The future of comics?

[Fox12]

A few months back I asked for comic suggestions. A few of the things I read were great, some were good, and a lot were bad (I'm looking at you, Mage).

Anyway, when I ventured more into Indie-comics, like what Scott Pilgrim used to be, and Web Comics, I found that they were quite good. To my surprise, web comics sported substantially better writing and art, compared to "industry professionals" who actually get paid for their services. I also find that the stories are more imaginative, and the art styles are far more diverse. The only downside is the inconsistent update schedules.

Everblue:
http://everblue-comic.com/?id=3

Blindsprings:
http://blindsprings.com/comic/000

Gunnerkrigg court (It gets better):
http://www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=1

The Meek (NSFW)
http://www.meekcomic.com/2008/12/27/chapter-1-cover/

What do you think is the reason behind this difference in quality? Do you think that the comic industry has anything to learn from the phenomenon of webcomics? Is this a sign that comics are moving more and more toward digital storytelling? What could this mean for the future of comics? Is this healthy for the industry? Am I just talking out of my ass? I'm curious to hear what you think.

 

[Queen Michael]

When it comes to DC Comics, I think the reason for this is that DC dictates that all their supehero comic artist have to use similar styles. They don't have to be identical, but they can't use more unique styles like, say, Humberto Ramos or Joe Madureira. That stifles creativity.

 

[Baron_BJ]

When it comes to DC Comics, I think the reason for this is that DC dictates that all their supehero comic artist have to use similar styles. They don't have to be identical, but they can't use more unique styles like, say, Humberto Ramos or Joe Madureira. That stifles creativity.

Whilst true, I'd also state that a homogenized style does stop certain problems, for example there's a far lower chance of tonal dissonance with what the writer was intending and allows the company to gauge how quick and of what quality that artist can pump out. Considering how DC is run this makes it much easier for them, does it stifle creativity? Yes, but considering how badly things are run can you imagine how fucking bad things could get if they didn't force this to happen? A lot of problems are coming out of this conveyor belt approach (especially when DC currently has a zero tolerance policy on books being late), but on a managerial level this avoids a lot of problems that come from not giving enough of a shit. It also helps that a lot of comic readers don't want interesting and experimental art, they just want a Jim Lee look-a-like to make superman bench-press the planet (which is disappointing).

A prime example (in my opinion) of tonal dissonance is the work of Humberto Ramos (so glad you mentioned him). Some of his work, like his independant comic "Fairy Quest" is gorgeous, beautiful and appropriate to the tone of the book, but his Spider-Man work over at Marvel is nothing short of fucking hideous garbage; it often doesn't match a lot of the tone of the book (it does on occasion), everything is out of proportion, some things are needlessly flat and shitty, etc. This is a situation where I would greatly prefer some cookie-cutter artist to come in and do the job instead, this is something that DC's current approach allows them to side-step, even if it is at the cost of truly inspiring books coming out.

 

[Vault101]

I'm suspicous of most "self published" stuff..not to say there isn't quality..I'm just selective...plus it seems to me Web comics arent really my thing...I like less "meta" and more "story"

Superhero comics are....their own thing, they have their audience and if you like it then cool

I read anything thats not tied down by a universe or a larger company...which is mostly Image and a few smaller publishers, I have a substantial backlog of stuff too read so theres no worries there

webcomics are good in that they are a place where stuff that wouldn't fit in print (not a comment of quality) can find its audience and I guess the rise of tablets add to their "readability" rather than on a computer screen (though a screen is still a screen..hence why people have e-readers)

the way towards digital is there...mabye one day it wont be the seperation of a comic you read on your computer/tablet and one you buy print...mabye they'll be on the same device

I think if E-ink technology can ever make the jump to color THAT will be very interesting (I'd totally get an e-reader for comics)

A few months back I asked for comic suggestions. A few of the things I read were great, some were good, and a lot were bad (I'm looking at you, Mage).
.

just out of curiosity what was good and what was bad?

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

I can get books and magazines on my phone now on stores like the Google Play store for my Android device (apps store I guess for Apple?) or on my tablet.

Is this something that is on the horizon for comics? I could see it as a viable endeavour for myself then, if I could get say a monthly subscription on my phone, as I can with magazines and just read them on there.

I am just completely out of touch with the scene, so it's just a genuine question that I'm interested in the answer of.

 

[crazygameguy4ever]

I'm not a huge fan of digital comics ( or games or movies or books..)it's not the same as going to my local comic books shop (Fat Cat books) and getting real,physical copies of comics I wanna read.. but that said I do think web comics are better in the sense that they can be about whatever they want, and no one can censor them. they wanna show 3 panels of a naked girl dancing they can do that. they wanna have they're characters constantly swear? they can do that too. web comics aren't held by the rules of the comics code authority and have a lot more freedom then if the same comic was published by say DC or marvel. who would removed major swearing, nudity and anything that might offend others..

web comics will never ( at least in my opinion) be better then physical comics that you can collect and hold in your hands,but there is a place for web comics along side them.

 

[Akiraking]

I don't read a lot of comics but I think you kind of answered your own question. The comic industry sacrifices creativity in art styles so they can meet schedules. Also the reason why web comics can have more amazing story telling is that is their market. I am not putting DC or Marvel down but there is only so complex a story you can tell while still sticking to what the characters are.
I will admit it depends on your opinion of good writing. I found myself very interested in a DC series called Mr. Terrific, apparently it is universally hated even though I found it very well written.
Finally I will also admit that I prefer DC to stick to a uniformed art style as the more over the top art styles make it hard to follow the stories. People would probably say I am boring but I just can't deal with art and text together. The whole point of super creative art is it does not really need words. To overlay a super hero story for instance on top of that type of art just makes it hard to pay attention.

 

[Vault101]

web comics aren't held by the rules of the comics code authority .

umm...I'm pretty sure thats not a thing anymore, I could be wrong (since comics actually have ratings)...but yeah

also non DC/Marvel have NO hesitation to show us sex/disturbing shit 0_0 (and even then....)

 

[Vault101]

I can get books and magazines on my phone now on stores like the Google Play store for my Android device (apps store I guess for Apple?) or on my tablet.

Is this something that is on the horizon for comics? I could see it as a viable endeavour for myself then, if I could get say a monthly subscription on my phone, as I can with magazines and just read them on there.

I am just completely out of touch with the scene, so it's just a genuine question that I'm interested in the answer of.

you could with Comixology but just VERY recently it was bought out by Amazon and it changed...but I think the only difference is payment method (for example I don't have a credit card..cutting apple out of it I can't use their Itunes cards anymore) but yeah they are the major digital store and they have everything

need comic suggestions?

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

I can get books and magazines on my phone now on stores like the Google Play store for my Android device (apps store I guess for Apple?) or on my tablet.

Is this something that is on the horizon for comics? I could see it as a viable endeavour for myself then, if I could get say a monthly subscription on my phone, as I can with magazines and just read them on there.

I am just completely out of touch with the scene, so it's just a genuine question that I'm interested in the answer of.

you could with Comixology but just VERY recently it was bought out by Amazon and it changed...but I think the only difference is payment method (for example I don't have a credit card..cutting apple out of it I can't use their Itunes cards anymore) but yeah they are the major digital store and they have everything

need comic suggestions?

Wow, I just googled this and it seems like a transaction hitting the news less than 24 hours ago!

I don't have a credit card, but I have a debit card for online transactions.

I've never heard of this; does it work on Android and in the UK?

Sure, I haven't read in years so I don't know where I'd start now.

 

[Vault101]

Wow, I just googled this and it seems like a transaction hitting the news less than 24 hours ago!

I don't have a credit card, but I have a debit card for online transactions.

I've never heard of this; does it work on Android and in the UK?

Sure, I haven't read in years so I don't know where I'd start now.

yeah I think it should work with most things...(they have an android app) I'm not sure about the thing with buying through google play but you should be able to buy them anyway buy thr sounds of it...its not like they make it THAT hard I'm just one of those unfortunates for whom its paypal or nothing

I don't read superheros but I've been reading:

Saga (first issue is free definetly check it out)
Revival
Locke & Key (just recently ended)
Sex Criminals (I finished the first volume in one sitting so it really drew me in)
Lazarus
Powers (does have super heros but focuses on the cops)
East of West
Pretty Deadly
Morning Glories

for something a bit older:

Queen and country (not sure if you'd find this one there)
Preacher (one of my favorites)
Transmetropolitan

 

[Verlander]

I don't think they have better writing - mainstream comics normally already have a setting that the story line needs to fit into, or it chooses to commit to a similar setting because that's what sells.

In physical comics there is a great variety of quality depending on the title. I've stopped reading titles because the writing, once great, decreased in quality. I've found myself picking up new titles, or even interest in new publishers, because flicking through books I've seen an increase in quality.

Also... you get what you pay for. Many webcomics are funded by banner ads or similar, and they release a page or strip a week. You get a full comic every month (most comics) when you buy a physical copy. It's how I personally prefer to read, although it doesn't stop me from glancing at webcomics.

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

Wow, I just googled this and it seems like a transaction hitting the news less than 24 hours ago!

I don't have a credit card, but I have a debit card for online transactions.

I've never heard of this; does it work on Android and in the UK?

Sure, I haven't read in years so I don't know where I'd start now.

yeah I think it should work with most things...(they have an android app) I'm not sure about the thing with buying through google play but you should be able to buy them anyway buy thr sounds of it...its not like they make it THAT hard I'm just one of those unfortunates for whom its paypal or nothing

I don't read superheros but I've been reading:

Saga (first issue is free definetly check it out)
Revival
Locke & Key (just recently ended)
Sex Criminals (I finished the first volume in one sitting so it really drew me in)
Lazarus
Powers (does have super heros but focuses on the cops)
East of West
Pretty Deadly
Morning Glories

for something a bit older:

Queen and country (not sure if you'd find this one there)
Preacher (one of my favorites)
Transmetropolitan

The app is definitely there. There are also dedicated ones for DC comics and Marvel comics and the Marvel comics app actually has more downloads than the Comixology standard app.

Thanks for the listing! I think I like the look of Lazarus or Revival. Running theme of bleak futures and apocalypse, what is wrong with me? But seriously, I like anything zombie, so Revival was interesting from the off.

I'll have to take a look when I get home from work, as I need access to my wi-fi and also can't really read comics at work!

 

[Vault101]

Thanks for the listing! I think I like the look of Lazarus or Revival. Running theme of bleak futures and apocalypse, what is wrong with me? But seriously, I like anything zombie, so Revival was interesting from the off.

I'll have to take a look when I get home from work, as I need access to my wi-fi and also can't really read comics at work!

not sure I'd call Revival "zombies" but it is interesting

no worries!

 

[Fox12]

I'm suspicous of most "self published" stuff..not to say there isn't quality..I'm just selective...plus it seems to me Web comics arent really my thing...I like less "meta" and more "story"

Superhero comics are....their own thing, they have their audience and if you like it then cool

I read anything thats not tied down by a universe or a larger company...which is mostly Image and a few smaller publishers, I have a substantial backlog of stuff too read so theres no worries there

webcomics are good in that they are a place where stuff that wouldn't fit in print (not a comment of quality) can find its audience and I guess the rise of tablets add to their "readability" rather than on a computer screen (though a screen is still a screen..hence why people have e-readers)

the way towards digital is there...mabye one day it wont be the seperation of a comic you read on your computer/tablet and one you buy print...mabye they'll be on the same device

I think if E-ink technology can ever make the jump to color THAT will be very interesting (I'd totally get an e-reader for comics)

A few months back I asked for comic suggestions. A few of the things I read were great, some were good, and a lot were bad (I'm looking at you, Mage).
.

just out of curiosity what was good and what was bad?

The Sandman was great, and I loved Scott Pilgrim. So was anything by Alan Moore. Morning Glories seemed like it could be okay. I tried The Dark Knight Returns, and didn't really get what the big deal was. It was definitely a product of the 80's, with its over the top action movie vibe. It seemed pretty average. Saga was okay, from what I read. I hated Fables and most anything super hero related. A lot of the writing seemed pretty bad, with the occasional talent shining through. What would you recommend as far as Indie comics go? I get the feeling that I have rather unusual taste.

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

Thanks for the listing! I think I like the look of Lazarus or Revival. Running theme of bleak futures and apocalypse, what is wrong with me? But seriously, I like anything zombie, so Revival was interesting from the off.

I'll have to take a look when I get home from work, as I need access to my wi-fi and also can't really read comics at work!

not sure I'd call Revival "zombies" but it is interesting

no worries!

I read a synopsis that said the dead were coming back to life?

So not zombified, but they are the same as they were before?

 

[Vault101]

Sandman was great, and I loved Scott Pilgrim. So was anything by Alan Moore. Morning Glories seemed like it could be okay. I tried The Dark Knight Returns, and didn't really get what the big deal was. It was definitely a product of the 80's, with its over the top action movie vibe. It seemed pretty average. Saga was okay, from what I read. I hated Fables and most anything super hero related. A lot of the writing seemed pretty bad, with the occasional talent shining through. What would you recommend as far as Indie comics go? I get the feeling that I have rather unusual taste.

oh thats a shame...Saga's usually my "ace" or whatever you call it

Hmm...well my smallish list is up there..there's probably more but thats what I can remember off the top of my head

I'd also add Y: The last man its an interesting concept but I've never managed to make myself read it

I don't have a problem with superheroes in terms of Quality...they are what they are and there are always standouts (Batwoman was awesome until the creators spat...thats why I'm put off dealing with characters owned by corporations). I just don't like them as a genre and the intangible mess that is continuity and the universes (to some that would be a plus)

 

[Vault101]

I read a synopsis that said the dead were coming back to life?

Correct...one town..on one day (I'm fairly sure)

[quote/]So not zombified, but they are the same as they were before?[/quote]

Well....thats the question isn't it?

[img/]http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130502190021/vampirediaries/images/0/00/Eyebrow_raise_community.gif[/img]

 

[diligentscribbler]

Anyway, when I ventured more into Indie-comicshink.

That's a loaded sentence.

If "web" is your definition of indie you have a way to go, you need to try Pantheon, Self Made Heroes, Oni, First Second, Drawn and Quartely, Fantagraphics and Topshelf as graphic fiction publishers before you're aware of just what this medium's capable of beyond genre offerings, be it super hero, fantasy, sci-fi or noir. These publishers all live beyond the acceptable tastes of the quadruplet of Dark horse, Dc, Marvel and Image which dominate the mainstream.

I love Scott pilgrim, but I looked into your links and "web" and "indie' by your examples seem to imply manga with color and a western inflection.

If there's anything I can say it's go out buy Chris Ware's novel Building Stories(or Jimmy Corigan), it is comics most pure distillation of comics as an inextricably physical medium, web comics have nothing on any of his work neither does the mainstream American or Japanese publishers in either quality or individuality( I could say that of any comics auteur be it Dan Clowes, Bastiene Vives or Marje Satrape)

Craig Thompson (look him up) said "comics are the ultimate auteur medium", and geek culture is utterly blind to that on the web and mainstream level both, but I can't imagine the average geek caring about what a real cartoonist wants to say.

Geeks (or Nerds) just need to get over them self, comics(or games) never belonged to them or anyone any way.

(but i'm drunk and i love comics so...)

 

[Queen Michael]

Powers (does have super heros but focuses on the cops)

This one's really good. The dialogue's top-notch. I just ordered hardback 4 and 5 to have something to read when I'm done with te first three.