't really change much. As far as I'm aware there's no Actually Decent Combat mod or Make The Animation Stop Sucking mod.

The only genuinely worthwhile mod I found was the Make The GUI Less Shit mod. Although I'm pretty sure it wasn't called that.

Bruh, there's a lot of decent combat and animation mods.

Such as?

Link one of each.

https://imgur.com/a/VuKuj

Those are animations i'm using for a single spellsword playthrough. For one character. Took ten minutes to set up using the most easybabymode mod manager in existence. I can cast magic through my sword with caster animations, and dodge mid combat and block with things in both my hands. I can also use sexy (by choice) movement and striking options, or I could have picked any lore friendly non sexy versions to change the ways my character moves, poses, sits, crouches, sneaks, runs, walks. My character doesn't lumber around or swing their fists like a bear, they use full on karate animations with jump kicks and spins.

For combat, despite the way several animation mods change combat completely (TK Dodge, Spellsword, etc) I thought I'd address ones that change the way combat works in its own way.

Duel, combat realism which used to suck but is now great, and can be found via a lazy google search

There is also ultimate combat which is decent

http://skyrimshot.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-51.html <-- ultimate combat

There's a couple others, but those two are the main ones that matter, to me anyway.

Not to mention the literal dozens of perk modifying mods that can completely change or add combat disciplines into the game.

This isn't even to mention the way a mod can make horses actually useful and worth a damn in combat and otherwise.