So why is it offensive to consider homosexuality as a choice?

[Something Amyss]

But surely everything beyond that is a choice right?

Unless you're heterosexual. Then it's a right.

I think this is part of the problem: people only look at one side of the diction. Nobody questions "acting on" heterosexuality, and in fact it's more or less treated as an inevitability. Even the most puritanical believe it should be expressed within a marriage, which is another "right" (depending on locale, of course).

It's still kind of monstrous to say "it's okay to be gay, just don't act on it."

Being wrong doesn't necessarily mean being offensive.

In a vacuum, no. However, when one considers the relegation of sexuality to a choice is one of the primary justifications for discriminating against people. But that aside, you know what?

It's insulting to think that it's a choice because many people lose their family and friends over their sexual orientation and, in most countries, same sex couples can't marry and experience both mental and physical abuse. To say that it's a choice implies that someone is intentionally "deviating" from their heterosexuality and could just as easily chose to enter in a heterosexual relationship.

That's the rub.

I think if the LGBT community could simply "choose" to fit in with societal perceptions of normal, most of us would do it. There's a reason so many gays try (and fail) to "be straight," a reason so many of LGBT folk kill themselves or try to. There's a reason those psuedoscientific straight camps have such huge draws, even though the real science can't demonstrate any effective cure. Maybe it's the coward's way, but if it was a viable option, I think a majority of us would jump. Why? Because it really sucks "choosing" to be queer in a society that hates you.

So yeah. It is offensive to be told you've heaped that shit on yourself.

And since I'm already being horribly depressing, I'll just end with a quote from Extra Fancy's "C'mon Louie."

I can't be a good man in your eyes
Everything you got to offer don't feel right
Attaché, ugly wife, two kids, long life well
I would rather die!

 

[Lovely Mixture]

You don't choose what kind of videogames you like, you just like them.

If you're a girl insert picture of Kevin Smith and you get the point.

Hey! People have many other problems with Kevin Smith OTHER than how he looks.

 

[Images]

The real "damned if you do damned if you don't" thing is this.

Say its a choice, its offensive because it means that its something that can be changed. "Oh I just CHOOSE to like people of the same sex? Bigot!"

Say its part of how you're raised, its nurture, well once again you're left with people saying "Oh its someone's FAULT I'm this way is it? Bigot!"

Say its part of a person's makeup, that its genetic, then you get outcry that "You're saying there's a gay gene? Bigot!"

Smarter men than me with fleeter feet haven't walked that minefield unscathed. I just stand behind the warning signs and go, there's a diplomatic answer somewhere in there, YOU go look!

 

[Ihateregistering1]

Honestly why is it? Don't get me wrong I've got no problems without homosexuality, in fact I can see myself experimenting some day. But for the live of me I can't see why it's most often considered offensive to think of it as a choice.
I can see that being more sexually attracted to the same sex isn't something you do so purposfully/consiously. So if you purely regard homosexuality as being dominantly sexually attracted to the same sex. Then yes it isn't really a choice, more something that just happens to you. But surely everything beyond that is a choice right?
Again I want to stress that I think it's the right choice. Sexuality is a good thing, so I'd encourage people to do whatever they want on that area as long as all involved parties are consentfull.
But still acting upon your homosexuality is surely a choice right? So why is it considered offensive to regard it as such? Especially as the alternative is to regard it as something like an affliction, which I personally would find much more offensive.

Well, you have to look at it in the big picture: if you establish that homosexuality is a choice, then it gives ammunition to those who say that, since you CHOSE to be this way, you are not inherently entitled to anything, since you can simply choose to not be that way.

To give an example: Let's say a clothing store doesn't hire someone who applies for a job because they have tattoos all over their face, and the company argues that the tattoos are intimidating to customers and thus they don't wish to hire said person. They can likely win such a case because, when all is said and done, the person chose to get their face adorned with tattoos (with extreme exceptions).

Now, put that same idea into an example of a company saying they didn't wish to hire a homosexual because they thought it might affect their customer base. When it is understood that homosexuality isn't a choice, the company's legal standing is very weak. If it is a choice, their standing is much stronger. Essentially, when sexual orientation is comparable to biological sex, height, race, etc. (ie. things that one does not choose) it makes it far more difficult to argue that discrimination against said person should be allowed.

Now, since I'm sure someone will misinterpret what I'm saying, I absolutely think people are born gay or straight or bi or whatever other variations are out there, and discrimination is wrong.

 

[darron13]

Because it's not? And it implies that people who ARE gay choose to be ostracized, have their rights taken away and risk losing friends and family because...reasons, apparently.

 

[JimB]

If homosexuality is not a choice, then are we incorrectly prosecuting pedophiles?

No. While I believe their sexual orientations cannot change, nothing about a pedophile's desire to orgasm trumps the right of a child to not be raped. If the pedophile needs to orgasm that badly, there are plenty of options available that do not involve contact with minors.

 

[Brian Tams]

Well, I didn't sit in the thinking chair for long amounts of time, stroking my chin and decide I was attracted to women. I just am. I got up one day, saw some racy pictures of some hot actress, got a stiffy, and have been straight ever since. I'm sure a homosexual goes through the same thing. Its logical thinking.

 

[Lilani]

Then yes it isn't really a choice, more something that just happens to you. But surely everything beyond that is a choice right?
Again I want to stress that I think it's the right choice. Sexuality is a good thing, so I'd encourage people to do whatever they want on that area as long as all involved parties are consentfull.
But still acting upon your homosexuality is surely a choice right? So why is it considered offensive to regard it as such? Especially as the alternative is to regard it as something like an affliction, which I personally would find much more offensive.

By that logic, acting on your homosexuality is a choice as much as acting on heterosexuality is a choice. As long as you're not going to sit here and argue that it somehow doesn't go both ways, I guess I don't see a problem with this, except that the distinction is rather pointless. A straight person is most likely going to have sex with straight people, a gay person is most likely going to have sex with gay people. It's a pretty obvious concept. The only exceptions or "middle grounds" are bisexuality and transexuality.

So I guess I would ask, what's the point of making such a distinction? Is a straight person not straight until they CHOOSE to have straight sex, then?

 

[Joccaren]

Honestly why is it? Don't get me wrong I've got no problems without homosexuality, in fact I can see myself experimenting some day. But for the live of me I can't see why it's most often considered offensive to think of it as a choice.

Is it offensive that I say you're icky 'cause you chose to be black [No idea if you are or not]?
Yes? Why? Well, for one that I'm calling you icky, which is what near everyone who considers homosexuality a choice generally pairs such an assertion with - or that its a sin or a crime or something - and secondly because you had no choice whether over you were black or white, and its stupid to blame you for that.

I can see that being more sexually attracted to the same sex isn't something you do so purposfully/consiously. So if you purely regard homosexuality as being dominantly sexually attracted to the same sex. Then yes it isn't really a choice, more something that just happens to you. But surely everything beyond that is a choice right?
Again I want to stress that I think it's the right choice. Sexuality is a good thing, so I'd encourage people to do whatever they want on that area as long as all involved parties are consentfull.

This is kinda mucking things up a bit. Homosexuality IS being attracted to the opposite sex. If you are attracted to the opposite sex, you are a homosexual. Or bisexual if you are attracted to both. Acting on that is just the same as a heterosexual person acting on their desire to sleep with the opposite sex. We don't come out and say heterosexuality is a choice, because its not. We come out and say that abstinence or sex is a choice.

But still acting upon your homosexuality is surely a choice right? So why is it considered offensive to regard it as such? Especially as the alternative is to regard it as something like an affliction, which I personally would find much more offensive.

For two reasons.
1. Because its a false choice. What are your options?
a) 'Act on your homosexuality'. Sleep around with other people of the same sex, enjoy yourself, and have a happy relationship with someone, fall in love - ect.
b) Abstain from any and all sexual encounters, don't search for love, don't get into any relationships - ect.
c) Get into a relationship with the opposite sex, which you do not enjoy as you are not attracted to them, try to sleep with them and potentially fail as you don't find them attractive, and if you succeed don't enjoy it all that much, have a relationship with someone else that may be alright, but will always have a bit of a stressed undertone to it due to you not finding them attractive in that way, whilst its expected that you will.

Your options are either 'Act on your homosexuality', become a nun, or do what bigots and homophobes call 'normal' and 'right', and betray yourself in the process. If that's a real choice, then its a bloody offensive choice.

2. Because the only other way to consider it is not as an affliction. Is being a boy an affliction? Is being a girl an affliction? Having 2 eyes is an affliction? No, then why would being homosexual be an affliction? It is simply a genetic trait carried down like gender, hair colour, skin colour and anything else.

With exceptions aside, yeah I can choose whom I'm attracted to.

Those exceptions aren't universal. I can not be attracted to guys. I'm a guy, I have no interest in guys no matter how much I realise being so would bring me less pain [Well, emotional pain anyway...]. Likewise a homosexual man would probably find it impossible to be attracted to girls. Not everyone can choose who they are and aren't attracted too.

As for persecuted and discriminated. Well maybe I'm speaking from the luxury of never been discriminated or persecuted, but yeah. People who treat others badly for something such as sexuality are bad people, and I usually don't feel bad if bad people treat me badly. Then you get to call them out and be the bigger person.

Unless you live in Russia where you're just tortured, sent to jail, tortured some more and eventually killed.
Or Iran. Or Iraq.
Or if you live in some towns in America even, where Evangelical Christians send you letters asking you to move out of town peacefully else they will bring in contacts from the police force and forcefully move you out of town because you are homosexual, claiming to have done so to 7 other couples so far [Seriously seen a letter saying that. I'll have to find the picture, its laughable and sad at the same time]. Its also worse than you think when you are unable to make any friends in your area, or talk to anyone on even a professional level, because they judge you as a lesser person because you are homosexual. Discrimination is a real issue in some placed. Its not just "I don't like you 'cause your homosexual" its "I'm going to make your life hell because you're a homosexual", and I'd be surprised if you could put up with that.

 

[Something Amyss]

This here. It's just "something that happens," and I get the feeling bi-sexuals (and those who don't realize they are bi-sexual and think it's a choice issue) don't realize this. First time I saw a nude woman in a magazine I had pilfered from the grocery store BAM! I was hooked.

While I can't speak for all bisexuals, I'm pretty confident stating that we don't generally choose who we're attracted to, any more than monosexuals do. We might technically have a broader field to draw from, but that doesn't really equal choice. We're still driven by the same irrational hormones and feelings as everyone else.

Honestly, I prefer women on an aesthetic and an intellectual level. If I could choose, without prejudice, I'd stick with women entirely. It doesn't stop me from having my head turned by a hot guy or even having relationships with them, though my recent partners have all been women.

Bisexuality is still "something that just happens," if you don't mind the alteration of word order. I "happen" to be bisexual. I don't choose to like either sex any more than you choose to like one or the other.

And if we're being honest, I can't help but think we're more the pawn than the propagator, played by both sides as is convenient.

 

[Arcane Azmadi]

It's offensive for the very obvious reason that it's patently not true. Many people who insist that it is ( and it's ALWAYS people who ARE NOT HOMOSEXUAL THEMSELVES) are doing so in order to justify their bigotry against homosexuals- "well he has no-one to blame but himself, he made his choice". "He could be straight if he didn't like the way he's treated."

Yeah. FUCK. THAT.

And just as bad, this deliberate campaign of misinformation has spread to the point that even non-bigoted people (like the OP) have come to believe it. Speaking of which, isn't it silly to say that the only alternative to to it being a choice is for it to be "an affliction"? That's nonsense. Yeah, an affliction, the same way I'm "afflicted" with brown hair and a height of 5'11". No, it's not an "affliction", it's just the way we naturally are. Sheesh!

 

[Boris Goodenough]

Many people who insist that it is ( and it's ALWAYS people who ARE NOT HOMOSEXUAL THEMSELVES) are doing so in order to justify their bigotry against homosexuals-

What about those conservative and religious leaders caught with the fingers in the cookie jar?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/05/george-rekers-anti-gay-ac_n_565142.html

Capthca: filthy dirty mess

 

[Insideout Ink Demon]

denying your feelings for the same gender and denying your feelings for children are very different situations indeed

How so?

You feel what you feel. You can control ACTING on your feelings, but that does not change what you desire. The question could be what should be done about it? 13 year olds are choosing to have sex with EACH OTHER now.. they don't seem incapable of not making a decision about if they would sleep with an older person or not. How does society intend on reconciling the hypocrisy?

On the other hand,

Well first of all it isn't a choice. You can't just wake up today and say "You know what, I'm going to be attracted to that person."

The main reason, I think, is that it's often used to try and justify homophobia and condemn homosexuality as somehow being immoral.

I think it's quite like that.. because to be frank, I didn't really find myself attracted to ANYONE male OR female till I was about 14. I just didn't care or think of emotional or sexual things.. I wanted to play with video games or toys.

So yeah, I do believe you sort of wake up one day and realize what you are attracted to. I personally know people that were complete breeders and never once really thought of it until one day they found themselves in the mood to experiment because they were BORED and decided to switch teams because it was more exciting, I'm assuming because it was new. Just as I know people who used to be gay and are now straight for some reason... although I admit, like someone earlier mentioned, this seems to be a commonality amongst females, as all of the examples I mentioned are female.

well for one thing. Children having under age sex and an adult taking advantage of a child and two consenting adults having sex are 3 different situation. Sorry for the lack of a snip. Escapist really needs a mobile site.

 

[Lieju]

Because you can't choose who you're attracted to.
And those people who say those things usually don't claim hetersexuality is a choice. That's how I always answer those questions. "Why did you choose to be straight?". And usually the answer is 'I didn't'.

Except for once, when, hilariously, a guy explained how sex with women just is better, to which I asked "I agree. So you're saying ALL women should be lesbians, because who'd want to have sex with guys?"

It's very common to people opposed to homosexuals having equal rights to frame the issue as gays wanting special treatment, and that if they for example wanted to get married, they should just turn straight like everyone else has to.

You can choose whether you act on your sexuality, after all, even if you're in a relationship and find someone else attractive, it doesn't mean you have to have an affair, and if you're attracted to minors or animals, you can choose not to take advantage of them.

But there is no reason two consenting adults not to have a relationship if they want to.

c) Get into a relationship with the opposite sex, which you do not enjoy as you are not attracted to them, try to sleep with them and potentially fail as you don't find them attractive, and if you succeed don't enjoy it all that much, have a relationship with someone else that may be alright, but will always have a bit of a stressed undertone to it due to you not finding them attractive in that way, whilst its expected that you will.

Your options are either 'Act on your homosexuality', become a nun, or do what bigots and homophobes call 'normal' and 'right', and betray yourself in the process. If that's a real choice, then its a bloody offensive choice.

I have talked to several older lesbians who did just that, some because they didn't even realize they were lesbians and mistook platonic love for sexual or something that could become sexual.

They were not happy marriages, and it's also unfair for the straight spouse, who is then tied to someone who cannot find them attractive sexually.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

People find the idea that Homosexuality is a choice offensive because they think that it demeans Homosexuality, but it really doesn't. Homosexuality is a preference, and like all preferences is the result of upbringing, both by their parents and the community at large, that eventually develops from these things into a subconscious drive. Homosexuality is no more a choice than a preference for say, Diet Coke over regular Coke, but neither is it something genetic. Why? It's because as anyone who knows anything about genetics and evolution will tell you, if Homosexuality was a result of a gene then Homosexuality wouldn't exist, since it's a self culling gene. If a gene for Homosexuality was mutated into a person at some point, it couldn't be passed on to subsequent generations and thus become widespread because by the very nature of the sexual orientation Homosexuals are much less likely to have children. It's like someone mutating a gene for a inherent tendency to kill their own children, that gene would die out with the person that first had it.

Actually, there are dominant and non-dominant genes. If a homosexuality gen exists, any straight person could have it as a non-dominant gen, it could be passed on your children and grand children without it being dominant... up to one point.

Or something like that. Dunno 100%, learned something about it in biology class.

 

[BabyRaptor]

It's offensive to consider homosexuality a choice because IT'S NOT A CHOICE.

You're calling everyone who tells the truth a liar because either it's easier for you to accept as a choice or because you don't care enough to educate yourself.

If you choose to experiment, then fine. More power to you. But that's not you choosing to be gay. That's you choosing to try homosexual sex. Orientation is not a choice.

Oh, and the other reason it's offensive is because "It's a choice" is one of the main arguments for the people who want to deny us our rights and force us to pretend we're straight.

 

[electric_warrior]

It wouldn't be offensive if it wasn't used to justify so much shit, just factually inaccurate.

Personally, I think it's probably worse when people say "I was born this way" like it's a problem that they can't help. Like being born disabled or something.

I don't think it makes a blind bit of difference whether or not it's a choice. What matters is that they do no harm, so it's okay.

 

[NearLifeExperience]

I turned out to be heterosexual, and I never asked for this. Silly references aside, I think it's downright stupid to think of sexuality as a choice. Why was I never asked what I wanted to be? Sometimes I wish I was gay, because holy smokes, women are complicated. But I'm not, guess why? Because I was BORN that way.

To give answer to the question as to why it is considered offensive; it devalues gay rights in a way that they 'chose to be that way', so homophobes can retort with "Well, you chose to be gay so just live with the hate" whenever gay bashing occurs. Adding to that, you're essentially claiming to know the gay person in question better than they do themselves, which is extremely annoying, as you probably can imagine.

So no. Stop thinking with your arse, sexuality is not something you choose.
You'd think we'd be past such primitive thoughts in this day and age, but I guess not.

 

[rob_simple]

I'm sure a lot of people have already pointed out how ludicrous everything you've said is, but I just need to throw my own hat in.

Okay I need to break this down, because it is stunning.

Honestly why is it? Don't get me wrong I've got no problems without homosexuality, in fact I can see myself experimenting some day. But for the live of me I can't see why it's most often considered offensive to think of it as a choice.

There's a huge difference between 'experimenting' and knowing you are different from a young age. People who go through a phase, in my experience, mostly do it to rebel against what they deem to be societal norms and, more irritatingly, just for attention (see: Every girl who has a picture of her kissing a friend in a club. Fuck. Off)

I can see that being more sexually attracted to the same sex isn't something you do so purposfully/consiously. So if you purely regard homosexuality as being dominantly sexually attracted to the same sex. Then yes it isn't really a choice, more something that just happens to you. But surely everything beyond that is a choice right?

What is beyond that? Having sex is all about attraction, and if you are only attracted to other men then you can only have sex with men. Not having sex with other men doesn't make you not gay, just incredibly frustrated.

Again I want to stress that I think it's the right choice. Sexuality is a good thing, so I'd encourage people to do whatever they want on that area as long as all involved parties are consentfull.
But still acting upon your homosexuality is surely a choice right? So why is it considered offensive to regard it as such?

Because you're making it sound like 'acting upon' these homosexual urges is in some way a negative action. Because the alternative is to suppress who you are and live a lie. Doing that is definitely a choice. You can choose to pretend you're not gay, but if you are gay then it isn't because of a choice you made.

Especially as the alternative is to regard it as something like an affliction, which I personally would find much more offensive.

Or, you know, you could regard it as a sexual orientation, just like heterosexuality?