Skyrim on PC, disable Xbox controller get a significant performance boost + easier menu navigation

-AC80-

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credit: reddit r/skyrim [http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrim/comments/manrs/pc_make_sure_you_disable_thexbox_360_controller/]
as it says in the title, for those who are playing it on PC make sure to turn xbox 360 controller off and menu navigation will be easier (visually the same), as the cursor will be more accurate and the performance will increase dramatically. I was getting about 40 fps on medium/high now im getting 60fps on ultra+

this is just news and making sure more people can get more out of their game and im taking no credit for discovering it.
 

Atmos Duality

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That is some seriously sloppy-as-shit programming if a controller option was causing framerate drops that significant.
 

-AC80-

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Atmos Duality said:
That is some seriously sloppy-as-shit programming if a controller option was causing framerate drops that significant.
It is unbelievably odd, I just read the thread jumped into my skyrim options clicked custom and cranked everything to maximum and I was getting a stable and bearable fps and i pretty much cried by how much better it got. Whoever programmable that feature needs to be banned from coding.
 

Atmos Duality

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-AC80- said:
It is unbelievably odd, I just read the thread jumped into my skyrim options clicked custom and cranked everything to maximum and I was getting a stable and bearable fps and i pretty much cried by how much better it got. Whoever programmable that feature needs to be banned from coding.
I'm just going to guess at what moon-logic lead to the coding that caused that performance hit.
Perhaps they intended to slow the menu down for a controller, which lacks the operating speed and precision of a mouse cursor. But instead of slowing it down via menu scaling/ticks, they just said "fuck it, lets slow EVERYTHING down just to be sure" by lazily reprogramming it in the menu's video renderer (instead of its handler, ie, the actual menu coding).

I honestly can't think of anything else.
 

Buizel91

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Aug 25, 2008
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It's always something so simple...

It's like Playing Starwars Galactic Battlegrounds/Age of Empires 2 on a Windows 7 PC...there will be a very strange colour issue...Right click on the desktop, Open the screen resolution tab, Open the game while keeping the SRT in the background, and the colour is fine.

Although this was a major problem, but still, it's always the simplest things that sort these things out.
 

Tharwen

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May 7, 2009
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Thanks, now I can run at a framerate worthy of my brand new GeForce 560 Ti!

But srsly, how did they manage that?
 

hazabaza1

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Nov 26, 2008
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I did that as soon as I started playing. I was wondering why people were complaining about terrible menu controls and bad framerate.
It all makes sense now.
 

Jazoni89

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Oh my fucking god...

It worked!

Thank you so, so much, words can't describe how much this has helped me.

I can now actually play Skyrim, at long last, without using all the time tinkering with the settings.

I can't believe something so simple could be the cause of all of these lag problems.
 

Aircross

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Atmos Duality said:
That is some seriously sloppy-as-shit programming if a controller option was causing framerate drops that significant.
That's because Skyrim was initially developed on the Xbox 360 before being ported to PC.

Good job Bethesda, hopefully this will teach you a lesson.
 

NickCaligo42

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Atmos Duality said:
I'm just going to guess at what moon-logic lead to the coding that caused that performance hit.
Perhaps they intended to slow the menu down for a controller, which lacks the operating speed and precision of a mouse cursor. But instead of slowing it down via menu scaling/ticks, they just said "fuck it, lets slow EVERYTHING down just to be sure" by lazily reprogramming it in the menu's video renderer (instead of its handler, ie, the actual menu coding).

I honestly can't think of anything else.
One word: Scaleform.

In modern gaming engines, the menu systems and HUDs are often coded in Flash, then overlaid on top of the ingame graphics by means of a piece of middlewhere called Scaleform.

It's wonderful for game pipelines because it means you have a huge pool of graphic designers, UI programmers, web designers, et cetera who are already familiar with flash and can use their visual talents and flash's customary vector graphics to make squeaky clean, visually appealing, super-nice menus.

On the other hand, the shit you have to do to actually get the Flash UI to talk to the ingame systems is a little bit crazy. In older systems, the engine has its own script for making menus, and it's one big script to make the visuals happen and get the interaction working. Here, it's an entire separate object essentially operating outside the game. You literally have scripts whose only purpose is to act as a middleman between the game and the UI, which can lead to awkward disconnects.

You also have to tell Flash how to interpret the gamepad. Because it doesn't know.

The game engine itself knows, but where Flash can directly take mouse and keyboard, it actually has to receive gamepad data from the engine first, then have it interpreted into something it can actually use to navigate menus. Thus, when you have the Xbox 360 controller setting on, there's a whole extra stream of data and set of calculations being performed every single frame that the menu operates just to make sure the damn thing works.

This is in addition to the fact that Flash is ungodly slow to begin with. Especially most forms of Scaleform pre-2011, which run on Flash Actionscript 2 (hundreds of times slower than the engine) as opposed to Actionscript 3 (dozens of times slower).

And, probably, there were priority issues when you had both the 360 controller and the mouse and keyboard in at the same time, and somebody... over-thought the thing and engineered in two modes, one of which assigns priority to the 360 controller and the bold-faced options in menus and the other of which assigns priority to the mouse clicks over that. Those extra modes were probably costly, and they probably couldn't think of a way of determining this automatically. Me, I'd have just taken a good look at what kind of input is coming in when the user hits "new game" and had the game check or un-check it based on that, but whatever.

That, I believe, is your explanation.
 

Smooth Operator

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Wow that actually works brilliantly, I did wonder why this runs at about half the speed of Crysis and looks twice as bad.

Doesn't fix the broken menu controls tho, just transitions smoother.
 

thethingthatlurks

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This...this changes everything! No longer will I accidentally ask random NPC du jour the same stupid question fifty times in a row, even though the cursor was clearly on an entirely different field. Sloppy, Bethesda, sloppy...