The Crusade
- Thread starter Xvito
- Start date
Recommended Videos
agreed just about every religon has had what it calls it's own personal Crusade
so hard to choose...
so hard to choose...
Which one there were several.
I can't really separate money, power and religion, since at the time of the crusades they went hand in hand, one of Henry VIIIs motivations for taking over was that the rich were giving their land to the church, to ensure themselves a place in heaven, not to mention how many saints and popes from the crusades era until the reformation, had all made very substantial contributions to the church.
So I guess what I'm asking is do you mean the motivations of the church, or the king?
I can't really separate money, power and religion, since at the time of the crusades they went hand in hand, one of Henry VIIIs motivations for taking over was that the rich were giving their land to the church, to ensure themselves a place in heaven, not to mention how many saints and popes from the crusades era until the reformation, had all made very substantial contributions to the church.
So I guess what I'm asking is do you mean the motivations of the church, or the king?
Yeah, the OP makes no sense. There was dozens of the bloody things. Some were more money motivated than others and some were actually driven be religion (or at least the status created from showing you believed the hardest).
The Childrens Crusade? That was purely for the pussy.
The Childrens Crusade? That was purely for the pussy.
As UJoe said (kinda): which one?
I haven't looked at it much, but the crusades did seem to be about religion. Up until the taking of the holy land Muslims had been attacking and often conquering a lot of traditionally Christian areas - North Africa, the Middle East, Spain [http://www.sunnahonline.com/ilm/seerah/0075_popup9.htm], southern Italy [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Islam_in_southern_Italy], Constantinople [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Constantinople_(718)]. The only reason there hadn't been a Christian response until then was in fact those other reasons: money; power; the concerns of each state (you didn't want to start a fight with the Mohammedan a few thousand kilometres away when your much bigger worry was France next door, for example.
The Christian world had been fighting itself for centuries over the usual grievances and each little king often saw the fellow Jesus lover across the border as a bigger threat than Islam. One of the biggest impetuses for the Crusades was that religious piety and Christian togetherness was becoming much more important, from the masses to the nobility.
I haven't looked at it much, but the crusades did seem to be about religion. Up until the taking of the holy land Muslims had been attacking and often conquering a lot of traditionally Christian areas - North Africa, the Middle East, Spain [http://www.sunnahonline.com/ilm/seerah/0075_popup9.htm], southern Italy [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Islam_in_southern_Italy], Constantinople [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Constantinople_(718)]. The only reason there hadn't been a Christian response until then was in fact those other reasons: money; power; the concerns of each state (you didn't want to start a fight with the Mohammedan a few thousand kilometres away when your much bigger worry was France next door, for example.
The Christian world had been fighting itself for centuries over the usual grievances and each little king often saw the fellow Jesus lover across the border as a bigger threat than Islam. One of the biggest impetuses for the Crusades was that religious piety and Christian togetherness was becoming much more important, from the masses to the nobility.
Only the firstborns inherited ---> other children were left with nothing ---> "What about a trip to somewhere to pillage and gain land? ---> "Yay!" ---> off they go with the noble excuse of converting pagans.
Though I'm sure there was lots of fanatics motivated only by religious reasons.
Though I'm sure there was lots of fanatics motivated only by religious reasons.
*Groan*Xvito post=18.72830.774775 said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_crusades
Come back later.
[/thread]
Once I've done my exams I'm taking a Year 8 history class for one lesson with a friend as a joke between myself and my teacher. So only for an hour, during that hour I'm going to tell them a lot of random bits of historical information. To get an idea what they wanted to learn about I asked a few of them one of them said "That thing where the English went and killed lots of (I'm just quoting here) funny looking people in turbans."
I stood there looking aghast at him and told him to wikipedia the Crusades, or better yet go get a book on it from the library.
I know someone in a historical reenactment group, maybe I can borrow a musket from him and load it in front of the class for them. Sans bullet of course.
I stood there looking aghast at him and told him to wikipedia the Crusades, or better yet go get a book on it from the library.
I know someone in a historical reenactment group, maybe I can borrow a musket from him and load it in front of the class for them. Sans bullet of course.
Errr.. Rossadti- the Orthodox church seperated from the Catholic Church somewhere around the fourth or fifth centuary. Not any point during the Crusades- somewhere during the Dark Ages.
As for the actual Crusades- they were an amalgamated mix of factors- some truly did want to turn back the Islamic tide (Much as the Normans did in Sicilly, and the Spainish in Iberia. Others were just out for a fight. Others were in for political gain. And some wanted to pillage, loot and have fun. And there are a host of other reasons.
As for the actual Crusades- they were an amalgamated mix of factors- some truly did want to turn back the Islamic tide (Much as the Normans did in Sicilly, and the Spainish in Iberia. Others were just out for a fight. Others were in for political gain. And some wanted to pillage, loot and have fun. And there are a host of other reasons.
My bad, didn't no too much on the Great Schism at school (or in fact ever). Found the source of my confusion:Fondant post=18.72830.774865 said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East-West_Schism
"Western cruelty during the Crusades, the capture of Constantinople in 1204, and the imposition of Latin Patriarchs made reconciliation more difficult."
I knew there was a crusade that went and sacked Constantinople and I knew that the East and West churches finally formally split sometime after it. Indecisive fucks seem to spend more time fighting over who loves Christ the right way than murdering non-Christians. I didn't realise they'd essentially been arguing about it for the preceding 700 years.
I really doubt that. Given peoples desire to generally fight whether it be for loot, personal glory, religious or political reasons. I doubt yelling 'For Pie!' has quite the same effect on people as 'Aaaargh!' or more likely 'For the King/God'. Still it'd be a strange world if 'religious' wars were started over pie.Danzorz post=18.72830.774906 said:
Although there'd probably be either a lot more wars or considerably fewer than normal.
The 3 (or 4) main Crusades were for what every war ever fought was for: power, land, wealth.
The only difference was the reason used to justify it: religion.
The only difference was the reason used to justify it: religion.
I'm guessing you mean the 3rd crusade, anyway it was many things.
1- New lands for noble knights who were second sons.
2- Rich lands to be plundered.
3- "Freeing" the holy land from constrictive control (if those motives were pure or not is questionable).
4- Something to do, hothead soldiers are going to get into trouble somewhere, make it as far away as you can.
5- Pie, he's right you know (Danzorz).
Talking to rossatdi the crusaders weren't just killing non-Christians at Constantinople. Constantinople was the first Christian city, you might be thinking of Acre.
As you may have guessed from my name this a part of time that I find interesting. What?s annoying is finding two sources that agree.
1- New lands for noble knights who were second sons.
2- Rich lands to be plundered.
3- "Freeing" the holy land from constrictive control (if those motives were pure or not is questionable).
4- Something to do, hothead soldiers are going to get into trouble somewhere, make it as far away as you can.
5- Pie, he's right you know (Danzorz).
Talking to rossatdi the crusaders weren't just killing non-Christians at Constantinople. Constantinople was the first Christian city, you might be thinking of Acre.
As you may have guessed from my name this a part of time that I find interesting. What?s annoying is finding two sources that agree.
yeah he was pretty darn cool, he wsa one of the few ppl in history to be respected by both sidesWolvaroo post=18.72830.774390 said:
and that scene of him in Kingdom of Heaven where he chopped off the guy's head for getting handed water actually did happen
It was obviously so that 1000 years in the future Creative Assembly could add it into Medieval2: Total War and I could play it and have fun.
Or how about the fact he sent King Richard a basket of Oranges (?) After he was wounded with a crossbow bolt during an attempted siege.cleverlymadeup post=18.72830.775856 said:
Edit: Not sure about this but I think it was his shoulder he got shot through. No positive idea on which though, I'm leaning more towards the left but, I don't know.