The Big Picture: Feeding Edge
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My concern isn't the genetic engineering of food, but the amount of preservatives that are put in most foods that people consume today. You hardly get any nutrition from it because it needs to retain its shelf-life.
The breeding thing I already knew, but the carrots, that I didn't. Thanks, Bob.
There's a food shortage in the world, and there will probably come a time where we all must be as efficient with food production as possible. Therefore, geneteic engineering is a good thing.
Gotta love science.
There's a food shortage in the world, and there will probably come a time where we all must be as efficient with food production as possible. Therefore, geneteic engineering is a good thing.
Gotta love science.
...The more you know.
OT: Although it was short it did hit the mark. I swear that the major news networks get together like every month to discuss the next big "mass scare" with various segments of the food, health, and security industries.
OT: Although it was short it did hit the mark. I swear that the major news networks get together like every month to discuss the next big "mass scare" with various segments of the food, health, and security industries.
You may think Star Trek, I think Dune.
You may think "for the good of mankind", I think "for the good of the monopolist".
It's not really a scientific problem, it's an economical and social one.
While a farming dynasty can, say, breed the perfect sheep for their benefit, Monsanto and others genetically engineer crop and vegetables to dominate the market.
They even go so far as to "unsex" plants so that they don't produce new seeds which have to be bought for a hefty price every damned year again and sustainability and independence go overboard.
I only fear the day when Monsanto's Sardaukar-crops have eliminated all and every "organic" AKA traditional alternative and some African farmers have to go Fremen on His Imperial Highness' corporate ass.
You may think "for the good of mankind", I think "for the good of the monopolist".
It's not really a scientific problem, it's an economical and social one.
While a farming dynasty can, say, breed the perfect sheep for their benefit, Monsanto and others genetically engineer crop and vegetables to dominate the market.
They even go so far as to "unsex" plants so that they don't produce new seeds which have to be bought for a hefty price every damned year again and sustainability and independence go overboard.
I only fear the day when Monsanto's Sardaukar-crops have eliminated all and every "organic" AKA traditional alternative and some African farmers have to go Fremen on His Imperial Highness' corporate ass.
HankMan said:
I'm guessing he was referencing that quote. I would have tried to get a clip from the cliff scene to make it more obvious, but hey, joke made.Inigo Montoya said:
OT: I am constantly getting into arguments about this and organic food with family members. It's all pretty silly once you boil it down.
Good show, too bad most of the people on The Escapist are logically sound. If only you could get this onto Oprah or Dr. Phil, thats where all the stupid people that need to here this reside
First of all allow me to say that I completely agree with everything stated in this video. That being said:
While you're certainly correct that a large part of the controversy of GM crops is just ignorant fear-mongering your comparison with traditional farming isn't quite spot on. A big issue many people have is that agribusiness is taking traits from other species and splicing them into foods that said traits have never evolved in. Now that sounds a lot worse than it actually is but there is still some cause for concern. GM is still a technology in its infancy and we still don't have a good idea about what a lot of genes do or how they interact with one another. So yes, there is plenty of idiocy within the GM foods controversy but there is also a sliver of sense.
While you're certainly correct that a large part of the controversy of GM crops is just ignorant fear-mongering your comparison with traditional farming isn't quite spot on. A big issue many people have is that agribusiness is taking traits from other species and splicing them into foods that said traits have never evolved in. Now that sounds a lot worse than it actually is but there is still some cause for concern. GM is still a technology in its infancy and we still don't have a good idea about what a lot of genes do or how they interact with one another. So yes, there is plenty of idiocy within the GM foods controversy but there is also a sliver of sense.
I've never heard the term Frankenfood before.
The reason some people are scared of genetically engineered food is that, well, sometimes it's done not for better food, but for more food. In theory that's not a bad thing, even in practice that's a good thing.
But in some areas of the world, where, well, let's say there's no FDA-like entity, and morals are, well, they aren't, and people with money give money to people with knowledge so they can make more money, well there may be some mistakes in there somewhere. Mistakes can sometimes be harmful.
The reason some people are scared of genetically engineered food is that, well, sometimes it's done not for better food, but for more food. In theory that's not a bad thing, even in practice that's a good thing.
But in some areas of the world, where, well, let's say there's no FDA-like entity, and morals are, well, they aren't, and people with money give money to people with knowledge so they can make more money, well there may be some mistakes in there somewhere. Mistakes can sometimes be harmful.
Apples and Oranges here.
Your original example is of genetic alterations that could happen naturally.
Your second example is using techniques to create outcomes that could never happen in the natural world no matter how much a horse and a cow have sex.
Creating crops that produce their own insecticides (very powerful ones) is a bad idea. It creates shitty food and doesn't stop the insects.
So yeah, fun story, but comparing apples to oranges makes the rest of your point pretty weak.
Keep in mind, I love science (and your videos), but at least understand the topic enough to recognize the differences before you make a video about it :/.
PS. I think the word that sprung to my mind watching that video was "Pedantry".
Your original example is of genetic alterations that could happen naturally.
Your second example is using techniques to create outcomes that could never happen in the natural world no matter how much a horse and a cow have sex.
Creating crops that produce their own insecticides (very powerful ones) is a bad idea. It creates shitty food and doesn't stop the insects.
So yeah, fun story, but comparing apples to oranges makes the rest of your point pretty weak.
Keep in mind, I love science (and your videos), but at least understand the topic enough to recognize the differences before you make a video about it :/.
PS. I think the word that sprung to my mind watching that video was "Pedantry".
We don't tend to actually mass produce food with altered genes that we arn't sure about though.Sepiida said:
Generally speaking when a factory farm gets it's hands on something that works it starts using it wildly without giving a shit to get studies done.A Pious Cultist said:
Look at antibiotics and cattle.
I'm actually curious how many super bugs have been created just by our wanton misuse of things that would otherwise be quite wonderful.
Extra note on my original post: I'm for Genetic Engineering, I just think Monsanto and companies like it (IE basically just it) are not good choices to be performing it. When you hand very powerful science to stupid people with money you end up with cows stuffed full of antibiotics even when they aren't sick.
Totally what I wanted to say. Most of the legitimate fear over GMO's has to do with how MNC's such as Monsanto use this advantage to unfairly dominate the market, and thus either shut out most of the developing world from actual market competition, or by making every developing farmer a "forced client", as their seeds will not naturally reproduce. In short, Genetically Modified anything isn't inherently bad, it's just currently being used to do some pretty cruddy things.geierkreisen said:
Maybe I haven't been paying attention, but I never got the impression that people think genetically modified foods are anything but carrots and tomatoes and apples. I thought the impression is that they're unnaturally red tomatoes, unnaturally crunchy carrots, unnaturally.... red apples; like in those stories where you go into a town and everybody seems unnaturally happy and smiling but something seems off.
While as far as I can tell genetically modified foods are good and all, I seriously disagree with breeding being called genetic engineering. It's just not how the word is used. Just because a butterfly has the words butter and fly, doesn't mean I can go around saying butterfly and expect people to think of a fly made of butter. Or maybe a fly that's attracted to butter?
There are legitimate concerns regarding genetically modified foods that aren't so much a concern when you breed foods. We've made plants that produce their own pesticides. Genetically modified doesn't automatically mean it's evil, but it is different from just breeding foods.
Somebody already posted about this before me. This is a matter of definitions. If we don't agree on what words mean, we can't have a proper discussion. I wasn't 100% sure about this either; I looked up genetically modified and genetically engineered to make sure that my personal definition wasn't some construct in my mind that I imagined.
While as far as I can tell genetically modified foods are good and all, I seriously disagree with breeding being called genetic engineering. It's just not how the word is used. Just because a butterfly has the words butter and fly, doesn't mean I can go around saying butterfly and expect people to think of a fly made of butter. Or maybe a fly that's attracted to butter?
There are legitimate concerns regarding genetically modified foods that aren't so much a concern when you breed foods. We've made plants that produce their own pesticides. Genetically modified doesn't automatically mean it's evil, but it is different from just breeding foods.
Somebody already posted about this before me. This is a matter of definitions. If we don't agree on what words mean, we can't have a proper discussion. I wasn't 100% sure about this either; I looked up genetically modified and genetically engineered to make sure that my personal definition wasn't some construct in my mind that I imagined.
I'm all for gm-food that helps increase the size of crops. It's probably one of the most efficient ways of staving of starvation in underdeveloped countries. Unfortunately for those countries companies have also produced seeds that only give one harvest before new seeds must be bought, so unfortunately greed cancels out the advantages. At least for the people who need them the most. This has nothing to do with genetic engineering in particular of course. I believe it's the answer to any number of modern plagues. Releasing something, say, resistant against cold/disease etc into nature can have consequences however, so it's a good thing there are watchers.
