Skyrim: Dark Brotherhood thoughts

[odanhammer]

Skyrim has been a rare gem in a game where i wish everything lasted longer. The main story was way better then oblivion , but was too short to really get into it. The dark brotherhood story depressed me , since i loved oblivions dark brotherhood quests.
Same with the thieves guild quests , kinda meh.
Companions quest is alright.

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

I'll guess that I'm the only one who took the 'Destroy the Dark Brotherhood!' quest instead of joining them?

That'll teach them to send 14 Assassins after me. I don't even know what I did to get the Black Sacrament preformed! I was RPing a completely pure goody goody two shoes Nord.

I had an evil character who I played for 12 hours before joining the Dark Brotherhood. Never had an assassin. I play a good character for four hours, boom, an assassin. Maybe only bad characters or thugs hire the Dark Brotherhood?

 

[Ruwrak]

I'll guess that I'm the only one who took the 'Destroy the Dark Brotherhood!' quest instead of joining them?

That'll teach them to send 14 Assassins after me. I don't even know what I did to get the Black Sacrament preformed! I was RPing a completely pure goody goody two shoes Nord.

I had an evil character who I played for 12 hours before joining the Dark Brotherhood. Never had an assassin. I play a good character for four hours, boom, an assassin. Maybe only bad characters or thugs hire the Dark Brotherhood?

Of course. Good guys would only try to talk to you right up to the point you pickpocket them prior to sticking your sharp things in them.

Ah, but with the rise of the Aldmeri Dominion I would expect a rise in the power of the Morag Tong. The Tong and the Brotherhood have been at war since the Brotherhood's founding, and I strongly suspect the Dunmer Morag Tong would have found a great deal of power and advantage in the new Elven superpower that is the Dominion. Chances are that the underground war between the Tong and the Brotherhood came very briefly and bloodily to the surface and the Tong, with the aid of the Thalmor, drove the Brotherhood out of Elven lands, leading to a sharp decline in the Brotherhood's power.

At a wild guess. No doubt Bethesda will prove me wrong!

I have been wondering about this indeed. Where the F did the Morag Tong go? I want my 'letters of excuse' back.. You know? The contract that said I could not be arrested for killing the person stated in the contract? That was awesome..

 

[SonicWaffle]

I'll guess that I'm the only one who took the 'Destroy the Dark Brotherhood!' quest instead of joining them?

That'll teach them to send 14 Assassins after me. I don't even know what I did to get the Black Sacrament preformed! I was RPing a completely pure goody goody two shoes Nord.

I had an evil character who I played for 12 hours before joining the Dark Brotherhood. Never had an assassin. I play a good character for four hours, boom, an assassin. Maybe only bad characters or thugs hire the Dark Brotherhood?

Good guys hire thugs, it seems. My first character was, not to put too fine a point on it, a thieving ****. I wasn't caught, but apparently some people can figure out who stole their stuff as it didn't take long for a character or two to hire thugs to rough me up - "you don't have to kill him, just teach him a lesson", as the note said. I killed them pretty quickly though, and didn't get anymore after that.

 

[megaraccoon]

The assassinations didn't have anything on the Oblivion ones, although I found the story itself plenty enjoyable (although I still preferred Oblivion's).

But yeah, there's certainly nothing as good as the hit in the manor house in Skingrad.

so true, i loved that mission, chatting up all the guests then getting them to seperate before i picked them off..i felt like a big spider playing with flies before i ate them

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

I'll guess that I'm the only one who took the 'Destroy the Dark Brotherhood!' quest instead of joining them?

That'll teach them to send 14 Assassins after me. I don't even know what I did to get the Black Sacrament preformed! I was RPing a completely pure goody goody two shoes Nord.

I had an evil character who I played for 12 hours before joining the Dark Brotherhood. Never had an assassin. I play a good character for four hours, boom, an assassin. Maybe only bad characters or thugs hire the Dark Brotherhood?

Good guys hire thugs, it seems. My first character was, not to put too fine a point on it, a thieving ****. I wasn't caught, but apparently some people can figure out who stole their stuff as it didn't take long for a character or two to hire thugs to rough me up - "you don't have to kill him, just teach him a lesson", as the note said. I killed them pretty quickly though, and didn't get anymore after that.

Yeah, I had my only run in with thugs while I was scouting a house for an assassination. Being a squishy rogue with no opportunity to sneak, they nearly kicked my ass. Haven't had them since. Protip: don't pickpocket priests of Stendarr. Looking back at who they worship, I should have figured that out myself.

 

[SonicWaffle]

Ah, but with the rise of the Aldmeri Dominion I would expect a rise in the power of the Morag Tong. The Tong and the Brotherhood have been at war since the Brotherhood's founding, and I strongly suspect the Dunmer Morag Tong would have found a great deal of power and advantage in the new Elven superpower that is the Dominion. Chances are that the underground war between the Tong and the Brotherhood came very briefly and bloodily to the surface and the Tong, with the aid of the Thalmor, drove the Brotherhood out of Elven lands, leading to a sharp decline in the Brotherhood's power.

At a wild guess. No doubt Bethesda will prove me wrong!

Sir, you have out-lored me! I salute you. I would wonder, though, if that were the case why the Thalmor wouldn't have rooted out the Brotherhood in Skyrim? I mean, they're hardly inconspicuous in their methods...

 

[kuolonen]

Frankly DB in Skyrim was rather disappointing. I mean the characters were nicely rounded and all but heck, am I the only of who saw it coming?

Spoiler

the destruction of the original brotherhood ? lets see ridiculously awesome remorseless assassins with thirst for blood? Yup bethesda is gonna drop a mountain on these guys. Just like in Oblivion. Real creative big B.

Also another thing I saw miles away:

Spoiler

Astrids betrayal. I mean seriously listen to her talk after about half way through the quests. Its so painfully obvious shes itching to knife you in the back. Thank god it wasnt "thou must" quest to kill Cicero for her. And quite frankly, the part where Astrid begs for you to kill her... really? "You must kill me, please" and the scene is setup so, that I'm supposed to feel remorseful about having to off her. Really? I fricking laughed as i electrocuted the treacherous *****.

 

[SonicWaffle]

That "nothing happens after" effect is a problem that's plagued the Elder Scrolls games for a long time now. It doesn't seem right that bandits--and for that matter, townsfolk if you commit a crime--jump straight into battle with you even though you're the Arena grand champion and the leader of the Fighter's Guild, or that no effects are felt if you murder Bravil's count.

In a particularly egregious (take a shot!) example of this, I killed my first dragon and became Thane of Whiterun before joining the Companions. As such, the first mission was painful - "You look like a weakling! Here, new blood, take my sword to be sharpened! Perhaps you'll survive a week if you're lucky. Now go do more errands! Kill a bandit, if you think you're tough enough!" and so on.

I was practically screaming at the screen; "I'm your fucking Thane, you arrogant ill-informed prick! I just killed a dragon right outside the city. A fucking giant dragon and you're talking to me like I'm some sort of mentally handicapped horse! What've you done lately, you smug ****? Eh? That's right! I killed a fucking dragon, worship me as your god, peasant!"

 

[Ickorus]

I don't particularly like the Skyrim Dark Brotherhood, the members all seem like dicks.

In Oblivion I felt pretty bad when I was forced to purge the sanctuary and I really didn't want to do it but i'd wipe the Skyrim bunch out in a heartbeat if I was given the chance.

I actually have plans to wipe them out on my main character, they've sent about 20 assassins after me so far.

 

[SonicWaffle]

Yeah, I had my only run in with thugs while I was scouting a house for an assassination. Being a squishy rogue with no opportunity to sneak, they nearly kicked my ass. Haven't had them since. Protip: don't pickpocket priests of Stendarr. Looking back at who they worship, I should have figured that out myself.

It doesn't seem to matter who you steal from or how badass they are. My first thug visit was sponsored by Elgrim, the old dude who runs the potion shop in Riften! The second was the court wizard from Whiterun, whatever his name was. In both cases, I went back and stole everything that wasn't nailed down as vengeance. Then I stole the damn nails too!

 

[SonicWaffle]

Id estimate a good 30-20 years since their listener died? Im fairly certain it was just before the White Gold Concordat when the Empire was warring with the Thalmor. Astrids been in power for a long time.

The Brotherhood has clearly been in decline for a lot longer than that, though. The Five Tenets fell out of use before Astrid's time, I'm pretty sure, given how she seems to view them. She even says that she thought the Night Mother speaking to a Listener was a rumour, so maybe there hasn't even been a Listener in her whole lifetime.

I think i also keep failing to remember that Astrid is balls to the walls crazy just like everyone else, she mentions in one of the first conversations she has with you that she discovered her love of murder at a young age, maybe this generation of assassins are a bit crazier than previous ones because they have no god to guide them on their path? Perhaps it was Sithis's influence that allowed the Brotherhood to be seen as separate from other assassins

If I'm thinking of the right character, she killed her first man for sexually abusing her as a child and found out she enjoyed it. Enjoyed the murder, that is, not the rape! That's a whole new level of fucked up. Perhaps the loss of the Tenets and the guiding principles allowed for more unbridled behaviour, which gradually became the brutality of Astrid's group. They're crazier because they can be - there are no rules holding them back, and the recruitment process clearly targets the naturally violent, as evidenced by your own recruitment. As the old-school assassins died off, the new breed took over, and selected people who were more like themselves.

 

[SonicWaffle]

The assassinations didn't have anything on the Oblivion ones, although I found the story itself plenty enjoyable (although I still preferred Oblivion's).

But yeah, there's certainly nothing as good as the hit in the manor house in Skingrad.

so true, i loved that mission, chatting up all the guests then getting them to seperate before i picked them off..i felt like a big spider playing with flies before i ate them

I fucked it up :-(

Someone walked in on me murdering the first one, started shouting, I panicked and stabbed them all to death before sheepishly walking off past the guard who called me a maniac or something. I always regretted not taking my time to play the mission properly.

 

[The_Blue_Rider]

Id estimate a good 30-20 years since their listener died? Im fairly certain it was just before the White Gold Concordat when the Empire was warring with the Thalmor. Astrids been in power for a long time.

The Brotherhood has clearly been in decline for a lot longer than that, though. The Five Tenets fell out of use before Astrid's time, I'm pretty sure, given how she seems to view them. She even says that she thought the Night Mother speaking to a Listener was a rumour, so maybe there hasn't even been a Listener in her whole lifetime.

I think i also keep failing to remember that Astrid is balls to the walls crazy just like everyone else, she mentions in one of the first conversations she has with you that she discovered her love of murder at a young age, maybe this generation of assassins are a bit crazier than previous ones because they have no god to guide them on their path? Perhaps it was Sithis's influence that allowed the Brotherhood to be seen as separate from other assassins

If I'm thinking of the right character, she killed her first man for sexually abusing her as a child and found out she enjoyed it. Enjoyed the murder, that is, not the rape! That's a whole new level of fucked up. Perhaps the loss of the Tenets and the guiding principles allowed for more unbridled behaviour, which gradually became the brutality of Astrid's group. They're crazier because they can be - there are no rules holding them back, and the recruitment process clearly targets the naturally violent, as evidenced by your own recruitment. As the old-school assassins died off, the new breed took over, and selected people who were more like themselves.

Pretty sure it was her uncle wasnt it? And i think Astrid is probably older than she looks, possibly about Delphines age (Mid 50's) You're probably right though, it sounds like the tenets havent been in play for a while, and if there was a listener he/she wouldve enforced them

 

[Humza Ahmad]

They were okay but, not the most memorable quests of the game.

 

[Dizeazedkiller]

I thought the entire plot was interesting but it was too damn short I kinda wish that (Big spoiler ahead)

Spoiler

we got to know the members better before the empire killed most of them. I mean really it was just

Babette- Vampire loli, who happens to make potions
The sarcastic redguard who trains you light armour
The werewolf who i thought was pretty badass but didnt get enough screen time
Astrid, who didnt like the old brotherhood ways one bit
The Argonian who I absolutely loved but once again, didnt get enough characterisation
The crazy mage
The dark elf
And that spider thing

It was a little dissapointing , especially since they were all so delightfully twisted

having all that happen was frustrating as hell. But i juts wasn't drawn into it as much as in Oblivion.

Although i was overjoyed when

Spoiler

i got to kill cicero, that guy was infruriating and unbelievably annoying.

Spoiler

I hated him to but did you notice the HUGE improvement in his voice acting towards his murder? I mean, before that whoever it was doing the voice was doing a REALLY bad job but near the end i sorta felt sorry to see him go, because just before he died was the best voice acting i've heard in an elder scrolls game.

OT: The basic structure of the Oblivion storyline was there, they just made it boring with how you got to assasinate people.

Spoiler

Not to mention how i wanted to murder the hell out of the night mother towars the end when she started giving me infinite quests. I wish that they' found a way to end the storyline so you could move on, like maybe make you a recruiter so that when yoru out and about if you notice anyone you want to recruit you just point them in the right direction, but you pretty much have no obligation to go back to the brotherhood base anymore. Also hated it how the vampire girl wouldn't make me a vampire, imo would have been much creepier that instead of just putting on a "sinister" voice she had the personality of a serial killing cougar whore. Making someone that looks like a child seem so adult in as many ways as possible would make her way more badass. Would have been good 2 if that when you were going to save the dark bortherhood how long you took to get there could change who you could sve. Like say a certain time limit before the imperials attack, and also maybe a system where beforehand you could do quests for everyone, but the people you did the most quests for were the most likely to survive. Kinda pissed me off how there were only 2 people left afterwards and i was stuck with pokerfaced recruits with no personality.

 

[Grouchy Imp_v1legacy]

Ah, but with the rise of the Aldmeri Dominion I would expect a rise in the power of the Morag Tong. The Tong and the Brotherhood have been at war since the Brotherhood's founding, and I strongly suspect the Dunmer Morag Tong would have found a great deal of power and advantage in the new Elven superpower that is the Dominion. Chances are that the underground war between the Tong and the Brotherhood came very briefly and bloodily to the surface and the Tong, with the aid of the Thalmor, drove the Brotherhood out of Elven lands, leading to a sharp decline in the Brotherhood's power.

At a wild guess. No doubt Bethesda will prove me wrong!

Sir, you have out-lored me! I salute you. I would wonder, though, if that were the case why the Thalmor wouldn't have rooted out the Brotherhood in Skyrim? I mean, they're hardly inconspicuous in their methods...

It's just a guess, but if there was a conflict with the Morag Tong maybe the Skyrim chapter survived precisely because it was just a small backwater populated by undisciplined slashers. Perhaps it was deemed not worthy of the effort. Or maybe the heavily Dunmer based Tong had trouble operating in Skyrim, with so much bad blood between Nords and Dunmer. It's even possible that the Tong tried to wipe out the Skyrim chapter at Dawnstar, and the Falkreath safehouse was set up by those of the Brotherhood that managed to escape the massacre?

This is all total speculation, you understand.

 

[SonicWaffle]

This is all total speculation, you understand.

Which I enjoy! I do have something of a pet theory, in that what happened to the Brotherhood was similar to the plight of the Thieves. Due to their behaviour (abandoning the Tenets, moving away from the traditional heriachy, etc etc) their patron deities (Sithis and the Night Mother, though I'm still not 100% on either of their official classifications) withdrew favour the same way Nocturnal did after the theft of the Skeleton Key. Without the subtle influence of their patron, the Dark Brotherhood dwindled in the same way the Thieves Guild did, eventually to the point where practically nothing remained.

This could all turn around thanks to the Dovahkiin, or it could not. Be interesting to find out!