Square Enix Subpoenas Valve Over Deus Ex Leak

[deathstrikesquirrel]

I do not see why people are making a big deal of this, or why I am posting here in the first place where am I? whaaaaaaaaaaaaa ;A;

 

[Enrathi]

God... really Square? Are you being this fucking stupid?

What's next, firing off all the developers after the game releases because they encouraged those who did download this leak to post on the games official forums? Are you really getting pissed over something that has actually BOOSTED your initial sales figures for the game?


Hell, if you don't want money that badly, just pull a Ninteno (Of America) and just refuse to release the game at all.

I agree with you but think of it this way:

1) leak appears on the net Square gets all pissy about it and decides to bash at Valve for info.
2)Valve won't give in until SE subpoena's them which they continue to do so.
3)???
4)Profit! from suing a bunch of people, getting more popularity and more money in their greedy pockets.

I am really damn sick of the whole lawsuit thing i mean really money this and money that it reminds me way too much of the ZEITGEIST: moving forward video about how damn greedy the world is getting to be like and all because of damn money.

Maybe you have it all wrong. Square-Enix realizes that Valve isn't at fault. Valve can't just hand over a persons personal details and so the proper method to obtain those details is a subpoena. Square-Enix has a right to be pissy, someone stole from them and it's within their right to seek restitution. You may be sick of the whole lawsuit thing but I'm sick of all the leak and hacking thing. People need to sit the fuck down and be patient like the rest of us, if they do something illegal and get caught then I hope they get taken to the cleaners.

I was just rambling on about how annoying it is for a lawsuit to be involved when instead the culprits can be arrested and detained or heck serve community service for all i care but as long as it doesn't involve a lawsuit for money because it just shows greed for currency as a means to an end instead of just punishment which serves just as well.

Personally I think it's more the fact that the only way to get through to some people is to punish them where they'll feel it most. Either jail time to take away their freedom, or sue them to make them pay huge sums of money.

It also attempts to make an example of them to others so they'll be less likely to do something similar in the future (though that doesn't really seem to work very often). If you knew you could go to jail for X years or end up getting sued for so much that you'd effectively be broke for the rest of your life, wouldn't that make you think twice about doing it?

EDIT: When an individual does it for something stupid (McDonald's hot coffee, anyone?) I completely agree that it's just for money and not worth the court's time. In a case like this though, I feel it's justified.

 

[fanklok]

So many people don't understand this. Square aren't being the bad guys they're doing exactly what they have to do. Someone stole their shit so now they're going after them, I haven't heard anything about the Dues Ex demo being removed from every site ever (haven't been paying much attention) so they probably realize how much it's helped sales. VALVe can't just give out information all willy nilly without violating a bunch of privacy laws and completely ruining their customers trust and faith in them so the subpoena lets them give out the info needed to catch whoever took the game without doing anything illegal.

TL;DR Square knows the leak sold more games, but are putting their foot down because stealing their shit isn't cool. VALVe is helping in a legal way, looking like a neutral third party in the process.

 

[Gather]

There was a surprisingly fitting line Sam Carter said in Dues Ex while I was replaying it... And it was about terrorism. "Never negotiate with terrorists. You will only encourage more acts of terrorism."

How that could apply in this little case (As been said before, many, many times); someone broke the law and just because it actually was beneficial means they get off scott free? Ignoring it is rewarding the person who leaked the game and all that will do is encourage him/her to do it again.

Imagine, if you will, a what if situation; "What if the game wasn't as good as it was?"

In my opinion, it would actually damage the game and hurt sales... Not to mention ruin the companies image.

 

[Ranorak]

S-E: Hey, Valve, can we have that person's info?
Valve: Well, I'd like to give it to you, but I can't, legally.
S-E: Ah yes, of course, Mhmmm...
Valve: You know, you could always Subpoenas us... nudge nudge, wink wink.


End of story, no one is being a bad guy.
Except of course for the hacker, stealing someone's identity (if I read the article right), stole personal data off of a machine he had no right to use, and published this.

 

[captainwalrus]

I was just rambling on about how annoying it is for a lawsuit to be involved when instead the culprits can be arrested and detained or heck serve community service for all i care but as long as it doesn't involve a lawsuit for money because it just shows greed for currency as a means to an end instead of just punishment which serves just as well.

I don't think the guy broke any criminal statutes. He just, supposedly, had access to the press release demo and released it onto torrent sites. It's a breach of contract, which isn't a criminal offense. Square is legally only able to seek monetary remuneration.

 

[Azaraxzealot]

Drop it Squenix, the possible outcomes aren't pretty:

1. it was a dumb kid who did it from his house and his own account

outcome: you nailed an adolescent, way to take a bit out of crime mcgruff while simultaneously making yourselves look like a petty assholes

2. it was someone slightly smarter who used a new account with fake into over some free wifi

outcome: you looked stupid and wasted a whole bunch of time while simultaneously making yourselves look like a petty assholes

--------------

bonus points: by crying havoc and unleashing the dogs of war/lawyers you made the leak a much bigger, longer lasting news story than it originally was which will only increase the number of people who know about it

see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect

you can't take something back from the internet, might as well spin it to make yourselves look good

you do realize that the subpoena is actually a way to make sure valve stays OUT of trouble, right?

OT: well, it's a good thing Square knows that valve isn't responsible, god knows what the fanboys on this site (which is more than 90% of it) would do if valve suffered even a tiny bit.

 

[duchaked]

Valve knows what a big leak is like, so things should be working out between the two developers/publishers

funny tho, the leaked videos might be what re-grab my interest in the game

 

[Bloodstain]

So what's wrong with that? I would do the same if I were Square Enix.

If someone does something that costs you millions of dollars, you are going to get him.

 

[Sigmund Av Volsung]

Frankly, if I was in Squ-Enix's positions, I wouldn't sweat so much, beacuse logically, this torrent probably only was a demo at best; but what Enix don't realize is that they could use this to their advantage, for example:

1. The Pirates will be hungry for more content and will be (probably) relying on a full torrent when the game is released.

2. HOWEVER; if Square-Enix pulls a "Batman: Arkham Asylum" on this by restrciting certain abilities if the person doesn't register the game(s special code), the pirates will naturally want to buy the game.

3. The company will make an embarasing ammount of money, and could probably write off this mess as an unintented marketing ploy.

Aren't I right?

P.S. But if they use part 2, us PC gamers might be in danger of having to sift through GFWL.

 

[Katana314]

Someone needs to film the reaction when they find out that the Deus Ex leak actually convinced a significant amount of people on the fence to buy the full version.

Good luck finding some tangible proof of such a thing.

I think this seems fair enough...I mean, Valve could help them find the hackers, obviously. I just worry someone will come storming in, rude comment in mind, forgetting that "subpoena" doesn't mean to charge someone with a crime.

In todays world, a simple poll acts as tangible evidence, no matter how much it's not. I mean, politicians pass laws based on polls after all, I don't see why a simple poll wouldn't work here.

...Not really. That's why we vote with our wallets, not with our polls. If someone put up a poll saying "Is Call of Duty the BEST THING EVER?" it would likely get a negative response. Yet, if a new Call of Duty game came out, it would sell millions because of its marketing.

Deus Ex could be popular, it could be unpopular. Pirates could all say they "surely played it only because they played the demo", and just as many people could decide against buying it "because the beta sucked". There is no proof of association or cause of popularity, and polls are not a valid way of establishing it.

 

[scott91575]

I was just rambling on about how annoying it is for a lawsuit to be involved when instead the culprits can be arrested and detained or heck serve community service for all i care but as long as it doesn't involve a lawsuit for money because it just shows greed for currency as a means to an end instead of just punishment which serves just as well.

I don't think the guy broke any criminal statutes. He just, supposedly, had access to the press release demo and released it onto torrent sites. It's a breach of contract, which isn't a criminal offense. Square is legally only able to seek monetary remuneration.

You do realize it's copyrighted material that he is disseminating, right? He supposedly impersonated someone in order to obtain a copy of something he had no right to have. If I acted like you and stole your Steam account, would you think I did nothing wrong? The guy stole the game, and sent out copyrighted material. He did all kinds of illegal acts.

Now, it't not up to SE if he is prosecuted for those acts, but can initiate civil action. I believe it's up to the DOJ if they want to charge him criminally, but once he is identified they could do just that since they won't have to do much leg work to determine who it was.

 

[The Youth Counselor]

I've heard five freaking stories about how the leak occured.

1. A disgruntled developer for Nixxes which is porting the game to the PC, grabbed a hard drive with the press demo inside and never returned to home or work.
2. A journalist with a press demo over Steam gave his friend access to his account. Said friend starts bragging on /b/ about access and ends up leaking the demo over torrent sites.
3. Hackers from Italy breached a journalist's press account through Steam.
4. Hackers from Russia breached a journalist's press account through Steam.
5. A demo disk for a journalist disappeared.

So really what damages arose from this leak? Why all the contradicting stories. I actually pre-ordered the game just because of videos of the leak.

This is the Deus Ex series after all, a franchise whose story is all about conspiracy theories. I conclude that the leak was an inside job, and a brilliant way of marketing the game.

Becuase its still ILLEGAL. The damages accorded are completely irrelevant. Just because a robber breaks into your house but doesn't Steal anything, doesn't mean he shouldn't be arrested.

Did you understand my post? I wasn't questioning the legality the leak situation. I'm questioning the fact whether there actually was theft involved.

I believe the press demo wasn't "leaked" but instead was intentionally put out on torrents by the marketing behind Square Enix. (A brilliant guerilla marketing tactic id software has been doing for decades, and David Fincher recently did for his remake of The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo. Similarly EA Games and Dark Horse comics faked boycotts and protests for their controversial Dante's Inferno and Satan's Sodomy Baby.)

It's terribly convenient that the "leak" came so close to the game's release, features only 1/3rd of the full game (and by reports can be well over 8-10 hours by itself) and that Eidos moderators on their own forums allow people to post about it and even encourage bug reports. It's a way to demonstrate a demo without actually releasing one, and strum up hype for the game, and beta test and gauge audience reactions without impunity for a buggy product. "Eidos releases Deus Ex: Human Revolution demo" won't make the headlines but "Hackers release unfinished version of Deus Ex" Human Revolution will".) And now they're probably continuing a charade of hunting hackers just for show and make more headlines and gain publicity.

How come HR is the only game leaked out of all the demos that might've been on the supposed Steam account or out of Square Enix? Because it's Deus Ex. In the Deus Ex universe a secret cabal would go as far as to fill up all of the orange soda slots with lemon lime in a vending machine because they know that a secret agent's favorite soda is orange and get angry from it. Likewise hackers won't just steal a copy of a game and release them on the internet, a secret cabal would release it on the internet and blame it on hackers.