Exactly. The hardware on this thing kicks ass and oled screen looks amazing. But problem is that I can hardly USE IT. I use my Vita as my main source for watching movies and tv but the thing only plays mp4 and avi (I think) so I have to convert everything first. There are just so many things I can do on android because its open source that I can't do on my amazing vita that its depressing. Of course, the fact that I'm willing to put up with the annoyance of converting videos shows that I feel the benefits outweigh any hassleJ Tyran said:
Sony "Looking Into" Vita Pricing and Marketing
- Thread starter Sarah LeBoeuf
- Start date
Mimsofthedawg said:
Weird. I felt sort of the opposite. I like Gravity Rush more than Uncharted. Though, I was impressed with how Uncharted was able to use the vita's features in gameplay without being too gimmicky (slid the back to zoom in while sniping is genius). But it felt kinda stale to me. Admittedly I'm not a huge fan of the whole series though (Uncharted 2 is the best). I found Gravity Rush on the other hand, to be new and completely original and the gameplay is fun. I'm not gonna lie, the game is 90% charm but that's something that can carry me through a game
The value of the processor is irrelevant when there are phones that just function better than the Vita with less powerful parts. The internet interface is still trash. The touchscreen interface is just another "bells and whistles" feature that won't be used in the majority of its library. The memory cards are still madly expensive, especially when compared to any storage unit for mobile devices. The battery life is trash being less than half of a basic phone(let's be honest all "smartphones" are the standard expected of phones at this point). The cameras are 0.3MP, which is a joke considering that most smartphones today are at 8.1MP(Sony's Ericsson Xperia model from 3 years ago was on 8.1).J Tyran said:
If I was going to simply compare the Vita with other mobile devices, it comes off as a really powerful gaming only device. The fact that every other feature on it is really low tech that can barely compete with the Blackberry Curve in my pocket. The real big losing point for the Vita is the fact that it comes with no internal memory at all. You get that with virtually every other device on the market. Its too expensive for what its actual competition is thought. Yes, the Vita is powerful. But when your only true competitor, the 3DS, is kicking Sony's ass in sales thanks largely due to a price drop of $90.... Well..Not doing a damn thing about it is kinda of ballsy. And in this case stupid.
I've said on these forums before, Sony is marketing as if the smartphone market is its main competition and not the 3DS. Its marketing a gaming device based on its gimmicky wanna-be iPhone features and not on the features gamers care about. All while charging you extra money for mandatory memory cards. And Nintendo isn't even doing that well with the 3DS currently. Its sad to watch. Its like watching your drunk friend try and fist fight a bear while his opponent is waiting with his friends who wanted to see the fight.
One more thing I'll point out is this. A PS Vita is $250. The cheapest memory card (4GB) is $20. 2 games will run you $80(because buying just one would be silly, there are really 2 games that matter on the Vita at this point with not much down the pipeline yet). That's $350. I could buy an iPad mini for $330 and a treat myself to a bunch of games ranging from 1 dollar crap to $15 console ports. Hell, Infinity Blade II on the iPad is only 7 bucks and looks better than any 3DS game or most PS Vita games that cost $40. With plenty of popular indie PC games getting iPad versions for $5 a pop.
The Vita when it comes too it is too expensive for either market. One the gaming market, the 3DS is $90 cheaper with selection of standby sequels that people can enjoy (Pokemon, etc). One the other side of that its more expensive altogether than an Apple product with much less bang for the buck. With the same processor that the Vita has but custom made for Apple products. Sorry, but the Vita needs a price drop. Just as badly as the 3DS needed it.
Your preaching to the choir son, go and read post nine, notice how I include everything except a price drop? Because despite you believing that cost of the internal hardware is irrelevant (when it really isnt) and trying to compare it to phones and games that are not in the same class (I was comparing the value of the individual hardware components only) the price of the hardware is fine. The price of the memory cards is the only cost issue. If all you own is a Blackberry Curve you have little experience of mobile tech so you might want to reign the opinions in a little.AzrealMaximillion said:
See, you'd have a point about smartphones and gaming handhelds not being in the same class if gaming on the phones hadn't completely flipped the handheld gaming market on its head. You can't deny that, very soon, phones and tablets are going to make traditional handheld gaming devices obsolete. The games are getting to be a lot more than Angry Birds and flash game ripoffs, and very quickly too. You also can't say that games on the phone/tablet devices don't rival 3DS or PS Vita games. They do. And they're competitively priced. $40 a game is pushing it for a lot of titles that come out on handhelds these days.J Tyran said:
And to your "post 9". That's a shoddy way of fixing the Vita's sales problem.
First,simply lowering the price of memory cards doesn't change the fact that the Vita is $90 more than its competition, the 3DS. It would help sales, but not in a majorly significant way. The 3DS costs less and has internal memory built in.
Secondly, more games is a must. It's pretty much the only point I agree with you on. The Vita is saved in one part by being accessible to the large library of PS1/PS2 Classics and PSP Classics in the PS Store. The Vita is also hurt by this in a sense due to the fact that if you owned a PSP before, you have to buy games you own on UMD for your Vita again. This, again, loses out to the 3DS having not only access to its own virtual console store, but also being backwards compatible with DS/DSi games. Again, at $90 less.
Thirdly, the fact that you'd suggest that people should have to spend more money on the PS+ subscription on top of the $250 plus a memory card is asinine. Even if Sony took up your ideas of having a cheaper memory card and more games, adding the PS+ price on top of that hardly makes it an attractive deal. Sure, the discounts are nice and the free games (while at most times aren't that great) are there, but you're effectively saying that Sony should hope that people are willing to spend easily over $300 on the Vita and hope to see it compare to the 3DS in sales. That my friend is a joke. Especially when the discounted game prices on the PS+ for certain games, rivals that of the normal prices of games on the 3DS' online store.
You're trying to sell me the idea of buying a Vita while ignoring its main competitor, the 3DS. And I'm not even a Nintendo fan as people on these forums know. Hell, I don't even like the 3DS and you're still failing to convince me that the PS Vita has more bang for its buck. If you stack the 3DS against the Vita, it's a no brainer which one people are more likely going to throw their money at. You just get more with the 3DS, even if you lower the price of the Vita memory cards, even if there were more games on the Vita, even with PS+ stuff added. Look at it like that. Don't look at the Vita as the handheld with the great processor that the slightly premium phone today has. Look at it compared to the 3DS. All in all, the 3DS is the much more attractive deal at $90 cheaper. Just having internal memory alone makes the 3DS the easy buy.
Right... try again. The reason I have a Blackberry Curve is because I don't need my phone to have touchscreens and all of that. I just need a phone that can access email, send messages, receive and make calls, take pictures, and check Facebook with ease. It's still classified as a smartphone, and can still do all of those things better than the PS Vita. Didn't cost me $250 plus cost for memory storage up front and I'm fine with it. I've got enough experience with mobile tech to make a judgement.
The Vita is too expensive. If you still think that the Vita costing $90 more than its only other handheld competitor isn't a factor in its sales, well, I'll just have to chalk that up to some form of buyer's remorse at this point.
The way phones are growing no it wont be long before the obsolete handheld consoles, they are already almost there. Whats holding them back in none of the mobile devs seem that interested making games that would make the most of the performance on offer, its easier to make a general Android/iOS game than make a game designed to take advantage of the bleeding edge in the latest phones.AzrealMaximillion said:
I wouldn't necessarily agree that the Vita and 3DS are in the same market either, the games are different and the user base is different. A cliche example would be comparing the PS3 to the Wii, no necessarily in hardware power but in the difference between the games and intended audience. Not that "core gamers" (silly term) do not enjoy Wii games and Wii players would hate PS3 games, personally I loved Super Mario 3D land. If you made the argument that one of the Vitas main problems might be that large numbers of people dont want a handheld with a full console experience I would find it hard to disagree, lack of market in the first place might be its main stumbling block.
Back to the Vita vs 3DS though, do you own either? I can tell you now apart from side scrollers and typical DS style games the controls on the 3DS can be a wonky pile of crap with no second analogue stick, neither is as it as powerful and the battery is about the same. The touch screen on the Vita is far better, the 3DS uses antiquated tech. Online support is typically Nintendo, PS+ or not the Vita is solid for online play and the store is well designed. It also costs less because it is less. Note that I did not say "bad" or "worse" just that in terms of hardware Nintendo where able to build it cheaper and that Nintendo let it down with online support. Please don't try the "buyers remorse" shtick either and at least be honest with yourself, the only reason that anyone wanting a smartphone would own a Blackberry Curve in 2013 is because they are on a budget. Nothing wrong with that at all, people have different priorities and needs but if you are unwilling/unable to buy a decent phone its coloring your perception of how expensive the Vita actually is.
Sorry, but as soon as you said this,J Tyran said:
, you lost any point to continue debating here. If you're not going to acknowledge the fact that both the 3DS and the Vita are competitors in the same market, then you can't really compare the Vita to any other mobile device on the market at all. Besides its gaming capabilities, its inferior in everyday to the features of any modestly priced phone on the market. It's also inferior in the same way to most tablets on the market, with gaming almost rivaling the Vita on most tablets to begin with. But you won't accept a comparison to either a phone or a tablet, so I brought up the most logical device to compare it to. The 3DS. Now you're saying that it's not accurate to compare the two because of their customer bases? That's bull. Both are marketed to people who want a handheld gaming device. Just because the games on each are different in terms of the kinds of game library they have, doesn't make the Vita in its own category. Its a mobile gaming device, just like the 3DS is, so its in the same market. Your PS3 vs Wii analogy doesn't work in this instance because, let's face it, the handheld gaming market has always relied on exclusive software to sell. The console market is a different story. You could make the argument that the PS3 and the 360 have different customer bases, and they do, but exclusives on consoles are so low in number compared to 3rd party multiplarform games that to say that the console market is comparable to the hamdheld market would take an extreme stretch in logic to accept.
You're taking the same approach to defending the Vita's price as Sony is with marketing it. And that's a pretty crappy way of defending the Vita's price. The only thing that you keep bringing up in terms of why the Vita is priced so high is its processing power and its OLED touchscreen. That's no excuse for the price to be so high when, as I said before, the iPad Mini has the same processing chip and can do what the Vita can do outside of gaming in a much, much better fashion. This is all while costing less than is you were to purchase a Vita, an adequate sized memory card, and just 2 games.
And you keep bringing up the fact that I own a Blackberry Curve to try and paint a picture of me not knowing tech, which is a sad argument to make. It's sad because it makes you look like you assume that anyone who doesn't have an iPhone or a Samsung Galaxy doesn't know tech, which is an asinine and shallow assumption to make. I've had this phone for over a year and a half out of my 2 year contract. I'll be getting a new phone quite soon, not that it'll automatically bestow me with extra mobile tech knowledge, because sir, that's not how it works. Sorry, but having the best stuff doesn't make you a better person to talk to about tech. If it did, than Kim Kardashian would be a more suitable person to talk to about tech than yourself, and we both know that's no true, so drop the superiority act.
You seem to be ignoring almost every point on how the Vita is, in many ways, technologically inferior to almost every mobile device on the market that doesn't focus on gaming. And as we both seem to agree on, in a couple years time most mobile devices are going to be able to make the Vita look obsolete even in the gaming department. By then, those same devices will probably by at a lower price point than the Vita's current. Even now, some of those devices are closely priced and almost equally capable to the Vita in gaming. On the flipside, you don't even count the Vita as a competitor to the 3DS, and that alone is a massively flawed way of defending the Vita's price for a number of reasons I already mentioned.
If you look at the Vita as just a mobile device, besides its processing power which A) you won't stop gushing about and, B) its the only thing you seem to be able to say has any reasoning for the Vita's price, its outdated in a big number of ways. If you look at the Vita vs. the 3DS it has a much smaller accessible library thanks to a lack of internal memory and no backwards compatibility, and its higher price point. You've got to look at the Vita compared to something because its not good enough to warrant its own special niche of mobile device at its price point. It needs a price drop, badly.
I'm looking at it from a consumer's point of view. Why would someone get a handheld device that would run them well over $300 instantly when they could spend less of that money on many other options that each do what the Vita does better in more ways than one? You keep thinking of that processor's power while the moms, dads, girlfriends, and boyfriends think of their wallets while shopping, and we'll see how many people give a damn about the Vita at $250 plus cost of a memory card and games.
My credibility has gone because I understand that similar product =/= same market, ok. As for being outdated it is in only one single area, the cameras. Which are just there for the silly AR gimmick, the launch problems with the browser have been patched out. You have not been able to come up with one single solid reason why it should be cheaper, all you got is "The 3DS with its cheaper hardware cost is cheaper so the Vita should be cheaper". The iPad mini argument is even worse, I wont even acknowledge it. If I was and was going to use your argument I would argue how a laptops even better than the iPad, oh and its an iPad mini. If you really wanted to be clever you would have pointed out something like the ASUS/Google Nexus 7 for around £150 as an example of good value mobile tech, but thats people behind the tech curve for you.AzrealMaximillion said:
If you can come up with anything other than how the handheld console thats made from cheaper parts is cheaper please enlighten me.
The Vita is a handheld gaming system. The 3DS is a handheld gaming system. They both are out at the same time and, therefore, are in competition. The 3DS has a lower cost and more games which tend to attract people so the Vita is getting stomped atm.J Tyran said:
If the Vita were to follow your honestly well thought out suggestions, possibly giving third party publishers funds to make ads for their own games, thus getting the system in people's heads, the Vita might start to sell better.
Also, anyone know if the Street Fighter 4 or Marvel vs Capcom 3 ports for the Vita are any good?
On top of the need for price cuts and more games, there's one problem that's being severely overlooked at the moment: I don't wear cargo pants. I have room in my pockets for my phone, a handkerchief, keys, my wallet and my 3DS. I don't have any convenient way to carry a Vita, and I'm sure I'm not the only one in that situation.
So you've basically ignored that a brought up the 3DS' ability to do more out of the box than the PS Vita for less. Interesting. Look it's on thing to not agree and I understand that, but you're ignoring majors flaws in the Vita's very design that make it unattractive for the price its at.J Tyran said:
If you can't agree that the Vita's lack of internal memory and backwards compatibility make it much less appealing, along with its higher price, then there's no point in continuing this discussion. You won't even accept the fact that its in the same market as the 3DS, which is really just ignoring literally half of the handheld gaming market cometition to prove your point. Sorry, but until the Vita sees a price drop, it will continue to lose sales to the 3DS and lose Sony money. End full stop. You can argue that it needs games all you want, but 3rd party developers want the Vita to sell more before putting games on it. Otherwise they lose money due to lack of a decent Vita base.
It's also why the PSP's best selling franchise, Monster Hunter, has jumped ship to the 3DS. It's sad that there's not even a PS Vita high enough user base for franchises that helped keep the PSP relevant to sell well on. And its the price that's holding people back. Consumers AND developers.