Sony Outsells Nintendo For First Time Since The PS2

[FalloutJack]

It still feels like they are winning because the competition is struggling. On the upside maybe this means we will finally start seeing some of those titles that drifted to Nintendo start seeping back into the Playstation Ecosystem.

The competition is struggling because of bad decisions, the same situation that Sony was in during the early days of the PS3. Really, Nintendo and Microsoft have no one to blame but themselves for their current states, even if Microsoft is still a close second with the XBone.

In one of Moviebob's Game Overthinker episodes he makes a case that the whole reason Sony rose to prominence during the days of PS1 and PS2 is primarily because the competition made similarly bad decisions that put Sony in a better light. I'm not sure how much I agree with that but it is worth noting that Sony's machine is the most attractive right now, maybe not for the games, but for the policies backing it up.

That's a good point. The PS1 was basically born out of a bad Nintendo decision (CD drive? fuck that!) and the PS2 was up against the unfocused gamecube.

Now, the PS4 was up against so many terrible Microsoft and Nintendo decisions, that people are praising it for doing stuff that WE HAD IN THE PREVIOUS GENERATION!

I'm told Playstation development in Sony's hands was originally because when Sony and Nintendo were developing it in tandem, Nintendo lost faith in the project and pulled out. That being the case, wouldn't the entire history of the Playstation be a good reason for Nintendo to be kicking itself harshly?

 

[Roxas1359]

I'm told Playstation development in Sony's hands was originally because when Sony and Nintendo were developing it in tandem, Nintendo lost faith in the project and pulled out. That being the case, wouldn't the entire history of the Playstation be a good reason for Nintendo to be kicking itself harshly?

Well both sides in that partnership had their faults, but Nintendo ended up being the biggest dicks in the end. What happened was Sony was asked to make the CD attachment for Nintendo after Ken Kutaragi made the S-SMP sound chip for the SNES (he did it in secrecy), that chip was the entire reason the SNES had such great sounding music. Well in the initial deal, Sony would have gotten more money from the resulting games published for the device, giving them more control over it than Nintendo. Nintendo didn't like that, but instead of renegotiating the contract Hiroshi Yamauchi went behind the scenes and struck a deal with Philips, who were Sony's main competitors at the time.

What happened next damaged Nintendo's image in Japan for 10 years actually. At the 1991 Consumer Electronics Show Sony had shown off the new "Playstation" CD attachment for the Super Nintendo, but the next day, after Sony had already announced it, Nintendo said in the conference that they were ending their deal with Sony and partnering with Philips. This not only damaged Sony's pride, but in the Japanese business world it was seen as disrespectful of Nintendo. As a result most of Sony wanted to no longer deal with the video game business, but Ken Kutaragi got support from Sony's then CEO Norio Ohga who felt disrespected and thus the Playstation began development. Yamauchi then made mistakes with the N64, making it purposely difficult to develop for, using expensive cartridges, etc to try and only get the best to develop for the system thinking that the success of the SNES would be enough. That put Sony in an excellent position to showcase their new console, which while it was weaker than the N64, the storage was extremely cheap and a lot larger than what the N64 cartridges could offer. Other 3rd parties jumped because of how Yamauchi had treated the other companies, and the rest is history.

Fast forward to the 7th Gen and you'll see Sony makes the same mistakes Nintendo did with the N64 when it came to the PS3 and you see the roles reverse. Quite ironic when you think about it, although I'm convinced that every third entry for consoles seems to make the stupidest decisions ever. Nintendo did it with the N64, SEGA did it with the botched Saturn launch and support, Sony did it with the PS3 at launch, and Microsoft did it with the Xbox One at launch. Seems the number 3 invokes stupidity, so no wonder why Valve isn't releasing Half-Life 3. XD *puts on tin foil hat*

 

[Hairless Mammoth]

I'm told Playstation development in Sony's hands was originally because when Sony and Nintendo were developing it in tandem, Nintendo lost faith in the project and pulled out. That being the case, wouldn't the entire history of the Playstation be a good reason for Nintendo to be kicking itself harshly?

The ironic thing about that is the contract Nintendo signed let Sony have all the rights and profits to the games developed for the CD add on. After a re-read Nintendo secretly made a deal with Philips behind Sony's back to make another CD drive and (from what I've heard) relieved that add on at E3 right before Sony was to go on stage announcing their partnership with Nintendo. The Philips deal also failed, but Philips got the rights to some of Ninty's characters for a couple years.

So yeah, both Sony and Nintendo have a harsh but brief history together. And Nintendo is still probably kicking themselves behind closed doors everyday they don't post a profit for the facts that Sony is their competitor and there are a few horrible games out there staring their highest profile characters(thankfully for the world on a early 90s system that tanked and went under the radar until the internet opened that pandora's box and Nintendo's wounds). The Sega of yesteryear might still be alive today mismanaging as they always did but surviving as the console maker one step behind Ninty if Sony didn't enter the fray.

Remember kids, today's lessons are: read your multi-million dollar contracts thoroughly and don't go behind your business partners' backs without first confronting them about any discrepancies in said contracts. They might have the know how, contacts, and financial resources to become your biggest competitor overnight.

Edit: Doh', Ninja'd by Neronium and his awesome Brooke avatar.

 

[Dreadman75]

While I'm not going to deny that there is some weight behind that assessment, I still think that Sony had more to do with their own successes. Instead of throwing in the towel when Nintendo first snubbed them and their CD tray design, they went into business for themselves and kicked ass with the PS1. Then with the PS2 they simply took the PS1, upgraded it, added in a DVD player and it became THE best selling console of all time. Now we have the PS4 which, on top of being powerful, also decided to stay the course on consumer relations.

They had a console that functioned as a CD player when CD players were still on the rise. They had a console that functioned as a DVD player when DVD was still on the rise. To cap that off, they tried the same thing with the PS3, and it hurt them bad initially. This isn't strong thinking, it's the same thinking which sometimes happens to coincide with the cultural zeitgeist.

Right now, Sony's selling well in what was already expected to be a hot market by simply not screwing up as much.

And they only "stayed the course" if you ignore the PSP/PS3/PSVita.

I honestly think your giving Sony too little credit with this. But if that's what you think then who am I to judge? I just think Sony is a little bit more business savvy than you believe they are.

 

[Roxas1359]

relieved that add on at E3 right before Sony was to go on stage announcing their partnership with Nintendo.

Actually it was worse for Sony, as Nintendo revealed that they had made the partnership a day after Sony had already announced the CD add-on with Nintendo, and Nintendo revealed it and shocked everyone. That's why it damaged Nintendo's business image in Japan more than it would have if Nintendo had gone first and Sony had gone second.

Also, you never deal with a Ninja like me! >
And yay, someone else who knows it's Brook!

 

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

too bad none of it is due to Sony; hard to NOT be a winner when you get lucky with your main competitors having a couple of stumbles (Nintendo) or outright making bad PR decisions (MS). It's the same thing with the PS1 and PS2 eras; Sony got lucky due to Nintendo going with cartridges with the N64 and SEGA also stumbling around. However, when they WERE up against legit competition, Sony kind of revealed themselves to be paper tigers. Congrats Sony, you've gotten a shallow victory, one that was gotten when you're in deep financial trouble.

It still feels like they are winning because the competition is struggling. On the upside maybe this means we will finally start seeing some of those titles that drifted to Nintendo start seeping back into the Playstation Ecosystem.

If you're talking consoles, well duh, those never left the PS ecosystem. Handhelds on the other hand, don't count on it, not when the 3DS is outnumbering the Vita 5 to 1.

 

[Strazdas]

Sony is first in a race. but its not hard to be first when your competition is a man missing a leg and a man who likes to ram nails into his legs whenever he gets the time.
Also is PC so far ahead that everyone forgot about it being in the race?

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Unsurprising, Nintendo is having a conga line of shit luck recently and not so recently.

 

[SilverUchiha]

It still feels like they are winning because the competition is struggling. On the upside maybe this means we will finally start seeing some of those titles that drifted to Nintendo start seeping back into the Playstation Ecosystem.

The competition is struggling because of bad decisions, the same situation that Sony was in during the early days of the PS3. Really, Nintendo and Microsoft have no one to blame but themselves for their current states, even if Microsoft is still a close second with the XBone.

In one of Moviebob's Game Overthinker episodes he makes a case that the whole reason Sony rose to prominence during the days of PS1 and PS2 is primarily because the competition made similarly bad decisions that put Sony in a better light. I'm not sure how much I agree with that but it is worth noting that Sony's machine is the most attractive right now, maybe not for the games, but for the policies backing it up.

I'll give you Microsoft has made some bad decisions within the past year they're working on making up. But what bad decisions has Nintendo made other than a weak marketing campaign for their new console? Fact is, the console itself is really good and the games I have managed to play on it are very fun. It's just no one is willing to support the device because no one is willing to develop for the device. And no one is developing, because no on is buying.

 

[Rozalia1]

Sony is first in a race. but its not hard to be first when your competition is a man missing a leg and a man who likes to ram nails into his legs whenever he gets the time.
Also is PC so far ahead that everyone forgot about it being in the race?

Why do you ask these things when you know the reason why? Find a static product and post its figures, than you can put them in the "race".

 

[Dreadman75]

It still feels like they are winning because the competition is struggling. On the upside maybe this means we will finally start seeing some of those titles that drifted to Nintendo start seeping back into the Playstation Ecosystem.

The competition is struggling because of bad decisions, the same situation that Sony was in during the early days of the PS3. Really, Nintendo and Microsoft have no one to blame but themselves for their current states, even if Microsoft is still a close second with the XBone.

In one of Moviebob's Game Overthinker episodes he makes a case that the whole reason Sony rose to prominence during the days of PS1 and PS2 is primarily because the competition made similarly bad decisions that put Sony in a better light. I'm not sure how much I agree with that but it is worth noting that Sony's machine is the most attractive right now, maybe not for the games, but for the policies backing it up.

I'll give you Microsoft has made some bad decisions within the past year they're working on making up. But what bad decisions has Nintendo made other than a weak marketing campaign for their new console? Fact is, the console itself is really good and the games I have managed to play on it are very fun. It's just no one is willing to support the device because no one is willing to develop for the device. And no one is developing, because no on is buying.

Perhaps Nintendo's biggest mistake thus far is that it hasn't done a good job 'selling' it's console. They can't sell the idea of the WiiU to developers because of it's limited specs and unusual control scheme. Add to that they haven't done a good job of trying to branch their console out to try and bring in a new audience, they've just stuck with their usual lineup of Zelda, Mario...etc. I literally can't name one game on the WiiU that isn't from one of Nintendo's powerhouse franchises. That isn't good no matter how you look at it.

 

[Vault101]

Perhaps Nintendo's biggest mistake thus far is that it hasn't done a good job 'selling' it's console. They can't sell the idea of the WiiU to developers because of it's limited specs and unusual control scheme. Add to that they haven't done a good job of trying to branch their console out to try and bring in a new audience, they've just stuck with their usual lineup of Zelda, Mario...etc. I literally can't name one game on the WiiU that isn't from one of Nintendo's powerhouse franchises. That isn't good no matter how you look at it.

not to mention it doesnt have what the Wii had...the "casual" audience...theyve all moved on to smart phones and tablets, so now instead of a must have accesory its just another game console... when you think about it that was pretty much the Wii's saving grace (at least as far as I can tell)

 

[Dreadman75]

Perhaps Nintendo's biggest mistake thus far is that it hasn't done a good job 'selling' it's console. They can't sell the idea of the WiiU to developers because of it's limited specs and unusual control scheme. Add to that they haven't done a good job of trying to branch their console out to try and bring in a new audience, they've just stuck with their usual lineup of Zelda, Mario...etc. I literally can't name one game on the WiiU that isn't from one of Nintendo's powerhouse franchises. That isn't good no matter how you look at it.

not to mention it doesnt have what the Wii had...the "casual" audience...theyve all moved on to smart phones and tablets, so now instead of a must have accesory its just another game console... when you think about it that was pretty much the Wii's saving grace (at least as far as I can tell)

The WiiU definitely isn't the family console the Wii was that's for sure. Nintendo's become rather insular lately haven't they? It's like they're no longer interested in the goings on of the gaming industry at large, just content to do their thing for however long they can. In a way I both respect and pity that attitude. I just wish they'd let the other consoles have Bayonetta 2! I loved the first game and I want to play the sequel without buying a WiiU dammit!

P.S. This is kinda late but welcome back Vault101! Love the new Avatar. Songbird and Bioshock Infinite ftw!

 

[Vault101]

The WiiU definitely isn't the family console the Wii was that's for sure. Nintendo's become rather insular lately haven't they? It's like they're no longer interested in the goings on of the gaming industry at large, just content to do their thing for however long they can. In a way I both respect and pity that attitude. I just wish they'd let the other consoles have Bayonetta 2! I loved the first game and I want to play the sequel without buying a WiiU dammit!

P.S. This is kinda late but welcome back Vault101! Love the new Avatar. Songbird and Bioshock Infinite ftw!

I just didn't see who the WiiU was for outside of die hard nintendo fans, "core" gamers probably arent interested because it gets a tiny share of the games coming out....and as I said the casual audience isn't interested because theyre all playing angry birds. All that said I thourght ipads were the stupedist thing ever when they came out so yeah....I do wonder what it would be like if they brought out the WiiU alongside the 360 and PS3...eh

[sub/]also thanks, its one of my personal favorites...it took a while too[/sub]

 

[Strazdas]

Sony is first in a race. but its not hard to be first when your competition is a man missing a leg and a man who likes to ram nails into his legs whenever he gets the time.
Also is PC so far ahead that everyone forgot about it being in the race?

Why do you ask these things when you know the reason why? Find a static product and post its figures, than you can put them in the "race".

what do you mean by static product?

 

[Something Amyss]

I honestly think your giving Sony too little credit with this. But if that's what you think then who am I to judge? I just think Sony is a little bit more business savvy than you believe they are.

That "belief" is based on evidence. I don't know why you think I should give them more credit than evidence affords. They have tried the same business strategy both before and after, meaning there is no real reason to believe their success had anything to do with any sort of savvy.

But you're right. You're free to believe in Sony's savvy, a flat Earth, or the flying spaghetti monster if you want. Just don't try and relegate evidence-based beliefs to that level, please.