So, I've finally given Bioshock Infinite a chance. [SPOILERS]
- Thread starter ninja666
- Start date
The ending was actually done really well. It's all that getting guns and switching universes that doesn't make sense. Once they go to a different universe to get those guns (which Elizabeth says there is no way back) that whole deal with Fitzroy is void because you went to a different universe with a different Fitzroy who never made any deal with you. The one explanation that kinda makes it work is that Elizabeth is not taking you to a different universe, she is pulling things from different universes into your current one. I really think they fucked up the story and luckily that explanation exists.ninja666 said:
Anyways, back to the ending. Firstly, all the Elizabeths die because all those Comstock universes cease to exist. Actually, your Elizabeth doesn't die because she stays in-between all the universes (with the lighthouses) thus she's not in a universe and thus can't die. Booker even makes a comment to Elizabeth asking "who are you?" because it's a different Elizabeth. The Booker that accepts the baptism is the ONLY Booker that does that, you can say only one Booker (of the infinite amounts) even went to the baptism at all thus killing that Booker before he makes the decision completely kills off every Comstock universe since all Comstock universes branched out from that singular point. Even Elizabeth says several times killing off her Comstock will do nothing. The ending is even smart enough to where Elizabeth takes Booker on that "tour" or whatever before opening the final door to ensure his decision becomes a constant (thus no universe with him making the opposite decision would spring up thus accomplishing nothing) as she keeps saying to Booker "are you sure?", which is what all that constant/variable talk is about earlier in the game. The details in the ending are very well done unlike a lot that happens earlier in the game with that rather pointless sidequest of getting guns. The ending may not all work out according to actual scientific theories, but I feel it works out by the rules that game set forth.
A lot of people got confused at the same point. The game does actually explain this, the details of its "infinite universes" theory, and the way in which Elizabeth interacts with it in quite copious detail. It's nowhere near the plot hole it's often accused of being.ninja666 said:
The upshot is that at the point Booker drowns, it's every Booker in every universe. The idea is to create a situation in which every time a Comstock is created it leads to a paradox that causes Comstock's universe to inevitably be erased, leaving only the ones in which Booker chose to stay as Booker and raise his daughter on his own.
Like the first Bioshock, the game's trying to juggle a fairly complex metaphor. It's actually all rather comparable to Spec Ops: The Line. The best way to win the game, the best "ending" you can get, is to make it that the game was never played. It just tries to achieve this feeling without making you hate the fact that you played the game first.
Like the first Bioshock, the game's trying to juggle a fairly complex metaphor. It's actually all rather comparable to Spec Ops: The Line. The best way to win the game, the best "ending" you can get, is to make it that the game was never played. It just tries to achieve this feeling without making you hate the fact that you played the game first.
Phoenixmgs said:
Both of these explanations contradict what's been said to you at the ending. They are probable, sure, but considering there still exists an infinite amount of universes, it's impossible to wipe out Booker-Comstock out of all of them because there still is at least one where the baptism never occurs, Booker lives, makes the deal etc.Azahul said:
Some things are constant. The Baptism is one of them. This is explicitly stated many, many times throughout the game.ninja666 said:
"Infinite" universes doesn't work the same in the game world as it does in the real world. That's fine, the game writers are going for a metaphor and are free to make up science if they want to. If something changes the Baptism, according to Elizabeth's powers and the constant nature of certain events throughout all universes, that means it changes the Baptism in every universe.
Personally, I had enough fun with the characters to put up with the sketchier parts of the story, and enjoyed the ending a great deal. Still, I totally understand it not being something that would appeal to everyone. That's not exactly outside the norm for things I like.ninja666 said:
True, it sucked. However, I was talking more about how the game literally makes you not care about anything and instead of making you care, it throws in bullshit like Vox Populi uprising. I didn't even notice this major plothole at all. I salute you on your perception skills.Phoenixmgs said:
When you go through the very first tear, I was immediately like "so why are we still going to get these guns as you don't have a deal for an airship with THIS Fitzroy?". The whole thing was so pointless. I don't even think I even thought about Comstock having his own Elizabeth and such due finding it the whole thing pointless immediately. I read most of the other stuff after I finished the game. I always did care for the characters and I dig the type of story Infinite has (science + mystery and whatnot). I did like some parts of the actual revolution even though plot-wise it was pointless, I loved the gospel version of "Fortunate Son". The game has a lot of good ideas but never pulls them together besides for the very core of the story. The Luteces were awesome.ninja666 said:
The game isn't really that fun for me either. I mean the sky rails was fucking sweet, and the scenery was nice. But seeing how I'm one of those guys who plays with a sniper and pistol...it was boring and a bit easy (on normal). The only time I had to switch weapons was when I ran low on ammo/needed something for the bullet sponge baddies. And the problem with Bioshock in terms of game play is the issue I have with most games of it's ilk, let's swarm the player with baddies and call it a day. They could have done a very cool and exciting final fight with the sky rails idea, but it just felt like they wanted to bore the player with tears and have a lame conclusion to the dick who was messing with you this whole time.
I found Infinite more fun with regards to combat. You can use power weapons all game for example, which I don't think was possible in Bioshock, so I felt less restrictive even with only 2 guns. Although it was quite stupid to have to run for an RPG or whatever when needed instead of just having it. Regardless of what they are called, plasmids or vigors, they are just fucking powers (and will be in any Bioshock game) and I found the powers in Infinite much better and more useful. Bucking Bronco was a more fun freeze power than freezing an enemy in Bioshock. I loved the combinations like Murder of Crows + Devil's Kiss combined with the Crow Trap upgrade was endless fun. You could basically become a Vanguard from Mass Effect with the Charge vigor and it would replenish the shield (again, just like Mass Effect).Nods Respectfully Towards You said:
That's an odd thing to say, as it certainly "let" a lot of other people enjoy it. It's kind of a shame it chose to exclude you.ninja666 said:
In all seriousness, your opinion on the game is as justified as anyone else's. No game is going to please everybody. That being said, it does sort of sound like you went into this game fully expecting to be disappointed in it, and you often find what you look for.
Found the game really fun untill the last 2 hours of the story that I did play.
Hearing this makes me glad that I never bothered finishing the game.ninja666 said:
It's funny because I prefered the original Bioshock to Infinite.
Those trailers for Infinite ruined it for me. That one where they really show off the rails that take you pretty much anywhere is NOT in the game, instead they are just like pointless loops that take you to and from a vantage point. Could have been a much better game.
Those trailers for Infinite ruined it for me. That one where they really show off the rails that take you pretty much anywhere is NOT in the game, instead they are just like pointless loops that take you to and from a vantage point. Could have been a much better game.
You're not alone in disliking it. I loved Bioshock myself, but could not get into Infinite. Elizabeth was great, I really enjoyed the writing of her character, and the story was interesting at least. The mechanics killed it for me. I'm not really a fan of shooters in general, and this felt much more like a generic shooter than the original Bioshock did. I fully agree about the "tougher" enemies, that is a very boring way to increase difficulty, and I just overall did not enjoy playing the game.