The Horus Heresy novels, what do you think of them?

[Yuugasa]

I've been reading through the Horus Heresy novels lately and I've been amused to discover that quite often the Traitor Primarchs have struck me as not only more interesting than the loyalists but, in many cases, more sympathetic.

Fulgrim, Magnus and Lorgar in particular, while deeply flawed creatures, have personalities and worldviews that are actually quite understandable and are, in fact, advantageous to have in the world they live in(even though events have a way of blowing up in their faces).

What do you guys think of the series so far?

 

[Soviet Heavy]

I think it's been going on for far too long, and it's just devolved into more Bolter Porn. The first few books, especially Dan Abnett and Graham McNeil's contributions, were pretty good. But once they decided to drag out every single stupid battle, I lost interest. It will be 2020 before they get around to showing the Siege of Terra.

 

[Realitycrash]

I think it's been going on for far too long, and it's just devolved into more Bolter Porn. The first few books, especially Dan Abnett and Graham McNeil's contributions, were pretty good. But once they decided to drag out every single stupid battle, I lost interest. It will be 2020 before they get around to showing the Siege of Terra.

It's almost as if they were written for a merchandise-driven game were people are expected to by new crap anyway, no matter how poorly designed..

 

[ERaptor]

I never bothered with them. A friend of mine suggested that they drag on too long and withhold the interesting parts so you buy more and more novels. Its not like all GW stuff is allready horribly overpriced, no we definetly need Filler-Novels for another 20 Bucks.

I've been reading through the Horus Heresy novels lately and I've been amused to discover that quite often the Traitor Primarchs have struck me as not only more interesting than the loyalists but, in many cases, more sympathetic.

Fulgrim, Magnus and Lorgar in particular, while deeply flawed creatures, have personalities and worldviews that are actually quite understandable and are, in fact, advantageous to have in the world they live in(even though events have a way of blowing up in their faces).

What do you guys think of the series so far?

I agree. I was allways a bit sad that most Novels focus on the Space Marines, instead of their counterparts. A lot of Chaos Legions would make for very interesting reads, but the only Novels i stumbled upon who actually feature the Bad Boys as the protagonists are the two Nightlord-Novels (And those sadly dont really pray to the ruinous powers, so i guess i wont see much Demon-Action. I only started to read into the first one tough.). Because of that i was tempted to give the Horus Heresy-Series a go, since they feature the fall of the traitor-Primarchs at least. But i know most of their stories trough the Lexicanum, so it wouldnt be _that_ interesting, especially with all the filler-bullsh*t around the good bits.

 

[Dirge Eterna]

I love them honestly, I am on the 23rd book Angel Exterminatus and I enjoy the way they talk about the traits of each primarch. The traitor primarchs except for Magnus and Alpharius/Omegon are fucking crazy, egotistical assholes. Fulgrim wasn't too bad until he was infected with the daemon sword. Curze is a total whack job just like Lorgar, who is a weak willed scumball who can't live without something to worship. They haven't gotten to Mortarion yet so I can only go by the other fluff people have wrote, Angaron is the subject of the next book. While Perturabo seems like a fairly normal guy his inability to know his place in the Imperium is what pushes him over the edge. And of course Horus was brought down by his own hubris and the poison words of Erebus.

I think being that they are based on a war themed game they need to flesh out the battles and go into details of the high's and low's of history.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Reminiscent of the Star Wars prequels.

I gave up after 6 or so HH books, because they didn't seem to be trying. The HH should have been the biggest, most epic thing in 40k...and it really, really was not.

Now, Lord of the Night and Angels of Darkness, those books hinted at the events of the Heresy, and were much, much better at it.

 

[Yuugasa]

I love them honestly, I am on the 23rd book Angel Exterminatus and I enjoy the way they talk about the traits of each primarch. The traitor primarchs except for Magnus and Alpharius/Omegon are fucking crazy, egotistical assholes. Fulgrim wasn't too bad until he was infected with the daemon sword. Curze is a total whack job just like Lorgar, who is a weak willed scumball who can't live without something to worship. They haven't gotten to Mortarion yet so I can only go by the other fluff people have wrote, Angaron is the subject of the next book. While Perturabo seems like a fairly normal guy his inability to know his place in the Imperium is what pushes him over the edge. And of course Horus was brought down by his own hubris and the poison words of Erebus.

I think being that they are based on a war themed game they need to flesh out the battles and go into details of the high's and low's of history.

I think Lorgar is in many ways just the ironic end result of what happens inside a society where atheism and secularism are enforced with violence but the gods are in fact real and hungry for true believers.

Part of the Emperor's problem is that he tried to enforce ignorance in the guise of scientific enlightenment so that when the gods and daemons came aknocking even the Primarchs were completely defenseless against them because they had no idea of what was happening.

Even Horus might not have fallen if he had a better idea of how to deal with Chaos.

As far as Perturabo goes giving someone all the hardest, shittest jobs you have and then when they do an amazing job of it mocking them for the cost seems like a pretty good way to lose employee loyalty, as it were.

I think you'll like the next book, gulliman shows up for the climatic battle and the whole thing is a pretty entertaining mess.

 

[Yuugasa]

I agree. I was allways a bit sad that most Novels focus on the Space Marines, instead of their counterparts. A lot of Chaos Legions would make for very interesting reads, but the only Novels i stumbled upon who actually feature the Bad Boys as the protagonists are the two Nightlord-Novels (And those sadly dont really pray to the ruinous powers, so i guess i wont see much Demon-Action. I only started to read into the first one tough.). Because of that i was tempted to give the Horus Heresy-Series a go, since they feature the fall of the traitor-Primarchs at least. But i know most of their stories trough the Lexicanum, so it wouldnt be _that_ interesting, especially with all the filler-bullsh*t around the good bits.

There is also the Dark Apostle series, that one is based on the Wordbearers and is pretty entertaining, I would recommend it.

 

[Megalodon]

I think Lorgar is in many ways just the ironic end result of what happens inside a society where atheism and secularism are enforced with violence but the gods are in fact real and hungry for true believers.

More like the result of not telling anyone your plan to starve said gods, and being a terrible, terrible father.

Part of the Emperor's problem is that he tried to enforce ignorance in the guise of scientific enlightenment so that when the gods and daemons came aknocking even the Primarchs were completely defenseless against them because they had no idea of what was happening.

It's chiefly the being a bad father thing really, Pertuabo, Angron, Mortarion, Curze, and Lorgar all turn essentially because the Emperor was a dick to them in some way, and so they had resentment that Chaos/Horus exploited. Horus turns because of Lorgar and Erebus. Magnus was plain shafted by Tzeentch, and didn't listen when told that the forbidden stuff was forbidden for a reason. Fulgrim's arrogance was his undoing (side note, I hate the "deamon sword did it" explanation for his fall, far prefer the old "Horus was that good at convincing people" explanation). As for Alpharius/Omegon, my pet theory there is:

Spoiler: Legion Spoilers

The cabal that convinces them to side with Horus are lying (maybe chaotic themselves), and want to sunder the Imperium, whereas leaving the 20th loyal makes the Heresy a lot harder for Horus, and a decisive win easier for the Imperials. Especially given just how OP the Alpha Legion is portrayed with their insane ninja skills.

Without Empy being a dick and humiliting Lorgar, the Word Bearers don't turn, so Horus doesn't get corrupted. With the exception of Fulgrim, the treachery of every Primarch has its roots in either the Emperor being an arse to his sons, or too secretive for his own good.

On topic: I like the books, but I am rather behind now though, last ones I read were A Thousand Sons and Prospero Burns. I really should catch up soon.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Horus turns because of Lorgar and Erebus.

In the book in which Horus turns, though, he just does it for the hell of it. I remember comparing it to that Simpsons episode with the cursed Krusty doll which has the Good/Evil toggle switch.

In regards to Kurze, I always thought it'd be more interesting if he sided with the Emperor. Giving that half the Legions have just turned traitor and killed large amounts of the other half, the Night Haunter's past would likely have been quietly forgotten if he'd done so.

 

[Megalodon]

Horus turns because of Lorgar and Erebus.

In the book in which Horus turns, though, he just does it for the hell of it. I remember comparing it to that Simpsons episode with the cursed Krusty doll which has the Good/Evil toggle switch.

Nope, it's very much all a scheme by Erebus:

Spoiler: False Gods Spoilers

Horus gets seriuosly wounded by an athame (funky sword of super deadliness that Erebus stole form the interex at the nd of Horus Rising) while fighting a corrupted Imperial Govenor. He's on his death bed, and the Son's are mad with grief. Erebus convinces them to take Horus to a Davin seprent lodge, where they can heal him. Which they do, becuase they've just been offered hope for thier idol/father. At the lodge Horus had a psychic hallucination. In the dream he meets Erebus, who is impersonating Hastur Sejanus (one of Horus favourite captains, killed just before the start of Horus Rising). Erebus shows Horus a vision of the future, complete with a Imperial cathedral to the Emperor and the loyal Primarchs. This offends Horus, partly because he doesn't understand why he isn't being honoured alongside this brothers, and partly because this looks like the Emperor has betrayed him, spreading the secular imperial truth while planning to then establish hiself as a God. This also ties in with the feeling that the military and the Legions are being sidelined now the Great Crusade is almost done, with the Legions are unsurprisingly unhaooy about. Magnus joins the vision and tries to talk Horus down, but Horus eventually decides to go with Erebus's plan and lead a revolt to preempt the Emperor's betrayl he now thinks is coming. Erebus them convinces him that the powers of the warp (which the Primarchs are aware of, but don't understand their true nature) can hand him victory in his rebellion. So the Heresy is pretty much 100% the Word Bearers fault.

In regards to Kurze, I always thought it'd be more interesting if he sided with the Emperor. Giving that half the Legions have just turned traitor and killed large amounts of the other half, the Night Haunter's past would likely have been quietly forgotten if he'd done so.

Eh, you could have got some interesting stories out of pretty much any combination of Legions turning/staying loyal. After how Curze was persecuted by his brothers for doing the job thier father asked of him, it would have been a bit of a stretch if he stayed loyal. But you're right, it would make for an interesting alternate.

 

[Smeatza]

I'm a big fan, as some point I'll buy the whole collection of Warhammer 40K novels, not just the Horus Heresy.

In the book in which Horus turns, though, he just does it for the hell of it. I remember comparing it to that Simpsons episode with the cursed Krusty doll which has the Good/Evil toggle switch.

I wouldn't consider

Spoiler

being infected by a chaos virus from a chaos blade and then being manipulated into being taken to a chaos temple for "healing"

as "just for the hell of it."

 

[Lovely Mixture]

I never read past False Gods, but absolutely love Horus Rising. Good characters and an interesting plot, that book was all it took for me to understand why Dan Abnett is so highly regarded.

 

[Scorched_Cascade]

Love them. It's one of my favourite book series. I'm heretical scum though so it might be just because I'm getting characterisation of my favourite Primarchs other than "they're bad, m'kay".

Favourite books/scenes/parts that have made me fanboy squee

Spoiler: slight to moderate spoilers depending on if you know your 40k lore

-"A Thousand Sons/Prospero Burns" - I loved the build up to Magnus' fall. It was a great story about the road to hell being paved with good intentions and the betrayals of friends. The visual imagery when the Wolves are unleashed and Prospero burns...
-Horus <3 my conflicted arrogant scumbag with daddy issues. The third book especially where he's like "Let the galaxy burn!" especially.

-The First Heretic had a really poignant scene where Lorgar is rebuked

Banners are omitted, a legion kneels in the dust
You can not believe what you are hearing, everything is like a strange dream
The one you call father accusing you as he torments you
You victories are empty, you alone have failed, all that you've made is dust under my feet
I need warriors, not priests! I have no need for preachers!

-"Fear to Tread: the Angel Falls" was an excellent book in my opinion, I don't like most of the loyalist Primarchs because they tend to be boy scouts but Space Jesus Sanguinius was really likeable.

-Know No Fear: Battle of Calth" - Speaking of boy scouts, throughout this book I was rooting for the Word Bearers to wipe Calth and the Ultrasmurfs off the map even though I knew what the historical outcome would be. I was surprised just how much Black Library were willing to let their authors fuck with Games Workshop's poster boys.

-All the dramatic irony and foreshadowing in the first three books, the first book especially.

Current annoyances:
-Their insistence in publishing in a new book size 20 books into the series so they can charge an extra £2 or so meaning I cant buy the newer novels as they wont be the same size as my other ones >.>
-Vulkan Lives was a little underwhelming
-Publishing of special, limited edition, limited time short stories that are canon

Edit: Shit, forgot all the stories about Konrad Curze/Night Haunter and Sevator. Those ones are all great too.

 

[Diddy_Mao]

I have the entire series but I've only read up to "A Thousand Sons".

Short answer: They're good. Not great, but like most property based fiction, I don't assume anyone was looking to them to be the next great novel.

Long answer: The opening trilogy is really good. Loken is a good mouthpiece for the storyline and it's always good to see an Astartes who isn't completely fixated on being a living weapon of war. I like the overall themes of brotherhood, fatherhood, family and subsequent betrayal that serves as the central conflict of pretty much every relationship in those books.

I also love any story that can make me sympathize with the villain and for the most part the books that focus on the fall of specific legions tend to do a pretty good job of that.

To be fair there are a few books in the series that, while not bad, don't really stand up to the better books. Battle for the Abyss is an okay story and Tales of Heresy has some good work in it but neither one is particularly memorable.
"Descent of Angels" however sticks out like a sore thumb and doesn't have any business being in the Horus Heresy series at all. It's not a bad book, it just doesn't fit in with the rest of the series.

 

[TimeLord]

I love the books. Every single one. Of course there are ones stronger than others but overall I love them.

I don't even care if we don't get to siege of Terra for years, we all know what happens in the end but we know little of the run up to it.


[HEADING=1]FOR THE EMPEROR![/HEADING]

 

[somonels]

Meh, though I've only read the first one. I often recall the poet's end and some of the other serval characters but the rest of it is highly forgettable.
For me there is more interesting material in rulebooks and wikis. I don't find novelizations do the setting much justice, especially on a faction like SMs who we are all sufficiently familiar with. I might pick up books about the other races at some point.

 

[Katherine Kerensky]

I was quite enjoying the series. Unfortunately, I stopped reading at... A Thousand Sons, I think.
Got a few signed copies of the books as well. My local Forbidden Planet normally sells signed copies of a bunch of books.