The Big Picture: Words for Nerds
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Considering how ridiculously competitive some people can get in online games I agree with the fact that nerds can be just as elitist jerks as any other group. Just try joining a game like League of Legends. Tell me how those PvP matches went when your team was losing. It can get stupidly out of hand some times, and yeah you may be thinking a bit deep into nerd psyche, but thats what you do in this segment I guess.
As for the whole meme thing. I think that has more to do with anonymity then anything else, as does the online gaming to an extent. I'd be far less likely to get mad at someone sitting next to me playing a fighting game then I am to freak out at a stranger across the internet.
As for the whole meme thing. I think that has more to do with anonymity then anything else, as does the online gaming to an extent. I'd be far less likely to get mad at someone sitting next to me playing a fighting game then I am to freak out at a stranger across the internet.
Couldn't agree more with #1. Coincidentally, I was recently watching a bunch of Batman/Superman/Justice League Animated clips on Youtube and one of my favorite scenes was the first meeting of Superman and Batman in "World's Finest" and how they managed to find out each other's secret identities. Superman just uses his x-ray vision and Batman slips a tracker on him and follows him to his apartment. It was a great example of how each of them can manage to top the other. Of course this had to be ruined by half of the comments being dedicated to the Great Batman vs. Superman War that constantly erupts whenever they're seen together. It even got worse in other scenes like when Robin #1 decided to quit being Batman's sidekick by punching him in the face, or Robin #2 managing to subdue a homicidal Batman (under Scarecrow's non-fear gas) and leaving him tied up on a rooftop. And let's not forget the Creeper sucker punch. I sewar, the number of "This is stupid" and "No way that would really happen" comments were really getting grating. Just get over it already.
Y'know, I'm finding it quite disturbing the number of people that defend their bullying under the "I'm not going to stop doing it, so you better learn to live with it" defense. Now, I'm also one who tends to think that parents tend to baby their children too much these days, but there's a difference between a general post on a forum directed to like-minded people all over the world and a particular post directed to a specific person who is being mentioned by name.EverythingIncredible said:
And bringing up how there are people in the world that are worse off seems to smell of a last desperate attempt to validate your argument. Because I can guarantee that as bad as any person's life is at any moment, somewhere there is someone whose life they'll believe is worse. The person suffering from a disease? They could say that at least they don't have to worry about their family being murdered. The people having their possessions taken away? They can say that they still have their health. Now I'm not trying to make light of anyone's misfortunes, just trying to point out how things could always be worse. Besides, kids are only going to worry about the threats that they come in contact with on a regular basis. So unless they live in or personally know someone that lives in that type of situation, why should they worry about it? Do you really think that if your child comes up to you crying about the bully that verbally embarrassed them in a lunchroom full of students, the proper response would be, "Well at least you're not being raped."
Wouldn't it get annoying to see the same in-joke being spammed in everything? What if I stated spamming variations of a picture of George Washington holding a flag that says "FREE JOHNNY"? What if a whole bunch of people started doing that in unrelated topics? Wouldn't that irritate you?bringer of illumination said:
I did look at what I said and I never stated that it wasn't okay to spam things other than ponies. In fact I stated the opposite. "Some people have to accept the fact that some people DON'T CARE about whatever obsession you might have." is applicable to anything.
TL;DR: Don't jump to conclusions because someone stated something that can be applicable to yourself.
Internet bullies:
Why would you say something on the net you wouldn't say to your friends in a pub, or at work, or to your family over dinner? Are you really that much of a two-faced coward hiding behind your screen that you don't realise that "it's only a joke" doesn't cut it? If it's not okay to say something, it's not okay, simple as.
Also, people you do care about might be looking at you and thinking less of you. Thanks to the magic of the internet, they may be doing this in several years' time. This includes future employers, university admissions tutors, romantic partners, voters, customers etc. Yes, people who can have a real impact on your life.
Even if you're careful about using pseudonyms and anonymous logins, get into the habit and you will likely slip up. You'll get drunk or something take your 4chan manners to Facebook. So, don't be a dickhead. Enlightened self-interest, if nothing else.
Why would you say something on the net you wouldn't say to your friends in a pub, or at work, or to your family over dinner? Are you really that much of a two-faced coward hiding behind your screen that you don't realise that "it's only a joke" doesn't cut it? If it's not okay to say something, it's not okay, simple as.
Also, people you do care about might be looking at you and thinking less of you. Thanks to the magic of the internet, they may be doing this in several years' time. This includes future employers, university admissions tutors, romantic partners, voters, customers etc. Yes, people who can have a real impact on your life.
Even if you're careful about using pseudonyms and anonymous logins, get into the habit and you will likely slip up. You'll get drunk or something take your 4chan manners to Facebook. So, don't be a dickhead. Enlightened self-interest, if nothing else.
Long posts occur because when your dealing with complicated issues, especially ones where you represent an extreme minority position, you need to try and cover everything (oftentimes more than once), justify it, and also in many cases head off criticisms and counter comments you know are going to be coming from experience to avoid re-hashing the same conversations you might have had 50 times before.
Likewise, so many links and such get imbedded into posts because of the whole "lol, prove it" thing. Truthfully I prefer to take the approach that the truth is out there and figure anyone with half a brain is going to look up what I tell them, but that rarely happens, so in many cases I wind up having to basically do the research for people even when it comes to well known, common sense.
As a writer of long posts, I felt the need to comment there.
Likewise, so many links and such get imbedded into posts because of the whole "lol, prove it" thing. Truthfully I prefer to take the approach that the truth is out there and figure anyone with half a brain is going to look up what I tell them, but that rarely happens, so in many cases I wind up having to basically do the research for people even when it comes to well known, common sense.
As a writer of long posts, I felt the need to comment there.
To break this up into smaller posts given the subject, I will now respond to the bit about bullying.
One thing to understand is that a lot of what your seeing on the internet is the result of an invasion into nerd culture. Your seeing the science fiction, fantasy, and video-game people aiming at an increasingly mainstream audience to make more money, and bringing in those ordinary people as casuals. This would be fine if it was turning these people into nerds and generally making them more accepting and like "us", but it's not. We largely see nerd media being changed and adapted to suit that mainstream audience. Right now we've literally got those "Bros" and "Frat boys" running around in our video games and being catered to more than we are in our video games and areas of escapism. As time goes on there is less and less in nerd culture directed at the nerds because like always we are heavily outnumbered by our very nature.
A lot of the racism, sexism, and other things you see is actually simply backlash to things being changed to be made more politically correct. The idea of a look of geek media was to let one's hair down and escape society and all that BS. Right now though as much effort is being put into making everything as generally appealing and inoffensive to everyone as possible, it's turning into the media that this was a counterpoint to. When things that were just intended to be fun, like say scantily clad women, start to come more and more under attack for the sake of the mainstream, that starts to slot people off. If people had just accepted nerd culture as it was, there wouldn't be this issue.
Complaints about things like the "noob tube" (due to the sign) are because they exist to make it so any casual player can sit down and score some kills in a FPS game, rather than having to master to nuiances of the game. when you see things like that appearing in the games to level a playing field, as opposed to demanding players rise to the challenge, it breeds resentment. After all why did someone spend years developing FPS skills if someone
can simply choose the right weapon and be competitive with you due to the code?
As time goes on you see less stuff being directed at the nerds and those outside of mainstream society, it isn't even a balanced thing where everyone can be happy, and anyone with half a brain sees it. While the incredibly liberal might see some individual aspects of this thing positively on their own, overall you have to understand your dealing with an invasion into a minority subculture that isn't being received well as they lose. Casuals playing video games and such has turned into a sort of intellectual equivilent of Isreal's takeover of The Gaza Strip. With the bitter resistance in an otherwise losing battle.
To be honest Bob, to some extent speaking out against nerd culture like you are, you sound very much like a sell out, since really with them changing everything there is little reason to be nice to the casual players who are basically pushing us out of our own intellectual playground the way it's happened in the real world. Your ultimatly defending that Jock Letterman Frat-Boy type, because the point is that he's now online, and him and his buddies are taking over our games while the companies we supported all this years turn on their fans and take their money (since there is more of it) figuring they can do without the nerd revenues that kept them alive if push comes to shove.
One thing to understand is that a lot of what your seeing on the internet is the result of an invasion into nerd culture. Your seeing the science fiction, fantasy, and video-game people aiming at an increasingly mainstream audience to make more money, and bringing in those ordinary people as casuals. This would be fine if it was turning these people into nerds and generally making them more accepting and like "us", but it's not. We largely see nerd media being changed and adapted to suit that mainstream audience. Right now we've literally got those "Bros" and "Frat boys" running around in our video games and being catered to more than we are in our video games and areas of escapism. As time goes on there is less and less in nerd culture directed at the nerds because like always we are heavily outnumbered by our very nature.
A lot of the racism, sexism, and other things you see is actually simply backlash to things being changed to be made more politically correct. The idea of a look of geek media was to let one's hair down and escape society and all that BS. Right now though as much effort is being put into making everything as generally appealing and inoffensive to everyone as possible, it's turning into the media that this was a counterpoint to. When things that were just intended to be fun, like say scantily clad women, start to come more and more under attack for the sake of the mainstream, that starts to slot people off. If people had just accepted nerd culture as it was, there wouldn't be this issue.
Complaints about things like the "noob tube" (due to the sign) are because they exist to make it so any casual player can sit down and score some kills in a FPS game, rather than having to master to nuiances of the game. when you see things like that appearing in the games to level a playing field, as opposed to demanding players rise to the challenge, it breeds resentment. After all why did someone spend years developing FPS skills if someone
can simply choose the right weapon and be competitive with you due to the code?
As time goes on you see less stuff being directed at the nerds and those outside of mainstream society, it isn't even a balanced thing where everyone can be happy, and anyone with half a brain sees it. While the incredibly liberal might see some individual aspects of this thing positively on their own, overall you have to understand your dealing with an invasion into a minority subculture that isn't being received well as they lose. Casuals playing video games and such has turned into a sort of intellectual equivilent of Isreal's takeover of The Gaza Strip. With the bitter resistance in an otherwise losing battle.
To be honest Bob, to some extent speaking out against nerd culture like you are, you sound very much like a sell out, since really with them changing everything there is little reason to be nice to the casual players who are basically pushing us out of our own intellectual playground the way it's happened in the real world. Your ultimatly defending that Jock Letterman Frat-Boy type, because the point is that he's now online, and him and his buddies are taking over our games while the companies we supported all this years turn on their fans and take their money (since there is more of it) figuring they can do without the nerd revenues that kept them alive if push comes to shove.
Watch the Scream 4 review and then this back to back. It is really funny. That said, why can't internet discussions be proper debates?canadamus_prime said:
Hear hear, Bob's assumptions on these things are rather annoying. Many nerds have been bullied no doubt, but being bullied or even 'different' is hardly a universal trait. Nerd or geek culture is defined by the media they love and the way they love it, nothing else.Zenron said:
By Bob's definition I would be more of a 'jock' than a nerd, just because I happened to be athletic and popular in high school... These concepts hardly even existed when I was growing up
kwagamon said:
ethaninja said:And now I'm going to make this Mega Quote even bigger by contributing to the thing.Uncompetative said:You just seem to want to argue about irrelevant stuff.ColdStorage said:
Let us look at how this started...
First, I quoted the part shown in bold and made a joke about the seemingly impossible to comprehend fictional programming language used to describe the fictional Matrix reality in the movie The Matrix - a work of fiction.StarStruckStrumpets said:
If you haven't seen it, I recommend it. It combines coding with kung-fu.
Maybe this joke was too geeky for you to find funny, I didn't care. I thought that the person I quoted would maybe get a laugh out of it. APL is also proof positive that computers are complicated - it requires a special keyboard to enter the programs which lacks any lowercase - so I was making an example of a computer system that is in use today that inspires technophobia in many programmers:
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APL_(programming_language)
You then speed-read both posts and jumped to the conclusion that I was talking about Quantum Mechanics. Even though this is a thread all about Information Technology being hard to use. Doubly ironic, given your later rant about PBKAC. At least you have made me laugh...
Even when I said it was not meant to be fact (how could it be when it is a fictional movie?), but a joke, you remained super-serious and seemed increasingly angry. I should have realised then that you just wanted a random argument (you were probably lonely and frustrated) and it would have been better if I had ignored your personal insults and bad language.
The worst I have said about you is that you are an idiot.
It seemed to be on topic for this thread as an example of someone who didn't know forum etiquette.
Finally, you revealed yourself to be quite subversive. Going back to a previous page that I wouldn't necessarily re-read to EDIT your earlier post so it looked like you had apologised before the posts I had made in response to the tone of your post 17)
Which would be more threatening if Neils Bohr hadn't died seven years before I was born. (Yes, I am that old)
This then made it possible for you to criticise me thus:
Here, there is more coarse language (actually, I don't mind being called a huge IT geek, it is quite flattering really), but the part I had a problem with - something I have not seen done on these forums before - is the part I emphasised in bold. Sure, people have lied in arguments / flame-wars before, but I have never seen them go back to change an earlier post so that what I had already said in response to it sounds mean and then bleat that I haven't apologised for the apparent fault of not realising that you would be speed-reading posts and that you would fail to understand that StarStruckStrumpets wasn't talking about this guy:ColdStorage said:
...or this guy:
...but this guy:
Hopefully, you will calm down, moderate your language and learn to read the posts you quote. It would save you from looking foolish.
