The Final Choice In Mass Effect 2 Is Horseshit: A Diatribe

[Looking For Alaska]

Spoilers ahoy, obviously.

On a 1-week rental I managed to play 22 hours of Mass Effect 2. That's 1,320 minutes and about 1,305 of those minutes were pure unadulterated fun. The first five minutes had me scratching my head and wonder why I should be opposed to Cerberus as I had no idea who they were. Then I had 1,300 or so minutes of fun then I reached the end of the game.

Firstly, I fought the ridiculous boss (who I will cover in another post because I can not comprehend why a supremely powerful, cold, uncaring machine race would want to make a human reaper to punch spaceships) with ease through a series of Collector Particle Beam shots and sniper rounds to the face, then I came to the final decision:

Spoiler: The First Decision

Blow up the entire ship because Shepard "Won't sacrifice who s/he is."

This choice is ridiculous, in my opinion. Studying enemy technology so that you can save the goddamn galaxy doesn't require 'sacrificing' who you are. Not studying technology because someone evil used it and it has caused death borders on Dark Ages-esque superstition. Also, there are still Reapers out there so by destroying this and letting nothing good come you are exactly where you were when you started the game. Or, more accurately, ended the first game.

Yet the Bioware writers decided this must be the correct Paragon(read:good) choice and only a strictly Renegade character would not choose it.

Spoiler: The Second Choice

Research and learn from the ship.

The correct choice in my opinion.

As I said, the Reapers did not magically vanish, they are STILL out there. Examining this and hopefully finding a weak-point could be the only chance to truly defeat the Reapers. The main down-side is that Cerberus could use this to make another Reaper, which is virtually a non-problem. Firstly, it is not a simple process, to build the 'human-reaper larva'(ugh) and it would take time to build one. Secondly, Shepard has already defeated one reaper in Mass Effect 1 and destroyed a 'larval(uggghhhh) about 2 minutes ago, without losing anyone on his supposed Suicide Mission. Shepard and co. have proved they can handle 1 Reaper.

I chose this option based on what I've typed above and even Legion (who is my favorite character as he is the only one that seems to never hold the idiot ball) said "This facility is simply data, Shepard-Commander. It has no inherent ethics."
I agree entirely.

But yet this is the supremely evil choice. After you do this every member of your party will disagree and chastise you. Even the murderous convict with tatoos from tit to ass. Even the blood-thirsty Krogan Clone. Even the assassin-for-hire.Even the CERBERUS OPERATIVE.

Because you are inherently evil for studying a way to beat the enemy, even when you could blow up the station at any time should something go wrong.

As if.

The most irritating part is that isn't the black and grey morality you see elsewhere in the game that leads to hard decisions. This isn't even a Black and White/Paragon and Renegade decision. This is a logical/illogical choice. With the palettes switched.

Now tell me I'm right so I feel better about myself.

 

[Irridium]

The ending choice also pissed me off.

Shepard is apparently the only one who can go to and from the base. So why didn't he just tell Cerberus to fuck off, and then fly the council there to prove to them everything Shepard said?

That way he could get everyone on his side, give them a big advantage with the base, and tell Cerberus to go fuck themselves. Which would be the logical choice for my character.

This is why I hate it when games advertise lots of choices. We don't really have many choices, we just have the illusion of choice.

 

[Looking For Alaska]

I hate how in these days "tons of choices" and "multiple endings" means "one good and one evil choice for every situation" and "2 endings"

 

[Negatempest]

There is a very similar forum post on the ME website and might as well post the similar response here. It is true that if we "do" get the base to function for us, we could use the tech against the reapers. But to me there was TOO much of a risk to use it than there was to gain. Let me put in an example from District 9.

Spoiler

In the movie, the main character tampered with an alien object and ended up transforming himself into the alien species.

What I am saying is this, if we "tampered" with Reaper tech, that is VERY well known to randomly produce Husks and brainwash mortals what do you think I would believe a fully functional Reaper tampered base would do to ANY alien species? I did not see it as "loosing myself", I saw it as "I have seen what this tech has done to MULTIPLE people. I am not going to give this tech to have an advanced/special ops organization get brainwashed by Reapers."

P.S. I have no idea how to hide spoilers, so if anyone could give me advice I would be happy.

Edit: Got it done now, thanks for the help everyone.

 

[CoverYourHead]

I agree with you completely, which is why, even though I always play as paragon throughout the game, I take the renegade ending. Every time. I do NOT want to mess with an army of space C'Thulhus without knowing anything about them or any possible weaknesses.

 

[Looking For Alaska]

There is a very similar forum post on the ME website and might as well post the similar response here. It is true that if we "do" get the base to function for us, we could use the tech against the reapers. But to me there was TOO much of a risk to use it than there was to gain. Let me put in an example from District 9.
***************************************Spoiler**********************************************
I the movie, the main character tampered with an alien object and ended up transforming himself into the alien species.
****************************************Spoiler End*****************************************
What I am saying is this, if we "tampered" with Reaper tech, that is VERY well known to randomly produce Husks and brainwash mortals what do you think I would believe a fully functional Reaper tampered base would do to ANY alien species? I did not see it as "loosing myself", I saw it as "I have seen what this tech has done to MULTIPLE people. I am not going to give this tech to have an advanced/special ops organization get brainwashed by Reapers."

P.S. I have no idea how to hide spoilers, so if anyone could give me advice I would be happy.

[ spoiler ] Vader is his father [ /spoiler ]

just take out the spaces.

edit:lmfao at the post above me

 

[Internet Kraken]

Actually, I'd say blowing up the Reaper has perfectly logical choices behind it.

I base this on what Legion and the Geth do; follow their own technological path. They were offered Reaper technology, and they rejected it. I can see plenty of reasons, none of which have to do with ethics, to do so. The main one being that it is Reaper technology. This has shown numerous times to not only backfire, but turn you into a mindless slave in the process. Raper technology is dangerous and uncontrollable. It could very easily be used against you by the creatures that made it. This is why I always blow up the Human Reaper. It's to unpredictable and could easily lead to your demise. A perfectly logical conclusion that has nothing to do with the fact that it was made from a human smoothie. I just wish they had made Shepard's dialogue different so it didn't sound like he was disposing of it just to be a morally good angel.

However, I do agree that every single character berating you for keeping it is stupid, especially since the game is designed so that numerous characters can support keeping it. It's a huge dick move on the part of the writers.

Firstly, I fought the ridiculous boss (who I will cover in another post because I can not comprehend why a supremely powerful, cold, uncaring machine race would want to make a human reaper to punch spaceships)

I'm one of the few insane people who thinks that was actually a good part of the story, for reasons contained within this huge post;

Spoiler: Long and not entirely relevant to this thread

Many people have wondered why the Reapers constantly allow civilizations to build itself up, only to swiftly destroy it. There are many theories as to why. You could think that the Reapers are just using organics as a food source, but arguably there are easier ways to cultivate and sustain organic food than allowing civilizations to constantly evolve and then fall. Rather I think they do it because the Reaper's culture involves preserving the most advanced and valuable species for eternity as Reapers. Reapers are not one single species, but rather a combination of all species ascended into a higher form of life. The best the galaxy has ever produced, all united under one banner.

The Reapers were not just trying to build any ordinary Reaper. They wanted to build a Human Reaper. Not to lead a massive attack against the Citadel, but rather becuase this is the Reaper's culture. They believe Humans are the species with the greatest potential. If they were just trying to build a generic Reaper, they could have used any species. Arguably it would be a lot easier to target something other than human colonies. But they specifically wanted to turn humans into the Reapers. Think about Harbinger's dialogue. He refers to the process of turning humans into genetic paste to fuel the larva's growth as "ascension". Why use that word in particular? Why not call it "assimilation"? Or "consumption"? "Ascension" implies that they are raising humans to be what they consider to be a higher form of life. They see value in humans.

But what about Sovereign? He didn't seem to like organics at all. Why turn them into Reapers. Well I believe that the Reapers may have considered the current organic "crop" to be a failure, not worthy of being turned into Reapers. This could be for a number of reasons. I think it's because the galaxy had a very diverse category of sentient lifeforms, with no one species appearing to be dominant. The Protheans appeared to be the undisputed rulers of the galaxy at the time of their downfall. This is the Reapers idea of the perfect organic race to harvest. One species that follows their predetermined line of technological advancement, rather than a handful of species that all do so at the same time. So the Reapers were all set to just wipe every race out and start from scratch. What changed this? Well humans killed a Reaper. The game often alludes to the idea that by killing a Reaper, we grabbed their attention. To delay the extinction cycle and kill a powerful Reaper in the process would probably interest them. So Harbinger now thinks that humans are worthy of ascension into the ultimate life form.

If you're wondering why they didn't do this to the Protheans, it's because the Prothean Reaper failed. Instead they turned them into the Collectors, so that they would still serve a purpose.

In short; Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength.

In all fairness Cerberus is considered a terrorist group by the alliance/council and they I doubt they would share the technology with anyone else (Being anti-alien and all)

They most certainly won't. If you beat the Reapers and given Cerberus this tech, they will use it to assert humanity (but mainly themselves, since the whole "Cerberus is humanity" thing is complete bullshit) as head honchos of the galaxy. If you use the Reaper tech you're pretty much accepting that as a necessary sacrifice.

 

[Irridium]

There is a very similar forum post on the ME website and might as well post the similar response here. It is true that if we "do" get the base to function for us, we could use the tech against the reapers. But to me there was TOO much of a risk to use it than there was to gain. Let me put in an example from District 9.
***************************************Spoiler**********************************************
In the movie, the main character tampered with an alien object and ended up transforming himself into the alien species.
****************************************Spoiler End*****************************************
What I am saying is this, if we "tampered" with Reaper tech, that is VERY well known to randomly produce Husks and brainwash mortals what do you think I would believe a fully functional Reaper tampered base would do to ANY alien species? I did not see it as "loosing myself", I saw it as "I have seen what this tech has done to MULTIPLE people. I am not going to give this tech to have an advanced/special ops organization get brainwashed by Reapers."

P.S. I have no idea how to hide spoilers, so if anyone could give me advice I would be happy.

For spoilers use (spoiler)(/spoiler) only instead of parenthesis use brackets.

Also, there is one flaw in your argument. Shepard has Legion on his side, and could possibly get the Geth to help him research it. Since Legion himself said the Geth would be willing to fight against the Reapers. And logically you would want any advantage on your enemy that you can get, and since robots tend to think logically (Legion and EDI have helped further this argument through many discussions with them) Shepard could potentially get the Geth to help research the base.

Plus you have EDI and VI's that could be put onto the base to speed up research, keeping organics away. And you can't brainwash robots.

That way organics don't get corrupted, and we get research.

 

[Aeshi]

In all fairness Cerberus is considered a terrorist group by the alliance/council and they I doubt they would share the technology with anyone else (Being anti-alien and all)

 

[Person342]

I found that choice kinda odd too. Though i suppose desroying it eliminates any chance of the reapers capturing it and then turning it on humanity again.

Also the end section where you decide whether or not you want to work with cerberus. I went through the campaign twice and i never found an option to agree with illusive man work and work with him. Without Shepard crying about the soul of the species.

 

[Shockolate]

My only real problem with Mass Effect 2's choice stuff is that I accidentally blew up that Geth base.

I really wish I hadn't, and I didn't mean to! Now I gotta wait until my bro re-rents it so I can play through the entire damn thing again just to fix that problem for Mass Effect 3.

 

[Geo Da Sponge]

Remember when they tried to investigate the Reaper for technology? Remember how well that turned out? I will admit that the reasons given by Shepard for letting the base survive are somewhat bullshit, but there are several good reasons just to destroy the base. Most important of which is that the Reapers could be able to manipulate whatever technology you salvage, as was the case with the Reaper IFF. They were able to remote control the Collectors from outside the galaxy, so I see no reason why they wouldn't be able to do the same with any technology you find on the Collector ship.

 

[Looking For Alaska]

Actually, I'd say blowing up the Reaper has perfectly logical choices behind it.

I base this on what Legion and the Geth do; follow their own technological path. They were offered Reaper technology, and they rejected it. I can see plenty of reasons, none of which have to do with ethics, to do so. The main one being that it is Reaper technology. This has shown numerous times to not only backfire, but turn you into a mindless slave in the process. Raper technology is dangerous and uncontrollable. It could very easily be used against you by the creatures that made it. This is why I always blow up the Human Reaper. It's to unpredictable and could easily lead to your demise. A perfectly logical conclusion that has nothing to do with the fact that it was made from a human smoothie. I just wish they had made Shepard's dialogue different so it didn't sound like he was disposing of it just to be a morally good angel.

However, I do agree that every single character berating you for keeping it is stupid, especially since the game is designed so that numerous characters can support keeping it. It's a huge dick move on the part of the writers.

Firstly, I fought the ridiculous boss (who I will cover in another post because I can not comprehend why a supremely powerful, cold, uncaring machine race would want to make a human reaper to punch spaceships)

I'm one of the few insane people who thinks that was actually a good part of the story, for reasons contained within this huge post;

Spoiler: Long and not entirely relevant to this thread

Many people have wondered why the Reapers constantly allow civilizations to build itself up, only to swiftly destroy it. There are many theories as to why. You could think that the Reapers are just using organics as a food source, but arguably there are easier ways to cultivate and sustain organic food than allowing civilizations to constantly evolve and then fall. Rather I think they do it because the Reaper's culture involves preserving the most advanced and valuable species for eternity as Reapers. Reapers are not one single species, but rather a combination of all species ascended into a higher form of life. The best the galaxy has ever produced, all united under one banner.

The Reapers were not just trying to build any ordinary Reaper. They wanted to build a Human Reaper. Not to lead a massive attack against the Citadel, but rather becuase this is the Reaper's culture. They believe Humans are the species with the greatest potential. If they were just trying to build a generic Reaper, they could have used any species. Arguably it would be a lot easier to target something other than human colonies. But they specifically wanted to turn humans into the Reapers. Think about Harbinger's dialogue. He refers to the process of turning humans into genetic paste to fuel the larva's growth as "ascension". Why use that word in particular? Why not call it "assimilation"? Or "consumption"? "Ascension" implies that they are raising humans to be what they consider to be a higher form of life. They see value in humans.

But what about Sovereign? He didn't seem to like organics at all. Why turn them into Reapers. Well I believe that the Reapers may have considered the current organic "crop" to be a failure, not worthy of being turned into Reapers. This could be for a number of reasons. I think it's because the galaxy had a very diverse category of sentient lifeforms, with no one species appearing to be dominant. The Protheans appeared to be the undisputed rulers of the galaxy at the time of their downfall. This is the Reapers idea of the perfect organic race to harvest. One species that follows their predetermined line of technological advancement, rather than a handful of species that all do so at the same time. So the Reapers were all set to just wipe every race out and start from scratch. What changed this? Well humans killed a Reaper. The game often alludes to the idea that by killing a Reaper, we grabbed their attention. To delay the extinction cycle and kill a powerful Reaper in the process would probably interest them. So Harbinger now thinks that humans are worthy of ascension into the ultimate life form.

If you're wondering why they didn't do this to the Protheans, it's because the Prothean Reaper failed. Instead they turned them into the Collectors, so that they would still serve a purpose.

In short; Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength.

"Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength."

I could be wrong but I believe someone (Mordin or Legion, I think) in one of the conversations that "they have no culture." But maybe he was talking about collectors. Or maybe I have a disease that causes me to imagine facts that make me seem correct, I don't know.

 

[Negatempest]

There is a very similar forum post on the ME website and might as well post the similar response here. It is true that if we "do" get the base to function for us, we could use the tech against the reapers. But to me there was TOO much of a risk to use it than there was to gain. Let me put in an example from District 9.
***************************************Spoiler**********************************************
In the movie, the main character tampered with an alien object and ended up transforming himself into the alien species.
****************************************Spoiler End*****************************************
What I am saying is this, if we "tampered" with Reaper tech, that is VERY well known to randomly produce Husks and brainwash mortals what do you think I would believe a fully functional Reaper tampered base would do to ANY alien species? I did not see it as "loosing myself", I saw it as "I have seen what this tech has done to MULTIPLE people. I am not going to give this tech to have an advanced/special ops organization get brainwashed by Reapers."

P.S. I have no idea how to hide spoilers, so if anyone could give me advice I would be happy.

For spoilers use (spoiler)(/spoiler) only instead of parenthesis use brackets.

Also, there is one flaw in your argument. Shepard has Legion on his side, and could possibly get the Geth to help him research it. Since Legion himself said the Geth would be willing to fight against the Reapers. And logically you would want any advantage on your enemy that you can get, and since robots tend to think logically (Legion and EDI have helped further this argument through many discussions with them) Shepard could potentially get the Geth to help research the base.

Plus you have EDI and VI's that could be put onto the base to speed up research, keeping organics away. And you can't brainwash robots.

That way organics don't get corrupted, and we get research.

Oh yeah, EDI could do it. The very same EDI who didn't notice a virus in the ship until it was too late? I am just saying that brainwashing mortals and making zombies isn't the only thing Reapers do. They have already proven that they have Advanced tech. Remember, this very virus came from a 10+ thousand year old corpse. We are not even talking about how advanced their tech can be now.

 

[Geo Da Sponge]

There is a very similar forum post on the ME website and might as well post the similar response here. It is true that if we "do" get the base to function for us, we could use the tech against the reapers. But to me there was TOO much of a risk to use it than there was to gain. Let me put in an example from District 9.
***************************************Spoiler**********************************************
In the movie, the main character tampered with an alien object and ended up transforming himself into the alien species.
****************************************Spoiler End*****************************************
What I am saying is this, if we "tampered" with Reaper tech, that is VERY well known to randomly produce Husks and brainwash mortals what do you think I would believe a fully functional Reaper tampered base would do to ANY alien species? I did not see it as "loosing myself", I saw it as "I have seen what this tech has done to MULTIPLE people. I am not going to give this tech to have an advanced/special ops organization get brainwashed by Reapers."

P.S. I have no idea how to hide spoilers, so if anyone could give me advice I would be happy.

For spoilers use (spoiler)(/spoiler) only instead of parenthesis use brackets.

Also, there is one flaw in your argument. Shepard has Legion on his side, and could possibly get the Geth to help him research it. Since Legion himself said the Geth would be willing to fight against the Reapers. And logically you would want any advantage on your enemy that you can get, and since robots tend to think logically (Legion and EDI have helped further this argument through many discussions with them) Shepard could potentially get the Geth to help research the base.

Plus you have EDI and VI's that could be put onto the base to speed up research, keeping organics away. And you can't brainwash robots.

That way organics don't get corrupted, and we get research.

If you can't brainwash robots, where did the 'heretic' Geth come from? Since the the Geth were the Reaper's greatest ally in the first game, it seems a bit silly to suggest they can't be controlled (or at least persuaded) by the Reapers.

 

[Tdc2182]

I'd like to think there is no way he managed to kill every single alien enemy thing and how they know absolutely nothing about the part of the galaxy they are in. It would be waaay to dangerous to just leave a reaper ship lying about, because if I remember correctly, a shit load of Reaper ships came out of nowhere in the end.

I hated having to be either Renegade or Paragon. Each choice felt to unbelievable to me. No one goes all good or all bad. I did what I thought best for most of the game, killed the people who deserved it, helped the people who deserved. Last game, I told the council to eff off even thought I knew it would get me nowhere. Both playthroughs.

 

[Necator15]

This is definitely a morally gray choice. You have to bear in mind exactly who you would be giving the base to. If you trust Cerberus, have fun. I personally didn't. The only way I would have kept that base alive would have been to hand it over to the council, or possibly the alliance. Not the people who (Before the conflict started, mind) were experimenting with mind control and the thorian.

It seems like it would be giving a massive bomb to the most xenophobic people you can find, and then casually pointing out where a lot of people they hate hang out. Then giving them a stern warning they shouldn't use it, knowing full well the second that you turn your back there'll be an explosion where you just pointed.

 

[RubyT]

you are exactly where you were when you started the game. Or, more accurately, ended the first game.

This is my big problem with ME2. Nothing really happens. It's like Matrix 2.

At the end of ME1 you had just kicked the proxy race's ass (the Geth) and were now on to kick some reaper butt. Then, instead of letting you do that, ME2 introduced just another proxy race (the Collectors) whose ass you had to kick.

It was basically ME1 with less interesting party members and no plot (9 unrelated crew gathering missions and 9 unrelated personal missions don't count as a plot).

 

[Internet Kraken]

"Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength."

I could be wrong but I believe someone (Mordin or Legion, I think) in one of the conversations that "they have no culture." But maybe he was talking about collectors. Or maybe I have a disease that causes me to imagine facts that make me seem correct, I don't know.

He did say that about the Collectors. I think assuming the same holds true for the Reapers is illogical, since there are many ways they differ from their salves.For example, Collectors don't have emotions, but the Reapers clearly due. My explanation could be completley wrong, but it's one I think could work and I would be satisfied with it, since it explains the larva and also explains why the Reaper preform the galaxy wide harvest.

Now the Council's idiocy is something I can't even think of an explanation for. They piss me off more than every other plot related problem in Mass Effect 2.