The Big Picture: Destined for Disappointment, Part 1

MovieBob

New member
Dec 31, 2008
11,495
0
0
Destined for Disappointment, Part 1

MovieBob looks at the overuse of "Destiny" as a plot point in recent superhero movies.

Watch Video
 

Evonisia

Your sinner, in secret
Jun 24, 2013
3,258
0
0
The Star Wars prequels? Hmm, I guess Anakin's fall into the Dark Side was part of some destiny, especially since all of the other characters predicted it and actively tried to stop it, leading to Anakin only being pushed further into it because the only comforting voice to him was that of one of the last notable figureheads of the Dark Side.

But good episode, it didn't even seem like an excuse to bash The Amazing Spiderman again.
 

Zero Serenity

New member
Nov 21, 2009
120
0
0
Now that is one hell of a stinger. I think I see where its going since almost nothing is connected to Vader from my he get go.
 

Ashley Blalock

New member
Sep 25, 2011
287
0
0
Yea I'm really tired of Hollywood lazy. This destiny bit nicely nails how fictional universes are getting smaller and less interesting by the concept. It even seems to creep into cartoons.

So since we are ripping Hollywood a new one can we have an episode about how lazy and uncreative writers are for just kill enough bad guys, robots, or aliens to call it an ending?
 

Chris Mosher

New member
Nov 28, 2011
144
0
0
You do seem to be making an assumption that the turtles were created as part of SOMEGUY'S (or as I call him, the GOD of character actors William Fichtner) plan to create heroes. Okay, but the trailer does not say this, only that he created the ooze. It does not say that the ooze coming into contact with the turtles was his intention. But I may simply be giving the movie the benefit of the doubt because the Michelangelo mask scene made me smile.
 

Avaholic03

New member
May 11, 2009
1,520
0
0
I can't wait to see how you justify the Star Wars prequels as a good use of destiny as a plot device. If anything it skews in the completely wrong direction. Instead of condensing a story/motivation like destiny typically does (so a film can jump right into the action without focusing so heavily on the "why"), they padded that inevitability out into three relatively pointless movies.
 

templar1138a

New member
Dec 1, 2010
894
0
0
I completely despised your review of "Into Darkness" because of how much it came across as fanboy butt-hurting, but I will grant you that they did play up the destiny thing (especially because I've recently been gorging on episodes of the original series and can more readily see the differences).

Also, like so many others, I'm surprised your example of almost doing it right is the Star Wars prequels. But that's only because I'm used to everyone but me having nothing but bile for them. In terms of overall plot, I do feel that Lucas did it right. The dialogue and the progression of the romance could've been a lot better, but still. I'll be interested to see what points you raise.
 

MovieBob

New member
Dec 31, 2008
11,495
0
0
"Thirsty for the rest." It doesn't make sense otherwise if it's not from the one explaining it. Hope to see it soon. BTW, Bob: when will you make that 2nd part of MARVEL MESS you promised but got sidetracked by Bioshock Infinite? Cliff-hangers...
 

Rakschas

New member
Jan 7, 2013
45
0
0
Nice Bob, but here is my question:

Why can you argue the matrix did not rely on prophecy and fate, but statistical proability, when the oracle set neo on his path by her choice of actions, but at the same time say this is not the case when future spock, a vulcan and being capable of supreme foresight and logical calculations sends kirk and his younger self on their path? He is basically the humanoid equivalent of a supercomputer.
 

twosage

New member
Oct 22, 2013
61
0
0
Man of Steel has got to be the worst recent offender. It wasn't enough for Kal-El to be sent to Earth as a baby to be an idol for humanity, the last (or one of the last) survivor(s) of a dead planet with incredible powers beyond those of mortal men... but he's also the DNA Jesus of Krypton, too.

Was there really anyone in that writer's room that genuinely worried that Superman wasn't special enough already?
 

templar1138a

New member
Dec 1, 2010
894
0
0
Ashley Blalock said:
So since we are ripping Hollywood a new one can we have an episode about how lazy and uncreative writers are for just kill enough bad guys, robots, or aliens to call it an ending?
Hollywood's had that one ripped for a while. Ever watched Mystery Science Theater 3000? Schlock has always existed and always will.
 

Gabanuka

New member
Oct 1, 2009
2,372
0
0
Not to be 'That Guy' but:

'Buddhist karmic destiny'

Karma in the Buddhist sense has no relevance on your destiny, at least not in the sense that
'You did good in a previous life so this next one is gonna rock.'

Karma is the notion that wholesome actions create a wholesome state of mind, unwholesome actions create an unwholesome state of mind. There can be no destiny in Buddhism since everything is impermanent, a person's future can't be mapped out.
 

templar1138a

New member
Dec 1, 2010
894
0
0
Rakschas said:
Nice Bob, but here is my question:

Why can you argue the matrix did not rely on prophecy and fate, but statistical proability, when the oracle set neo on his path by her choice of actions, but at the same time say this is not the case when future spock, a vulcan and being capable of supreme foresight and logical calculations sends kirk and his younger self on their path? He is basically the humanoid equivalent of a supercomputer.
I think the main thing about the Matrix NOT being an example of destiny done right is that the plot isn't very interesting or innovative. Admit it: We didn't go to see the Matrix for the plot. We went to see it because it had more ammo than the Battle of Normandy. And from what I understand, people didn't go see the Spiderman reboot for plot either. They went to see it because Spiderman.

And now there will a Turtles movie. Directed by Michael Bay. Who in their right mind is planning to see THAT movie for the plot?
 

Tireseas_v1legacy

Plop plop plop
Sep 28, 2009
2,419
0
0
I think this can be summarized into two major points:

Bad use of destiny: Whereby certain events happen because they need to happen and not because they would happen (Star Trek, Amazing Spiderman[footnote]Not willing to put TMNT on this until after the movie premieres and we can determine if this point is valid[/footnote]).

Good use of destiny: Whereby the character's arc tries to grapple with destiny in an attempt to defy or change it (Oedipus Rex, Star Wars I-III).
 

MB202

New member
Sep 14, 2008
1,157
0
0
I'm actually not sad about what he said about Harry Potter, because it's actually kind of true... not to mention, he actually apologized for it, unlike other Internet personalities who basically say the same thing without remorse (the Nostalgia Critic and Nostalgia Chick come to mine). Nice cliffhanger at the end, though now everyone assumes he's either joking because it's April Fool's Day or already upset that he's going to say something positive about the Star Wars prequels, despite Bob saying that they ALMOST got it right. ALMOST, not 100%.
 

GalaxianEX

New member
Jul 11, 2011
1
0
0
Is it because in the Star Wars prequels Anakin was the "chosen one" and that he was going to "bring balance to the Force", but no one ever bother to elaborate what that means, and because it was the good guys who kept repeating it, everyone assumed it meant something good, but, in an universe in which the Sith numbered less than 5 and the Jedi in the thousands, "bringing balance to the Force" could have meant taking the Jedi down a peg or two?
 

Uratoh

New member
Jun 10, 2011
419
0
0
On destiny, I must bring up a quote from Valkyrie Profile's Lezard Valeth...

Destiny? Ha! I prefer to forge my own path in life, and call it destiny once the cards have settled.
 

MovieBob

New member
Dec 31, 2008
11,495
0
0
My wife and I saw Divergent (Ugh...) a week or two ago, and I thought it had the most pointless shoe-horning in of Destiny there ever was. The main character is Divergent, which means she's not shoe-horned in to one of the five groups (Even though any one can choose which group they go into) so they want to kill her. This Destiny bit has almost nothing to do with the rest of the movie. It makes her really good at the dream stuff, but they could have just said she was really good (Or she could lucid dream, something many people can do).

It just made me weary, and it was only 15 minutes into the movie. "We can't give you a good reason you should care about this character, so she's just the chosen one."