The Big Picture: Combat Evolved?
- Thread starter MovieBob
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Yeah, this always confused me. Why are the COGS supposed to be the good guys when they're the ones invading the Locust's home world? The games would have been a lot more interesting if instead of playing as a human you played as a Locust soldier, trying to take back your planet.unacomn said:
Interesting stuff. I don't think any of that was intentional but I can see the correlation. For me the difference comes with choice. The Covenant races didn't have any, they were converted. For the Spartan's they chose to become part of the ultimate in protection. Choice is everything. That is what makes the Covenant a threat. If they had showed up at Reach and said "hey you guys wanna play intergalactic UN with us?" and accepted whatever answer we gave, that would be ok. The fact that they came to conquer and enslave us, well that pretty much makes them an enemy. Regardless of their multiracial ranks.
Interesting points and I can't say I've thought of them before. I never really considered the covenant as any sort of multicultural society at all. I've always viewed them as, basically, a brainwashed religious cult.
Now there's a question for you. Which is better, the religious cult or the nazi-esque fascists?
Now there's a question for you. Which is better, the religious cult or the nazi-esque fascists?
A third show MovieBob?
Anyway, something that you do completely fail to mention is that the "real" bad guys of the Haloverse are the Flood (granted the Flood aren't in Reach). And what is the Flood? From the viewer's standpoint you could consider them a blend of zombies (a rabid, generic mob) and a sentient superorganism (which as you mentioned is basically the most conformist society that could possibly exist).
And yes, the overtly fascist nature of the UNSC is meant to be a negative thing. However, the UNSC itself isn't necessarily a "good guy". It's all morally ambiguous in the backstory really, even the Prophet of Truth is just doing what he thinks is best for the Covenant (he's like Hitler in many ways). Most of the time though (especially in the games) moral ambiguity sort of fades away in the need for survival. This is a story about war after all, genocidal war at that.
Anyway, something that you do completely fail to mention is that the "real" bad guys of the Haloverse are the Flood (granted the Flood aren't in Reach). And what is the Flood? From the viewer's standpoint you could consider them a blend of zombies (a rabid, generic mob) and a sentient superorganism (which as you mentioned is basically the most conformist society that could possibly exist).
And yes, the overtly fascist nature of the UNSC is meant to be a negative thing. However, the UNSC itself isn't necessarily a "good guy". It's all morally ambiguous in the backstory really, even the Prophet of Truth is just doing what he thinks is best for the Covenant (he's like Hitler in many ways). Most of the time though (especially in the games) moral ambiguity sort of fades away in the need for survival. This is a story about war after all, genocidal war at that.
Hmm okay I see your point, it does seem that the spartans represent a fascist force. But that doesnt make the covenant good guys either. The european empires of the past used a large amount of forces from their conquered territories to fight for them so they could conquer more. That is not multi culturalism or diversity, that is a people being exploited by a more capable people for the conquerors own ends.
This reads like something I'd make up when I'm desperately trying to finish an English paper hours before it's due in.
If there's a subtext of fear of unified races in the game, it's only because you've cherry-picked it out.
I'll be the first to admit that Halo doesn't have a good story. That said, I disagree with your conclusion that the game is, even unconciously, promoting the fear of unified races. Look at this from a gameplay standpoint and you'll see it's simply for a variety of things to shoot at, and to have to face enemies with different strengths and weaknesses.
What about in 2 and 3 where you end up allied with the Elites?
What about considering that they're only unified under a fundamentalist religion that started the thing in the first place?
Why don't we notice these subtexts? Because they're not really there. Throw me a Dicken's novel or a Shakespeare play and I'll have it including any subtext you want, as well as predicting the moon landing.
"If you look long enough into the void the void begins to look back through you."
If there's a subtext of fear of unified races in the game, it's only because you've cherry-picked it out.
I'll be the first to admit that Halo doesn't have a good story. That said, I disagree with your conclusion that the game is, even unconciously, promoting the fear of unified races. Look at this from a gameplay standpoint and you'll see it's simply for a variety of things to shoot at, and to have to face enemies with different strengths and weaknesses.
What about in 2 and 3 where you end up allied with the Elites?
What about considering that they're only unified under a fundamentalist religion that started the thing in the first place?
Why don't we notice these subtexts? Because they're not really there. Throw me a Dicken's novel or a Shakespeare play and I'll have it including any subtext you want, as well as predicting the moon landing.
"If you look long enough into the void the void begins to look back through you."
I never really picked up on the Humans being atheist, and I saw the error of the Covenant as not being religion itself but rather misguided religion. But one thing I kept noticing was all the biblically named stuff... The Ark, The Covenant, The Flood, Eden gets a mention, Halo itself, etc. Not entirely sure what (if anything) they were trying to do with it, though.sagacious said:
Wow, I love Escape to the Movies, and reading Intermission! Big Picture was very, very good and I can't wait to see more of it!!
From what I saw in this episode, this series is "The Game Overthinker" dressed up so Screw Attack doesn't sue.Delusibeta said:
As many of the people in this thread have pointed out, Bob may have been putting way too much thought into the game and noticed subtext that wasn't intentional. That's pretty much the whole point of "The Game Overthinker" and, by extension, this new show. No, it's not likely that this was intentional and no, Bungie aren't fascists. The point is that you can learn a lot about a culture by closely examining subtext present in society. I wouldn't call this show funny, but it's definitely enlightening and entertaining.
So what they've done is give Mr "bob" a free ride, and a show about absolutely nothing?
I like it.
I like it.
Interesting, got potential, but todays big picture was "Racism is bad, and Halo sucks."
It could get better.
It could get better.
I loved the video! I'm a huge Halo fan and, to be perfectly honest, it's refreshing to see someone with an actually well-constructed opinion on it beyond 'OMG MY HALOZ BE OWNING YOUR CODZ COZ COD SUX!'
However, I think his point about the Fascist undertones, i.e. the uniform human military forces against the diverse and racial diverse Covenant, was a little bit, for lack of a better term, weak. The Covenant, however diverse in terms of SPECIES, are fighting against the UNSC, the United Nations Space Command, which represents the entirety of the HUMAN race. European people, African people, Asian people, Arabic people, Latin people, Americans, Russians; everyone, of every descent is fighting against the Covenant for survival of the HUMAN race.
Other than that, every point he made was valid, certainly more so than others I've heard. Great work Bob, I love it!
However, I think his point about the Fascist undertones, i.e. the uniform human military forces against the diverse and racial diverse Covenant, was a little bit, for lack of a better term, weak. The Covenant, however diverse in terms of SPECIES, are fighting against the UNSC, the United Nations Space Command, which represents the entirety of the HUMAN race. European people, African people, Asian people, Arabic people, Latin people, Americans, Russians; everyone, of every descent is fighting against the Covenant for survival of the HUMAN race.
Other than that, every point he made was valid, certainly more so than others I've heard. Great work Bob, I love it!