Stuff you couldn't get away with in 2020

Specter Von Baren

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Mighty Max. Loved that cartoon, and it was so much more imaginative than your typical 90's cartoon. It also had some really dark crap in it and I can't imagine a little kid like Max being put into the situations he was would fly today.

The episode that always sticks out in my mind is the prison/cyclops episode.

 

Jarrito3002

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Oh yes, it fucking does! Especially bad dubs from the 90s.

I am glad someone brought of Sailor Moon because I am going to take this concept and work it in reverse.

Steven Universe could not of been made in the 90s and early 2000s especially the 90s. Just imagine all the gems and their same sex love and relationships being censored and retcon to them all just being really really really really affectionate cousins. That trash fire will burn so bright.
 

Neuromancer

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Steven Universe could not of been made in the 90s and early 2000s especially the 90s. Just imagine all the gems and their same sex love and relationships being censored and retcon to them all just being really really really really affectionate cousins. That trash fire will burn so bright.
At least then we wouldn't have to deal with that fanbase.
 

Dalisclock

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Funny: the two leads in this are not middle aged, but they are very normal looking people. This is juxtaposed with them speaking to each other as if he's 007 and she's a "Bond girl" which is very disorientating! Might be part of why this unusual and beautiful movie did such poor box office.

But yeah. Could Richard Dreyfus be a leading man in today's Hollywood?

I mean, for me, the movie had a lot of interesting directions it could have gone in and pretty much chose none of them. Hell, apparently in the comic the female lead is supposed to be from Mideveal France and Valerian met her there and took her back to the future with him, because time travel is apparently part of their job. That's an interesting backstory that I don't think is remotely alluded to in the film.

Also, the whole thing about the pearls and their hyper-tech aptitude came across as unjustified. They can take a half destroyed ship they've never seen before and make it spaceworthy and, you know, support life within hours of their planet being destroyed and the air running out. Despite living on a tropical beach just before that, not a setting that screams "We can look at something and figure it out instantly". Smart I can buy, Miracle worker you gotta show me something to make me buy into it.

And the Apollo capsule at the end just raised a big fucking eyebrow, mostly for the "Wait, seriously?" Yes, I get it's supposed to be the same one from the intro but holy gads does that not make any sense.

It's a beautiful movie with an interesting premise...and it's bland and confusing as shit beyond that.
 
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gorfias

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I mean, for me, the movie had a lot of interesting directions it could have gone in and pretty much chose none of them. Hell, apparently in the comic the female lead is supposed to be from Mideveal France and Valerian met her there and took her back to the future with him, because time travel is apparently part of their job. That's an interesting backstory that I don't think is remotely alluded to in the film.

Also, the whole thing about the pearls and their hyper-tech aptitude came across as unjustified. They can take a half destroyed ship they've never seen before and make it spaceworthy and, you know, support life within hours of their planet being destroyed and the air running out. Despite living on a tropical beach just before that, not a setting that screams "We can look at something and figure it out instantly". Smart I can buy, Miracle worker you gotta show me something to make me buy into it.

And the Apollo capsule at the end just raised a big fucking eyebrow, mostly for the "Wait, seriously?" Yes, I get it's supposed to be the same one from the intro but holy gads does that not make any sense.

It's a beautiful movie with an interesting premise...and it's bland and confusing as shit beyond that.
Lots to critique there as you note. But much worse, more boring, dull and unimaginative movies (Transformers: I'm looking at you) have made a ton of money. Why did this bomb so hard? There are many possible reasons, including the ones you note. It doesn't help that this was financed in a non-traditional manner, making the powers that be angry. EDIT: That backstory you reference for the female lead is intriguing. I'll have to look for what I can about the comics.

Trying to figure if this site is full of viruses! https://viewcomics.me/comic/valerian-the-complete-collection
 

Dalisclock

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Lots to critique there as you note. But much worse, more boring, dull and unimaginative movies (Transformers: I'm looking at you) have made a ton of money. Why did this bomb so hard? There are many possible reasons, including the ones you note. It doesn't help that this was financed in a non-traditional manner, making the powers that be angry. EDIT: That backstory you reference for the female lead is intriguing. I'll have to look for what I can about the comics.

Trying to figure if this site is full of viruses! https://viewcomics.me/comic/valerian-the-complete-collection
Oh, I'm not going to defend Transformers at all, and I'll give Valrien credit for trying to be creative even if the execution left a lot to be desired. I actually watched Valerian to the end.....while I couldn't even get through the first Transformers movie because I found it stupid and Shia LaBeaufs character was annoying and unlikable IMHO.

It probably came across as too weird for a most moviegoers and not enough people really took a liking to it as a cult following(if any). Then again, I can't remember if the 5th element was successful or not either. I know that movie actually got people's attention, though having star power(Willis, Oldman, Jovovich) probably helped a lot there, but it was generally a bit more conventional in structure and plot.

Dune was also a failure, but it did garner a cult following as well but that's an entirely seperate topic and we have a Dune thread going right now elsewhere on the forum, so I won't derail the topic talking about it here.
 
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Specter Von Baren

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Oh, I'm not going to defend Transformers at all, and I'll give Valrien credit for trying to be creative even if the execution left a lot to be desired. I actually watched Valerian to the end.....while I couldn't even get through the first Transformers movie because I found it stupid and Shia LaBeaufs character was annoying and unlikable IMHO.

It probably came across as too weird for a most moviegoers and not enough people really took a liking to it as a cult following(if any). Then again, I can't remember if the 5th element was successful or not either. I know that movie actually got people's attention, though having star power(Willis, Oldman, Jovovich) probably helped a lot there, but it was generally a bit more conventional in structure and plot.

Dune was also a failure, but it did garner a cult following as well but that's an entirely seperate topic and we have a Dune thread going right now elsewhere on the forum, so I won't derail the topic talking about it here.
It is still a grave sin that they did not have the Transformers song in that first movie.
 
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Dalisclock

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I am glad someone brought of Sailor Moon because I am going to take this concept and work it in reverse.

Steven Universe could not of been made in the 90s and early 2000s especially the 90s. Just imagine all the gems and their same sex love and relationships being censored and retcon to them all just being really really really really affectionate cousins. That trash fire will burn so bright.
And that's before you get into a lot of the other, darker themes in the show.

Like pretty much everything we learn about Rose after "We all love your mom, Steven. Too bad you never got to meet her". Especially Spinel and Pearl being Pink/Roses personal slave who was programmed to serve her forever, thus putting Pearls suicidal and reckless devotion to her in a very different light

Also, the last season(Future, not Season 5) is pretty much Steven dealing with his untreated PTSD, Savior complex and lingering issues with his mom gaslighting everyone including him, not something you really expect to see from a kids show.

How does the Joke go again?
Season 1: Steven is sad his favorite Ice Cream has discontinued.
Steven 5: Steven goes on trial for his moms war crimes.
Movie: Steven finds out his mom abandoned Spinel in an abandoned garden for 6000 years, causing her to completely lose her shit and become a lethal joke character intent on killing everyone Pink ever loved in fury
Future: Steven needs therapy. Like, lots of therapy.
 
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Jarrito3002

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And that's before you get into a lot of the other, darker themes in the show.

Like pretty much everything we learn about Rose after "We all love your mom, Steven. Too bad you never got to meet her". Especially Spinel and Pearl being Pink/Roses personal slave who was programmed to serve her forever, thus putting Pearls suicidal and reckless devotion to her in a very different light

Also, the last season(Future, not Season 5) is pretty much Steven dealing with his untreated PTSD, Savior complex and lingering issues with his mom gaslighting everyone including him, not something you really expect to see from a kids show.

How does the Joke go again?
Season 1: Steven is sad his favorite Ice Cream has discontinued.
Steven 5: Steven goes on trial for his moms war crimes.
Movie: Steven finds out his mom abandoned Spinel in a garden for 6000 years, causing her to completely lose her shit and become a lethal joke character intent on killing everyone Pink ever loved in fury
Future: Steven needs therapy.
Pretty much SU was a great ride and had its up and downs but I am so glad it exist. Like the last season was all the hero stress on Steven just mentally tearing him to shreds and it makes so much.

And yes Spinel deserved so much better and its interesting how Rose was character development in reverse.
 
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gorfias

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Oh, I'm not going to defend Transformers at all, and I'll give Valrien credit for trying to be creative even if the execution left a lot to be desired. I actually watched Valerian to the end.....while I couldn't even get through the first Transformers movie because I found it stupid and Shia LaBeaufs character was annoying and unlikable IMHO.

It probably came across as too weird for a most moviegoers and not enough people really took a liking to it as a cult following(if any). Then again, I can't remember if the 5th element was successful or not either. I know that movie actually got people's attention, though having star power(Willis, Oldman, Jovovich) probably helped a lot there, but it was generally a bit more conventional in structure and plot.

Dune was also a failure, but it did garner a cult following as well but that's an entirely seperate topic and we have a Dune thread going right now elsewhere on the forum, so I won't derail the topic talking about it here.
The Fifth Element came in 25th domestically in 1997.
Even I got through Pirates 3. I too couldn't stomach Transformers. I hear the latest Bumblebee movie is actually good but can't motivate myself to watch it even free on demand.
 
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BrawlMan

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The first Hangover movie. Granted the sequels sucked and I don't even bother with the first one much anymore. I still have not seen the third movie, nor do I want to. Good luck trying to get a film like that released in today's climate.
 

Chimpzy

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Making Women in Comic Book Superheroes hot and sexy:
Not really sure what you're on about. Has tig bitty supermodels dressed in bodypaint stopped being the default for lady capes? Cuz I just had a look at comics released these past weeks. Not seeing any shortage.
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
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Making Women in Comic Book Superheroes hot and sexy:

I think you're conflating 'things you can't get away with anymore' with 'things some people will complain about'.
I hear the latest Bumblebee movie is actually good but can't motivate myself to watch it even free on demand.
It's like having a nice Fruittella after licking the bathroom floor; certainly better, but not exactly nourishing. You're better off just watching The Iron Giant again.