So, death penalty

[Biosophilogical]

if cost is an issue I gladly volunteer.... just call me at home and I'll rush over and put 2 in the back of their skull free of charge... I got free time

You'd gladly volunteer to kill someone?

Kind of scary, dude.

[sub]Hypocritical too...[/sub]

how is it hypocritical? I've done nothing but support it and never said I had a problem with killing... in fact I defended it... I even included that I have served and already done it so I know it doesn't bother me in the least when it is needed.. I have no moral or ethical problems with killing but I know others do.. people kill people and a lot of the time it is a good if not the best or only realistic option

It would be a public service no different than when I was in the service

gladly volunteer =/= lol i wanna kills people... it's simply me having no problem with doing a distasteful job that I know most others don't want to do

I'm just going to point out that these views that you are spouting is not exactly endearing me to the American armed services. It's one thing to be a in a combat zone where you cannot realistically imprison every enemy soldier you find, and so are required to kill them (in defence of yourself, your fellow troops and your country), and an entirely different matter when the criminal is in a court room, and it is about calmly deciding which judgement to pass (in a combat zone, I'd imagine capturing every enemy you see would be the significantly more dangerous option, but when they are already disarmed, standing in front of you/the court, and you have the perfectly viable option of imprisoning them for the rest of their lives, then to say that you should kill them then (or sentence them to death) is just barbaric).

What I would like to know is if you feel this way as a result of being in the service, or if you felt that way before joining/seeing combat. On the one hand, I sincerely hope it isn't the former, as that would be upsetting, but on the other hand, I hope it isn't the latter, because it would be a shame if the very system designed to protect a country is fuelled by people with a disposition towards justifying murder.

OT: I am against the death penalty.

 

[Dan Steele]

I am against the death penalty, that video pretty much explains why. If we kill an inmate, then we are no better than the murderer

 

[JokerboyJordan]

If we were all touchy-feely people like you we would have never become the dominant species on earth... so this conversation point would be moot (not mute).

Life killing life (What are you, five? Just say killing) is natural... some humans can argue that point because they get to live in a safe little bubble that allows the comfort... and that bubble exists because people like me are willing to kill to keep it there

Just because humans are at the top of the food chain doesn't mean our fight for survival is over... the target just changes... but again, people like you get to live free of having to fight yourself because others do it for you... and most are wholly ungrateful hypocrites about it.


Apparently you are unfamiliar with the fact that morals and ethics are all opinions... you also seem to be unfamiliar with reality thanks to the comfy bubble you live in which was paid for in others' blood.

Hey maybe one day we will all live in this fantasy candy land where everyone loves one another like you seem to think you are already in, and killing will never be necessary. I doubt it, but hey you keep dreaming.

And if we never developed levels of intelligence we would never be where we are today. What's your point? We're talking about people killing people, not survival of the fittest.

Killing is natural? If you're talking in terms of 'survival of the fittest' again then yes, it is natural, as it is in the whole animal kingdom for survival , not for excess.

People like you? Well you're obviously not helping anyone's 'bubble' right now, so why don't you get back out there and do what is 'necessary'?

If morals and ethics are all opinions, then go outside and strip naked, or better yet, go to any country with a government, and kill somebody. Then we'll see what the 'opinion' would be.

People like me? You don't know me or what I do, you don't know everyone else, you don't know death-row inmates. You just see what you want to see (some anti-government bile for you there).

But not your blood right? Just everyone elses. Do you think about all the other people on the other side that 'paid in blood'? Of course not.



Maybe we will one day, because it wasn't necessary today, and it probably won't be tomorrow.
It's called idealism. A Utopia is what society is working towards, or do you have a better idea of what all advancements are for?

 

[Biosophilogical]

-snip-

you touchy feely asshats who couldn't handle doing the dirty work can sit back and play grabass while you try and come up with a culture and government where people like me aren't required because there is no war and all criminals are either gone or can be made into productive citizens and I would root for the day you actually do it... but that simple isn't the reality now and in this reality there are people that we as a species are simply better off without

I'm just going to point out that your post doesn't sound very sincere. On the one hand, you say you would Root For The Day! we touchy feely asshats create a society without the need for war and killing. On the other hand, you say you would root for the day we Touchy Feel Asshats! ... You don't actually seem to value what you claim to have killed for. It sounds more like you are five and we are your least favourite toy. It doesn't matter that you don't like us much, because when someone tries to play with us (in this analogy, 'play with us' is code for 'blow us up, because *X*') you get hyper-defensive and punch the other kid in the face. Not because you like us as a toy, but because you just don't want other people playing with what you see as 'yours'.

I honestly hope I'm wrong and this thread just has you in a shitty mood, but that's what it sounds like from where I'm sitting (in my comfy bubble).

 

[Arakasi]

I think that so long as the proof is 100% undeniable (video evidence or something of the likes) then the death penalty is viable.

Though I prefer my idea of forcably deporting anyone who commits such a crime.

 

[Daystar Clarion]

I think that so long as the proof is 100% undeniable (video evidence or something of the likes) then the death penalty is viable.

Though I prefer my idea of forcably deporting anyone who commits such a crime.

We did that once.

Ended up with Australia.

Sorry about that

 

[Rai^3]

I do believe that there are beings who deserve death. That bit by Jeremy Irons refers to people, but if a person is willing to commit horrible acts without cause and have no remorse for it, they've made a conscious decision to be *less* than human. Rapists, serial killers, murderers- these are not people, they're fucking animals who gave up their right to life when they took away the rights of their victims. No amount of torture is enough for such degenerates.

The problem of money, however, is there, and does concern me greatly. I wish I had a suggestion to solve that.

 

[JokerboyJordan]

again if you can't wrap your head around this are you have no place in this conversation

Then neither do you ROFL LMAO OMG FAIL LOL

And with that I bid you a, farewell

 

[Daystar Clarion]

I do believe that there are beings who deserve death. That bit by Jeremy Irons refers to people, but if a person is willing to commit horrible acts without cause and have no remorse for it, they've made a conscious decision to be *less* than human. Rapists, serial killers, murderers- these are not people, they're fucking animals who gave up their right to life when they took away the rights of their victims. No amount of torture is enough for such degenerates.

The problem of money, however, is there, and does concern me greatly. I wish I had a suggestion to solve that.

Sociopathy is cosidered a mental illness, being unable to feel empathy for another human being is a very serious condition and while it doesn't give people a free pass to wholesale murder people, it's something that should be studied and treated.

 

[chiggerwood]

I used to be for the death penalty, but being a Christian I find myself unable to justify it. I tried, Lord knows I tried, but in the end I couldn't. No man has the wisdom to decide if someone should live or die, nor do they have the justification. Too many innocent people have been put down as if they're less than dogs. Yes their offense is grievous, yes they may deserve death, but are we anyone to speak on such an irreversible matter? We are a foolish lot that wishes not for justice, but for retribution, retribution for the wrongs committed against us, committed against society "He must pay for his crimes. The family deserves justice" some might be inclined to say. He will pay for his crimes one way or another, but justice? Is it justice if we degenerate ourselves to commit such an act, forcing a man to press a button that will take a mans' life? What of the executioner? What of the man whom must look back upon his life in his final moments knowing that he ended the lives of so many, some innocent? Can you imagine his pain? What about justice for him? When a life is taken in the pursuit of justice we must never forget that it not just one person is dying, but many, but only one is immediate. The others die a slow lingering death, not of body but of spirit. The judge, or jury who delivers the sentence, the man who makes the poison, the man who delivers the poison, the man who injects the poison; all of these people will forever have the burden in being part of taking a life on their consciences. Can you lift that burden from them knowing what has been done can never be undone? When we think of the death penalty we think solely of the life of the criminal that is to be taken, but it reaches much, much deeper than that, and we must see that.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

I object to the death penalty cause I feel it allows those WHO ARE guilty the peace of death rather than facing consequences for their actions. But even within me, there is always the fear of being convicted of a crime I didn't commit, so even in my dark heart I see the futility of the Death Penalty.

And now I must ponder the irony of having had Scar from the Lion King teach me about irreversible nature of death in the modern world.

 

[Jedoro]

I'm all for the death penalty, but right now the system's shit. Hell, make the prosecuting attorney the executioner. At that point, there's no room for just wanting to boost his or her conviction rating. That attorney better be damn sure the person's guilty, or not even prosecute.

As for what crime warrants it: murder. I believe that when you maliciously disregard another person's right, you surrender it yourself. I believe murderers give up the right to live and someone should put a bullet in their brainpan. Victimizing others is a choice, and if you're willing to make that choice for any reason other than the greater good, you don't belong in society. As for what the greater good is, well, that's for the jury to decide.

 

[immortalfrieza]

i see im in the minority here but some people have to die. (Osama Bin Laden/Hitler/Stalin/many many more)

one big problem with our society (more UK than US) is that we all agree criminals should be punished but then pussy out of punishing them and just send them to prison which isn't a suitable punishment (for most criminals) or a deterrent just a holding pattern during which the state pays for them to live (a privilege most normal people dont get) and after they get let out they just go on to commit another crime (which in some instances means killing/raping/child molesting) prisons need to completely change in order to either

A. actually punish criminals and be a harsh punishment and a deterrent
B. rehabilitate and re-educate criminals so they can become productive members of society (something modern prisons are trying but failing to do due to being massively underfunded and education being expensive)
C. both A and B

to address some points youve been making

1. "innocents get sent to their deaths"
the risk of innocent being sent to their deaths that is a problem with the court and legal system not the death penalty and needs to be tackled there otherwise even if the death penalty is revoked innocent's will still be punished)

2. "punishing murder's by murdering them is wrong"
if you have killed especially if its multiple people then yes you should die because you are destructive, you have destroyed other people lives for your own gain and so you should die, hell we all agree that Hitler had to die? why not scumbag steve who killed 5 people? is there really a set number of murders before its like well you killed 1 to many jews you deserve it? no of course not
(i personally feel the same about rape and child molesting but thats just my personal opinion)

In the minority maybe, but not alone. I not only agree with everything you said, but I in fact think that the Death Penalty is not used enough. I think that the Death Penalty should be used for far more lesser crimes than just murder, and people should be executed far sooner, within a year at most, at least in cases where the odds of the criminal's innocence are next to zero (they're never going to be 100% sure of a person's innocence or guilt no matter how good the justice system gets.)


There also should be no life sentence, it should be entirely replaced with the Death Penalty. Why? It's because the absolute worst thing that can happen to anyone is for that person to be killed and the worst thing that anyone can do to another is kill them, no contest. Even a person that feels the worst possible pain anyone can ever feel endlessly for their entire lives, even if they somehow lived forever, is still better off than someone that is dead. There's no doubt in my mind about that.

As for the punishments for people that don't get the Death Penalty, they should subjected to the worst possible pain that a person can experience and still not have any lasting damage.
Why? It's because punishing criminals does not exist to get them off the streets, reform them, or any of that BS that people think things like prison are for. The punishment of criminals exists to deter people against ever committing any crime, and the worst the punishments are, the more effective at being a deterrent it is. The fact that we have thousands and thousands of people across the U.S. in prisons and on the run regardless of the crimes is proof that the punishments for crimes in this country are nowhere near severe enough. In fact, even if we had just 1 person out there committing a crime it would be proof that our system of crime and punishment isn't severe enough.

Of course, the above means that we'd have plenty of innocent people being executed and tortured, but that's meanless, as I mentioned before that would happen with any system of crime and punishment regardless of how effective the justice system was. That's why the fact that innocent people are incarcerated and killed all the time means nothing and never will.

 

[Gnoekeos]

I think that considering we don't really know what happens when you die the death penalty is a bit of a waste and possibly not a penalty at all. There's got to be something more useful you can do with a person you were just going to kill and anyway there are things that are so much worse than death.

 

[Astoria]

I believe in the death penalty for murder, rape, child molestation ect but for only repeat offenders who also/or those who show no sympathy or regret for their crimes. If the crime was particularly bad and it is general belief that the person should be put to death then there should be a certain amount of time which is given to see if any new evidence is provided to prove the person is innocent, the amount of time given depending on how much doubt there is of the persons guilt.

 

[FallenMessiah88]

Unless there is undeniable proof that the person is guilty, then no, I don't support the death penalty.

 

[SlaveNumber23]

I think a better punishment would be to let them live but make their life a living hell, being put to death is in some ways an escape. I would much rather die than rot in prison anyway.

 

[Darth_Dude]

all the "if one innocent person is killed it's not worth it" bullshit is tiring tho.. we killed lots and lots of innocent people in WW2 so does that mean it wasn't worth going after the Nazis? Innocent people will always die no matter what you do and sometimes it is justified to kill people... best you can do is try and make the system as good as it can be... and no offence locking people up for life is MORE cruel than the death penalty... just ask anyone who has ever been incarcerated for an extended period... not to mention it is a horrible waste of resources that could be used for better things for people who actually deserve it

You perfectly worded my thoughts there

OT: I support the death penalty. Call me what you want, but I think some people don't deserve to live for what they've done. Besides, keeping them in prison is a monumental waste of resources that could be much better spent on other things such as education, health and whatnot.

 

[hawkinsssable]

So if I understand Darth_Dude and Liquidacid23 correctly: The death penalty is good, because life imprisonment is a waste of resources. If sentencing somebody to death requires MORE resources than life imprisonment, then you need to fix that by getting rid of the appeals process. The undisputed fact that many people on death row have been found innocent during these appeals processes - and that a few more have been proven innocent AFTER execution - isn't a problem, because it's fine to kill innocent people while pursuing a worthy goal.

Is killing criminals really that worthy a goal, though? What possible good is being served? The only good you pointed out is that life imprisonment is more cruel than the death sentence. Personally, I truly doubt that. Survival is the most basic human instinct. Knowing for years in advance the exact date and time you're scheduled to die - painfully, strapped down, in a completely unpleasant and undignified way - must be one of the worst possible things a person can go through. It also makes the grieving process MUCH harder on the criminal's family and friends. And there are plenty of documented ugly effects on executioners, witnesses, prison guards, wardens, and jurors as well.

This only gets worse if there's a decent chance that the person was, in fact, innocent.

Is saving a negligible amount of tax dollars really a worthy enough goal for all that?

 

[Meight08]

I say kill them. It is better to kill them now than hold them in prison for 50 years until they die.

Shouldn't that be their choice?
If they want to be shot rather than prison till they die then by all means shoot them.
If they are cowards and want to be locked in a small room till they die or want to be shot by all means do it.
The only way a person should be killed on purpose is by his own choice or putting his life on the line.